Learn to be a Jerk - Desperate for Change

[khemix]

Seriously, this is not a joke. I'm too nice and it gets me nowhere.

Consider this...

The cable guy today knocked down my $2000 flat screen TV. My mom was bitching at him and told him he or his company was going to pay for it. So me and him went outside to discuss it. I could see the guy was sad and that it was an accident, and let's face it - cable guys don't make great money. So I said... "you know what, thanks for the service, and don't worry about it". Instantly he had an evil grin, and I regretted letting him off at that instant. I told my mom what happened, and she slapped me said said I'm a [insert female body part].

Now this isn't the only instance where my niceness screwed me over. I can probably name another dozen cases. I'm the kind of guy who will hold your door open or tell the surgeon not to worry when he screws up. I let a multi-dollar bank off a late payment even though it cost me $200 in lateness... "things happen" i say. I'm just too emotional. I can't have people walk all over me anymore. Girls tell me their life stories but never want to be involved with me, probably because they know I won't be able to stick up for them. So what do I do? Inject myself with testosterone? Do I go to a random bar and get someone to rough me up?

I am desperate

And thanks for reading

no... let's try that again.

Oh you've made it to the end? I'm glad I wasted 5 minutes of your life.

 

[BobG]

Oh you've made it to the end? I'm glad I wasted 5 minutes of your life.

What a jerk! You think anyone is going to help you after that?!

 

[khemix]

What a jerk! You think anyone is going to help you after that?!

If I was like that in real life, then I wouldn't need this thread

 

[Ms Music]

Maybe you let the TECHNICIAN off the hook, but you can still go after the cable company for damages. what they choose to do to the technician is there decision. You decided not to go after him personally is all that I can see.

And from personal experience, you eventually get to a point where you get sick and tired of people using you, and you will quit. Get mad at yourself. And then promise not to let yourself into that situation again. You recognize the behavior patterns, so think through the scenario next time and make sure you don't repeat the pattern again.

 

[Astronuc]

Seriously, this is not a joke. I'm too nice and it gets me nowhere.

Consider this...

The cable guy today knocked down my $2000 flat screen TV. . . .

Ouch!

One needs to be assertive. In this case, don't let the cable guy off. If he broke it, then his employer (and he) are liable for it. Make them pay. Call the cable company service manager, and write a letter, although you should have immediately done it before the cable guy left.


Also, one can be assertive and still be nice.

 

[Chi Meson]

What they said, you jerk! (Is this helping?)

Seriously, re the TV, a discussion between the son and the cable guy is not a release from liability. The worker should be "bonded" which means "it is covered." Don't let it go for too long. If discussion with the company doesn't go anywhere, find a legal service to draft a letter. It may cost $100, but you will get the TV replaced.

As far as being "too nice," I sympathize. Is your nicety also combined with an ironically quick temper? Mine is.

This is me:
nice nice nice nice nice nice nice nice A-HOLE sad nice nice nice nice nice

Things worked out though. I'm 43 and quite happy with things as they have been for the last 20. I honestly think the most important thing I have done along the way is stay in good physical shape. It's my tonic for everything (as regular readers might know): running. ANyone can run, and anyone can get good at it. All of my best friends are also runners. My wife is a runner. I speculate that many sad people out in the world simply do not know they are supposed to be runners. All it takes is good shoes.

Enter as many 5k, 10k, 1/2 marathons as you can, and hang out at the finishline tent, because that is where the other nice people are ( not "at the Gym").

(No I do not get a dollar for every person I convert to running)

Get good shoes.

Out.

 

[SticksandStones]

I disagree Chi, I've met many more nice people at the gym than I have runners!I don't know many runners. :(

 

[montoyas7940]

I told my mom what happened, and she slapped me said said I'm a [insert female body part].

Your mom has ruined you. It is all her fault for beating you down your whole life.

 

[noumed]

Most people take kindness as a form of weakness, but I think it's easier to scorn and scrutinize than to praise someone. I think you did the right thing, there was nothing that cable guy could've done to remedied the situation, it's not like he has $2,000 burning a hole in his pocket. Call the company and be assertive, if they're a good reputable company they should get you a new TV in a heartbeat. I still like to believe that people are inherently good, even though reality might prove me wrong on numerous occasions. Just remember that mean people suck!

