Age/Location Correlates to Political Inclination?

[loseyourname]

I'm trying to see if there is any correlation (on this forum, not in general) between geographic location - for US members only - and political leaning. It seems that posters from the south and midwest are predominantly right-leaning republicans, whereas posters from the northeast and from California are predominantly left-wing democrats. Then again, there seems to be an even stronger correlation between age and political inclination. So if you can, just post your age, location (US only please), and political affiliation (if any) along with the way you usually lean. I have no idea if this thread will be of any real use, but I'm curious nonetheless.

I'll start. I'm 23 years old and live in southern California. I am registered as a non-partisan and tend to lean rightward with respect to economic and social welfare issues. I lean leftward primarily with respect to civil liberties and freedom-of-expression issues, and with religious issues.

 

[member 5645]

I'm in a demcrat stronghold and am 21. I am an anomaly I guess, as my politics fall center-right.

Well, let's start to clarify since it has been , correctly, stated that liberal, left, right, conservative have all kinds of meanings.


I typically vote republican, but never a straight ticket. Never will either.

Issues:

Pro Choice, but not anti abortion except late term (with the minute exception of the woman's life being in danger). Basically, I prefer people to look to adoption, but don't support a law stopping someone from an abortion in the first two trimesters.

Against gay marriage, for civil unions. Would be happy with an amendment protecting the states right to choose what they wish to honor.

Against Socialized healthcare, for subsidizing of private entities based on economic need of patient.

For gun control via better registration and closed loopholes, against gun control via outlawing guns based on looks (woohoo to the assault weapons ban)

For tort reform in various forms across the board.

For the signing of a revamped kyoto agreement (ie, one that includes China and other 'developing nations')

The list goes on, but here's a beginning.

 

[Dissident Dan]

Proud, 19-year-old liberal (Dems are too far right on most issues, IMO) who lives in Florida.

 

[selfAdjoint]

70 year old "Scoop Jackson Democrat" (i.e. pro military) in Wisconsin, do-gooder heaven.

 

[Gokul43201]

26 years old, mostly liberal,Ohio - predicted Battleground state for '04, though consistently Republican for the last few.

 

[zk4586]

Western Maryland, Liberal, Democrat (you have to work within the two party system these days if you want to get anywhere)

 

[wasteofo2]

16 year old liberal from a rich suburb of New York City.

 

[russ_watters]

I am a 28 year old moderate republican. Trouble is, I have views on the far right and far left. Pro choice, pro gun control, pro military, pro strong foreign policy, anti socialism. Reconcile that...

 

[wasteofo2]

I am a 28 year old moderate republican. Trouble is, I have views on the far right and far left. Pro choice, pro gun control, pro military, pro strong foreign policy, anti socialism. Reconcile that...

Is being anti-socialist considered far right?

 

[GENIERE]

Retired NJ boy, but have lived in several states and a half year in Germany as my company moved me around. I was extremely liberal when young, even thought communism might work, and voted for JFK and Johnson. JFK was OK but the Johnson experience was enough to convert me. I’ve voted for republicans ever since, growing more conservative by the year. I enjoy collecting social security, most of which is going to a trust fund for the grandkids. I berlieve all politicians holding national office should be conservative. I can abide with moderate Democrats at the state level and could vote for a liberal at the municipal level.

 

[member 5645]

Is being anti-socialist considered far right?

If so, I may have to reconsider my descriptin of center-right

 

[Njorl]

I'm 41 and live in the Maryland suburbs of DC. Compared to people who don't post on the net a lot, I'm a liberal Democrat. Compared to people who do post on the net a lot, I'm just a Democrat. I am most liberal on civil rights issues, just left of center on economic issues.

When someone figures out what conservative and liberal foreign policies are, please tell me. Isolationism and interventionism seem to both be conservative and liberal. Prevailing opinion is that unilateralism is conservative, and multilateralism is liberal. I don't believe it though. Free trade is both liberal and conservative, as is protectionism.

Njorl

 

[selfAdjoint]

I am a 28 year old moderate republican. Trouble is, I have views on the far right and far left. Pro choice, pro gun control, pro military, pro strong foreign policy, anti socialism. Reconcile that...

I track all those opinions except the anti-socialism. I can't stand most marxists, but some of their ideas aren't totally dumb.

On guns my philosphy has two points:
1. Tighten the registration laws, close the gun show loop hole, national gun id database.
2. Concealed carry, no fee nor license, in every state.

This comes from a literal interpretation of the second amendment. First point is the "well regulated militia", second point is "right to keep and bear arms".

 

[russ_watters]

Is being anti-socialist considered far right?

Anti socialism - as in welfare, public housing, social security, medicare, universal healthcare, etc. Yeah, that's right wing.

 

[member 5645]

I've gone back and edited my post to include some examples. I urge you all to do that so we can get a better outlook, rather than labels.

