Strange white flash in dark room.

[felixwatts]

Hi,

Last night my girlfriend and I were lying in bed talking. We were facing each other and our faces were about 1m apart. The room was dark. Suddenly we both jumped because we experienced a very short lived but bright flash of white light that seemed to emanate from a point about 50cm above the bed, directly between us. I saw it as a point but she described it as a streak. There is no doubt that we both saw something, our reactions were simultaneous. The weather outside was calm, the curtains were closed, neither of us was moving, in case you're thinking nylon sparks, and anyway - the light seemed to come from thin air.

She believes in ghosts and what-not and got a bit scared, so I'd appreciate a rational explanation if anyone can come up with one. I was thinking along the lines of a high energy particle from the sun colliding with an atom in our bedroom and producing a cascade of photons and other stuff. Is this feasible? What about spontaneous fusion or fission or something? Obviously I don't know much about physics, so thought you guys could help?

On a related note: Sometimes when I'm in bed in the dark and the quietness is punctuated by a loud unexpected sound, I experience a bright flash as I hear the sound. Has anyone else experienced this? Presumably its some artifact of sudden neural activity or blood pressure change?

Thanks for any replies,
felix

 

[ideasrule]

Seriously, how does a tiny, brief spark even remotely resemble a ghost? We don't know what you two saw; as of now, the phenomenon is unexplained. That's a good thing; mysteries provide an opportunity for revolutionary scientific discoveries and shouldn't be dismissed outright.

Being afraid of the unknown is no problem, but believing in made-up stuff like ghosts is. If everyone attributed unexplained phenomena to ghosts, demons, gods, or other figments of the human imagination, we'd still be in the dark ages.

 

[junglebeast]

A white ceiling is a highly reflective of light. This could have been the result of a camera flash, headlights, or a distant lightning strike that reflected off the ceiling.

 

[Kronos5253]

but believing in made-up stuff like ghosts is.

That's an opinion, not a fact. Just keep that in mind.

If you can believe the universe is everything expanding into nothing, then I'm sure believing in ghosts isn't too far fetched.

 

[leroyjenkens]

Only thing I hate is when people believe in ghosts without actually witnessing one first. And people who immediately say something unexplained is a ghost. The least they could do is go through possible explanations first, instead of automatically concluding it's a ghost.

On a related note: Sometimes when I'm in bed in the dark and the quietness is punctuated by a loud unexpected sound, I experience a bright flash as I hear the sound. Has anyone else experienced this? Presumably its some artifact of sudden neural activity or blood pressure change?

Only flash of light I've seen is when I used to roll off my bed in the middle of the night. I'd sometimes wake up on the ground, never having felt the impact. But sometimes I'd be sleeping, then see a flash of light as I hit the ground, and get that funny smell in my nose when I get hit or fall down hard.

 

[negitron]

If you can believe the universe is everything expanding into nothing, then I'm sure believing in ghosts isn't too far fetched.

We have good, replicated empirical evidence for the one. We have none for the other.

 

[ideasrule]

That's an opinion, not a fact. Just keep that in mind.

If you can believe the universe is everything expanding into nothing, then I'm sure believing in ghosts isn't too far fetched.

I'll believe in fairies, flying pigs, and talking cosmic rays the day I see evidence of one. I have no problem with changing my "opinion" of what exists and what doesn't if new evidence arrives. What I don't do is believe in what other people made up but have absolutely no justification for. If you seriously think a bright white spark looks even remotely resembles a ghost, I don't know what to say.

Who told you I believe the universe is expanding into nothing? To quote a fellow PF'er, "your knowledge of modern cosmology is astounding." I suggest you read up on Hubble's discoveries and general relativity before making grandiose statements like "I'm sure believing in ghosts isn't too far fetched".

 

[felixwatts]

"The least they could do is go through possible explanations first, instead of automatically concluding it's a ghost."

That's what we're doing.

Light reflecting off the ceiling does seem like a plausible solution, at the time it REALLY seemed like a distinct, isolated point of light close to my head, but it was so brief that there may have been an element of illusion.

Still, I do wonder about freak occurrences. Perhaps a speck of air just happened to heat up to a billion degrees. Unlikely but a nice thought.

 

[leroyjenkens]

If you seriously think a bright white spark looks even remotely resembles a ghost, I don't know what to say.

Well what does a ghost look like?

Light reflecting off the ceiling does seem like a plausible solution, at the time it REALLY seemed like a distinct, isolated point of light close to my head, but it was so brief that there may have been an element of illusion.

Yeah, not saying you did that, just saying some people do do that.