Your mom has ruined you. It is all her fault for beating you down your whole life.

 

[Dale]

It's not about being a jerk. You can politely assert your rights. There is no need to get angry or rude in order to make sure that people don't walk all over you. You can have a spine without having a big mouth.

For the TV issue or other similar issues, there is no need to be mean to the poor guy who broke it; insults won't fix your TV. In all your communication remember that the goal is to get your TV fixed, not to get something off your chest, nor to punish anyone. Simply get the guy's name and his supervisor's name and number. Take a photo, call the supervisor, and (most importantly) write a letter documenting all of the facts (including dates) and describing your proposed remedy. Give them a chance to do the right thing. If that doesn't work then take it to the BBB. I have never had that not work.

Oh, write the letter even if the phone call goes well, you need to have a written record in situations like this.

 

[Galileo]

I`m going to take a swing at this. You tell me honestly if the following words ring true or not.

You don't love yourself.
Your self-worth is low and inside you don't really believe you deserve to be treated with respect.
You're a people-pleaser. You try so hard to make people like you. You crave for external validation that you are a good and lovable person, because inside you don't really feel that way about yourself. You are likely to be afraid of conflict and afraid to stand up for yourself and let your voice be heard.

If the situation was reversed, and you were the cable guy and damaged someone else's $2000,- TV, you probably wouldn't expect people to let you off the hook, and if they'd scold you for it, you agree with them and beat yourself up over it. You don't treat yourself with the same kindness as you treat others, because you have no self-respect.The above is either completely off-the-mark or a hard and probably painful truth.
If it is true, rest assured that there is hope, but you HAVE to change the way you see yourself, because it will hurt you, those around you (and, sadly, the woman in your life you love so much if she allows to let you become friends.)

 

[marlon]

I`m going to take a swing at this. You tell me honestly if the following words ring true or not.

You don't love yourself.

How can you say this ?

I know people that love themselves yet they are also very nice to others.

marlon

 

[out of whack]

I'm too nice and it gets me nowhere.

You're not being nice, you're being a push over. Stop being a push over. There, problem solved.

 

[marlon]

You're not being nice, you're being a push over. Stop being a push over. There, problem solved.

Yeah, he is way too "vanilla"

marlon

 

[Moonbear]

You're not being nice, you're being a push over. Stop being a push over. There, problem solved.

I agree. This was my immediate thought on reading the OP. Nice is trying to resolve the damage to the TV without getting the guy's boss involved, or threatening to sue. Being a pushover is what you did of completely letting him off the hook for the repairs. And, in that situation, if you know you cave in too easily, why did you even get involved? You should have just stepped aside while your mother handled it. There's a lot of middle ground between pushover and jerk, and you need to find it.

 

[Galileo]

How can you say this ?

I know people that love themselves yet they are also very nice to others.

marlon

If a nice gesture truly comes from the heart and the other person accepts it, you would not feel like you were 'walked over', taken advantage of, you would not feel regret and there would be no problem. Unfortunately, this is not the case here.
I think khemix isn't truly being himself and expressing his inner-self, out of need for approval and fear of disapproval from others.

I feel this is the case, because I can identify with his stories. I've been there myself, badly, and have gotten out of it.

 

[WarPhalange]

It's not about being a jerk. You can politely assert your rights. There is no need to get angry or rude in order to make sure that people don't walk all over you. You can have a spine without having a big mouth.

Exactly. This also goes with the whole "Women like jerks" thing. No, they don't, they like confidence, and being a jerk makes you appear to have more confidence than being a pansy.

 

[marlon]

If a nice gesture truly comes from the heart and the other person accepts it, you would not feel like you were 'walked over', taken advantage of, you would not feel regret and there would be no problem. Unfortunately, this is not the case here.
I think khemix isn't truly being himself and expressing his inner-self, out of need for approval and fear of disapproval from others.

I feel this is the case, because I can identify with his stories. I've been there myself, badly, and have gotten out of it.

Galileo,

Didn't we once emailed with each other over some QFT stuff ?
Like a few years back...

marlon

 

[waht]

I used to be like that at one point in my life. And boy does it suck. The issue is not about being nice, but as pointed out having no self-respect, and no value.