 

[Gokul43201]

Free trade is both liberal and conservative, as is protectionism.

I think the Republicans get to claim free trade as theirs. The idea is very counter-socialist and relies on having minimal control by government.

 

[selfAdjoint]

I think the Republicans get to claim free trade as theirs. The idea is very counter-socialist and relies on having minimal control by government.

Clinton backed NAFTA, Bush laid on protectionist tariffs. You want to reconsider. And it's just a straw man to call anything Democrat "socialist". Clinton defied the New York marxoids, not only on NAFTA but also on welfare reform. He took a lot of flack from the pinks for both of those.

 

[Dissident Dan]

Clinton backed NAFTA, Bush laid on protectionist tariffs. You want to reconsider. And it's just a straw man to call anything Democrat "socialist". Clinton defied the New York marxoids, not only on NAFTA but also on welfare reform. He took a lot of flack from the pinks for both of those.

Oh, don't get me started on NAFTA...and I am no "pink".

 

[the number 42]

I can't recall who said it, but there is probably some truth to the saying that "If you are not a socialist at 20 you have no heart, and if you are still a socialist at 40 you have no brain".

There you go, guys. Anyone I haven't offended there?

 

[Shahil]

I track all those opinions except the anti-socialism. I can't stand most marxists, but some of their ideas aren't totally dumb.

I know I am not American but this point intrigues. Can u explain why please!

I can't recall who said it, but there is probably some truth to the saying that "If you are not a socialist at 20 you have no heart, and if you are still a socialist at 40 you have no brain".

thanks for that! I happen to be in the 20 year old category though a lot of my family members still hold socialist beliefs and they're over 50! Think I need to show them this quote!

 

[loseyourname]

I can't recall who said it, but there is probably some truth to the saying that "If you are not a socialist at 20 you have no heart, and if you are still a socialist at 40 you have no brain".

There you go, guys. Anyone I haven't offended there?

I think you are roughly paraphrasing Winston Churchill.

 

[selfAdjoint]

I think you are roughly paraphrasing Winston Churchill.

Nah, Georges Clemenceau!

Actually that barb has been fathered on every european big name of the early 20th century.

 

[the number 42]

I happen to be in the 20 year old category though a lot of my family members still hold socialist beliefs and they're over 50! Think I need to show them this quote!

Glad to hear they haven't lost their heart, Shahil

Whoever was the originator of the quote, its being causing me some confusion. It seems to suggest a right time for socialism and a right time for capitalism (if capitalism is the opposite of socialism) or at least a right time for not being a socialist. I suppose not being a socialist could mean anything, including not being interested in politics at all. In any case I'd like to add a line:

"... and if you are not apolitical by 60, you have no soul".

Is this just an interesting phrase, or does anyone else think it makes some sort of sense?

 

[Njorl]

"The man who is not a socialist at twenty has no heart, but if he is still a socialist at forty he has no head."
-- Aristide Briand (1862-1932)

Briand was kicked out of the French Socialist party when he was 44.

Briand was French prime minister at various times, and a nobel laureate. Some of you might recognize the name from "The Kellogg-Briand" pact. I think it was the first multilateral arms control agreement, limiting naval strength.

Njorl

 

[selfAdjoint]

Glad to hear they haven't lost their heart, Shahil

Whoever was the originator of the quote, its being causing me some confusion. It seems to suggest a right time for socialism and a right time for capitalism (if capitalism is the opposite of socialism) or at least a right time for not being a socialist. I suppose not being a socialist could mean anything, including not being interested in politics at all. In any case I'd like to add a line:

"... and if you are not apolitical by 60, you have no soul".

Is this just an interesting phrase, or does anyone else think it makes some sort of sense?

The quote (I accept the Briand attribution) says that the inequities of society are sufficient to arouse the passions, and that is what determines the politics of young people, but the answers to the problems are deeper than socialism, which is of greater weight with mature people. This is an appropriate opinion for Briand, who appears to have been a policy wonk. But its resonance with popular thought generalizes it. Any number of small government libertarians testify that they were naive reds in their youth.

 

[Gokul43201]

Whoever was the originator of the quote, its being causing me some confusion. It seems to suggest a right time for socialism and a right time for capitalism (if capitalism is the opposite of socialism) or at least a right time for not being a socialist.

Of course there is ! See Ecclesiastes 3 or alternatively The Byrds' Turn Turn Turn.

 

[motai]

I guess the current Democratic stance would probably parallel FDR's old Reformed Socialistic view of the New Deal, at least when it comes to social welfare and civil liberties.

Im 16 and still not quite the voting age, but I tend to be left on many issues, and right on a few (cant remember) issues.

 

[phreak]

I'm 15 and I live in Indiana.

Indiana and the states surrounding it (most of them anyway) are on the extreme right.

The reason? Religion. The people believe that Bush was sent from God as he has said so many times. It's funny to see the people like this, and the people here are voting more because of morality than for better causes like war.

As you can see, most democratic states are states that aren't too religious (example: California), and the republican states are very religious (excluding a few states such as florida in which it was rigged in 2000 and will probably be rigged in election 2004 also).

I, personally, am on the hard left, and, corresponding with what I said before, am an atheist.

 

[Njorl]

You're also a lot more likely to be on the wrong side of the redistribution of wealth when you're forty.

Njorl

 

[loseyourname]

Any number of small government libertarians testify that they were naive reds in their youth.

I will certainly testify to this, although I'm still pretty young.

 

[the number 42]

"The man who is not a socialist at twenty has no heart, but if he is still a socialist at forty he has no head."
-- Aristide Briand (1862-1932)

The quote ... says that the inequities of society are sufficient to arouse the passions, and that is what determines the politics of young people, but the answers to the problems are deeper than socialism, which is of greater weight with mature people.

I like this interpretation except for two things; it implies that the passions of the young will not be stirred by capitalism, and the minds of the old will not turn to socialist ideas to solve social problems. Neither of these propositions seem more true that their reverse, which makes me think again that the saying may be a triumph of style over substance.

This is an appropriate opinion for Briand, who appears to have been a policy wonk.

(PS What is a 'wonk'? ).

 

[the number 42]

You're also a lot more likely to be on the wrong side of the redistribution of wealth when you're forty.

Astute indeed!

 

[the number 42]

Indiana and the states surrounding it (most of them anyway) are on the extreme right. The people believe that Bush was sent from God as he has said so many times .

At least there is a chance they might crucify him.

As you can see, most democratic states are states that aren't too religious (example: California), and the republican states are very religious (excluding a few states such as florida in which it was rigged in 2000 and will probably be rigged in election 2004 also).

An interesting analysis. Is this widely accepted? Do you think Kerry is trying to grab a few religious votes back by claiming to be a Catholic?

 

[BobG]

"The man who is not a socialist at twenty has no heart, but if he is still a socialist at forty he has no head."
-- Aristide Briand (1862-1932)

Maybe he had kids late. My parents went from extremely conservative to extremely liberal after they finally got the kids out of the house (or did I just go from liberal to conservative).

Current location has little to do with my political beliefs, since I've lived in Kansas, Ohio, Nebraska, and Colorado.

But, considering my current location (Colorado), maybe I'm a soft conservative. At least, I always thought I was a conservative until I moved here found out I'd really been a liberal all those years.

 

[Moonbear]

This is an interesting thread. I actually like the idea of people stating a few of the things they are for/against and seeing how they rate themselves on the left/right scale. I think that self-rating is more likely to reflect the state you live in than where you actually fall on the scale. My own political beliefs haven't changed dramatically over the years, maybe a little, but I used to think I was conservative when I lived in New Jersey, and now that I live in Ohio, I feel like I'm practically a bleeding heart liberal compared to those around me! In reality, I'm independent and have voted pretty equally Republican and Democrat. I think overall I lean slightly left of center.

On some of those big issues:

Pro-choice (that's not pro-abortion...I think abortion should be the absolute last resort, but it should be an option).

Pro-capitalism (or whatever you want to call it...survival of the fittest economics perhaps? :-) In other words, if you work hard or get lucky and stumble upon a great product, good for you if you get rich).

Pro-keeping our noses out of other countries' business (I no longer have a clue whether this is a left or right view...basically, I'm in favor of greater emphasis on domestic policy and a foreign policy where we don't "help" countries that don't ask for help first).

Less government regulation of everything (we already have laws for most things that are important, we don't need more)

Anti-marriage (okay, that's a weird way of saying I'm for gays having the right to get married as long as anyone else can get married, but I don't know what exactly is so special about being married that we have to do it to get an assortment of rights...for example, I'm not married, so that means if something happens to me and I'm unconscious, my "next of kin" get to make all the decisions of what gets done to me...there is nothing I can do to override that and appoint a very close friend who knows me better than my family and who I trust more to make those important decisions and I don't think I should have to marry that person to get that right, and I'm pretty sure his wife doesn't want me marrying him either).

Pro-welfare reform...the kind of reform that gets people off welfare and into jobs, but without leaving them in worse shape than while on welfare. Basically, I believe welfare should be used to supplement a low income to a living wage and should reward those who at least try to get a job, even if it's a minimum wage job rather than punishing them. Reduce but don't cut off benefits when they first get a job until they are stable enough to do without. And if you don't have at least a part-time job or children too young to be in school (you can work part-time while kids are in school), after a certain amount of time to give you a chance to find a job, you don't get welfare. And I think welfare should cover birth control pills. I think people on both the right and left would see this as crazy, but it's my opinion.

In high school, I did earn the label ultra-moderate because I could never choose a side (in politics, I very often think both sides are wrong). I probably have started to lean a tad toward the left since then, but I also have some pretty extreme right views on some issues, so who knows?