First you must accept, and let go any events in your life that didn't cultivate self-respect and your values to blossom so to speak.

Once you did that, you have to redevelop them again by accumulating the good feelings of small successes in these fields. Once you build up on this, you should project self-respect subconsciously.

In order to do any of that you have to brake your daily routine ASAP, because your daily routine made you the way you are today.

Start with improving your health. Exercise more and get a better nutrition. (I second running its fun, and burns lots of calories).

Work on better confidence. Strike up a convo with random people. Pick up a book on comedy and humor.

And by the way, no mother should treat you like crap.

 

[Proton Soup]

low testosterone could be a problem. so could high estrogen or prolactin. try going a week without ejaculating and see if it improves your symptoms. testosterone should peak after one week and stay elevated as long as you refrain. no, this is not a joke, i can find the abstract if you're interested.

if estrogen is the problem, an aromatase inhibitor might help. if prolactin, there's a drug for that too. this is where an endocrinologist could help.

 

[Dale]

Nice is trying to resolve the damage to the TV without getting the guy's boss involved

Do you really think so? If it is an expensive TV the guy probably cannot afford to take care of it on his own. The business probably maintains insurance for exactly this purpose, so I think it would be better to get access to that through the boss than to try and get money directly from the employee. He would get chewed out, but in the end it would cost him less.

I guess it would be best to ask his preference, he would know his company's policies. Just (politely) make it clear that he or his company are fixing it.

 

[Moonbear]

Based on the OP's description of his mother's reaction, I wonder if he's overcompensating to try not to be like her. She sounded like quite a jerk over all this to slap him and call him such a derogatory word, and perhaps had skipped the reasonable discussion with the guy and jumped straight to screaming at him too? Maybe he's going to the other extreme to try to smooth over his mother's overreactions?

 

[marlon]

I have always wondered why girls like jerks.

is it because of the high levels of testosterone ?

marlon

 

[Moonbear]

I have always wondered why girls like jerks.

I've always wondered why guys think girls like jerks. Perhaps the low estrogen is affecting their hearing when we keep telling them otherwise?

 

[marlon]

I've always wondered why guys think girls like jerks. Perhaps the low estrogen is affecting their hearing when we keep telling them otherwise?

Moonbear, i love it when you disagree with me...

Could you please elaborate on the correlation between hearing problems and low oestrogen concentrations ?

marlon

 

[Moonbear]

Moonbear, i love it when you disagree with me...

Could you please elaborate on the correlation between hearing problems and low oestrogen concentrations ?

marlon

I don't know if there's really any evidence for it, other than there's a form of estrogen receptor found in the ears of mice...I don't think the function is known, but it made as much sense as the rest of the debate here.

 

[marlon]

I don't know if there's really any evidence for it, other than there's a form of estrogen receptor found in the ears of mice...I don't think the function is known, but it made as much sense as the rest of the debate here.

and real men have indeed lots of oestrogen receptors as well

so WE, as real men = jerks, have high oestrogen concentrations but they do not tend to stay present for a long time.

edit : the oestrogen molecules do not tend to stay for a long time. that's why we need to look for them constantly like vampires looking for blood.

Now, my point makes more sense
marlon

 

[Galileo]

Galileo,

Didn't we once emailed with each other over some QFT stuff ?
Like a few years back...

marlon

Quite possibly. I honestly can't remember though, having been away from PF for a long time.
I have no messages from you in my inbox. But maybe they're gone because it's been so long.

 

[Leah]

Being a jerk is not too pleasing to me. I'd rather have a nice guy figure out the problem. And you do have a problem with the tv repair, so just be nice like you are and allow the company to solve it. As my mother has told me before..you catch more flies with honey than vinegar.

 

[CaptainQuasar]

I do think that there's a kernel of truth to the "women like jerks" thing. It's just that in a relationship with someone who is a complete a▒▒hole there's going to be lots of drama, and drama in a relationship creates emotional investment in it, which makes someone more likely to stay in that relationship. So it's not that women actually find any qualities that make someone a jerk attractive, it's that if (when?) they have the misfortune to fall into a relationship with a jerk the way that he doesn't give a crap about her and treats her poorly resembles in some respects the emotional roller coaster of true romance. Plus, if he's good at "pushing buttons" i.e. manipulating her emotionally he has no scruples to stop him from using that to his maximum advantage.

And on top of that, if you're a teenager everyone you know is essentially insane from hormone poisoning and any drama whatsoever in anyone's life is magnified x10 for no reason. http://www.runemasterstudios.com/graemlins/images/willy_nilly.gif

It's the same reason why "playing hard to get" works for people of either sex. If someone is attracted to you but you're able to keep a poker face and not let them know you're interested back, or if you send the right kind of mixed signals, it keeps them on an emotional roller coaster going back and forth between despair that their attraction / love is unrequited and a thrill when there's some little hint or gesture of interest on your part. All that drama makes them invested in the relationship which keeps their attention and interest going and gives you leverage.

(The problem is that the more that game has been played on someone in the past, usually the less they're willing to put up with it from you. And also if you accidentally do it to someone who's secretly an axe murderer they just kill you.)

⚛​

 

[khemix]

i haven enough self-respect (whatever that really is) and i value myself enough. my mom is not abusive, today i just really pushed her buttons. i don't think i have issues with testosterone because i am quite aggressive otherwise (just not with people, except sometimes family). i think i have enough confidence, i talk to people on the bus all the time about weather and sports.

i don't know if i fear dissaproval, i just really emphasize with whoever i talk and read their emotions. i don't desperately want them to like me, its just that i don't want them feeling down.

What they said, you jerk! (Is this helping?)

As far as being "too nice," I sympathize. Is your nicety also combined with an ironically quick temper? Mine is.

This is me:
nice nice nice nice nice nice nice nice A-HOLE sad nice nice nice nice nice

you're the only one who strikes a chord with me. yeah, i have an ironic quick temper. there will be one day where i treat people like total crap... as if i don't care, then act nice for 2 weeks.

ill try running, but i honestly don't see how it will solve any of my problems.

Being a jerk is not too pleasing to me. I'd rather have a nice guy figure out the problem. And you do have a problem with the tv repair, so just be nice like you are and allow the company to solve it. As my mother has told me before..you catch more flies with honey than vinegar.

i think being a jerk is pleasing actually. i don't mean the kind that gets in your face and talks obnoxiously, but the care free attitude grabs everyones attention. its been my experience that people like jerks, as if they try extra hard to befriend them... and value them more once all the work was put in. i actually tried this out with my friend at work when we were dealing with customers. i pretended to ignore this moderately attractive girl while discussing products and she was talking to me a lot. as soon as i caved in and smiled, telling her i heard everything she said, she was gone.

anyway i don't want to become a complete a-hole, even if it gets me more friends. but i do want to be able to stick up for myself.

 

[montoyas7940]

my mom is not abusive, today i just really pushed her buttons.

Seriously, I thought you were trolling. But if you are sincere you should seek help. Your mother is abusive. Healthy people don't have a slap me button.

 

[CaptainQuasar]

my mom is not abusive, today i just really pushed her buttons.

Actually, if someone hits you and calls you a name like that over a television, or over anything else really, yeah, that's abusive. Not, like, the FBI has to be sent into your town to take every child into custody kind of abusive as in the FLDS church in Texas, but that specific event is an abusive incident. I mean you would never do that to someone else, would you? Perhaps part of the reason why you're attentive to the feelings of others is that you feel as though sometimes your mom is not attentive to your feelings.

But it sounds to me as though, separate from anything having to do with attending to other people's feelings, you have issues with being too timid. I have some timidity in my nature as well and I'd say that some of the best things that have helped me to overcome that have been cases when I've had a stupid, short-tempered boss who I've gotten into a shouting match with when I'm certain he's treating me unfairly (I've had the misfortune to have several bosses like this.) But unfortunately, I can't think of any way to reproduce that kind of experience on purpose.

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[Proton Soup]

i don't know guys, maybe this is just passive aggressive behaviour against the mom. going behind her back and trying to let the guy off for destroying her property... that's kind of a jerk thing to do when looked at from her perspective.

 

[bassplayer142]

Redemption time. Call the company and say that the guy knocked over your tv. The only way to be a jerk is to do it now and not get screwed out of 2000$!