 

[Evo]

We have had several very credible members here report something similar. Perhaps they will see your thread and comment.

 

[Kronos5253]

I'll believe in fairies, flying pigs, and talking cosmic rays the day I see evidence of one. I have no problem with changing my "opinion" of what exists and what doesn't if new evidence arrives. What I don't do is believe in what other people made up but have absolutely no justification for. If you seriously think a bright white spark looks even remotely resembles a ghost, I don't know what to say.

I can agree with that.. I never claimed that I believe that a white spark resembles a ghost. My problem is people throwing out "ridiculous" ideas without giving them merit and doing their own research first. Which I am by no means saying that you haven't, because I have no idea.

Who told you I believe the universe is expanding into nothing? To quote a fellow PF'er, "your knowledge of modern cosmology is astounding." I suggest you read up on Hubble's discoveries and general relativity before making grandiose statements like "I'm sure believing in ghosts isn't too far fetched".

A fairy told me... Haha just kidding.. I apologize for thinking that you believe in that. And I have read up on Hubble's discoveries and general relativity. Otherwise I wouldn't belong to this forums lol But I've also done plenty of research on the "supernatural". But you won't believe it until you see for yourself. I didn't.

 

[Evo]

Let's keep the discussion to what might have occurred please.

 

[Kronos5253]

Well.. The fact that you both experienced it means that most likely it's not something like sudden neural activity or an increase in blood pressure, unless you both just so happened to have that happen independently at the same time. That's very unlikely, but plausible I guess haha.

That means it's more likely something external. Are there mirrors in the room? Anything hanging on/from the ceiling? Even if not, like aforementioned, a white ceiling is highly reflective, and since it was a dark room and a very short occurance, the distance it was from you may have been thrown off.

Even if the curtains were closed, if there was a slight draft it may have parted them some and allowed whatever created the light from outside (if that was the case) for that split second to occur.

 

[ideasrule]

I can agree with that.. I never claimed that I believe that a white spark resembles a ghost. My problem is people throwing out "ridiculous" ideas without giving them merit and doing their own research first. Which I am by no means saying that you haven't, because I have no idea.

Oh, I wasn't dismissing the idea of a ghost because it sounds ridiculous, but because a nearly-instantaneous white spark looks nothing like what logic or other people's observations suggest ghosts might look like.

A fairy told me... Haha just kidding.. I apologize for thinking that you believe in that. And I have read up on Hubble's discoveries and general relativity. Otherwise I wouldn't belong to this forums lol But I've also done plenty of research on the "supernatural". But you won't believe it until you see for yourself. I didn't.

I do believe in the "supernatural", if you mean events that can't yet be explained. However, because they can't yet be explained, saying they're due to ghosts, aliens, or anything else is obviously illogical.

I absolutely love unsolved mysteries, just not far-fetched explanations of them. Can you please share your experiences with us?

 

[Chi Meson]

Well.. The fact that you both experienced it means that most likely it's not something like sudden neural activity or an increase in blood pressure, unless you both just so happened to have that happen independently at the same time. That's very unlikely, but plausible I guess haha.

That means it's more likely something external. Are there mirrors in the room? Anything hanging on/from the ceiling? Even if not, like aforementioned, a white ceiling is highly reflective, and since it was a dark room and a very short occurance, the distance it was from you may have been thrown off.

Even if the curtains were closed, if there was a slight draft it may have parted them some and allowed whatever created the light from outside (if that was the case) for that split second to occur.

I was just about to make all of those points.

Could it have been as mundane as a firefly (or other flashing bug)?

A few clarifying questions: how dark was it in the room, and how dark was it outside?
Do you live near traffic; have you ever noticed light from car headlights coming from the driveway, or a neighbor's driveway, shining into your room; when your curtains are closed, are they completely closed, as in "light-proof"; was there any noise at all, as in a "fizz" or "pop" sound; are you certain your reactions were simultaneous, or was there a tiny lag between one or the other of you reacting to it; what was the first reaction from each of you?

I can't tell you how impressed I am with your patience and expectation to find a logical explanation for this. Welcome aboard with the elite few: the rational people. Chalking everything you don't immediately understand down to ghosts and angels and aliens is so simple and simplistic. Knee-jerk reactions like that have held back progress for centuries.

Be aware that it still can be an unexplained phenomenon, yet still that doesn't make it proof of anything paranormal.

 

[Kronos5253]

Can you please share your experiences with us?

Just as a quick aside:

Took a walk in Gettysburg about 2 or 3 years ago with a few friends on a random day through the week. We didn't want all the crowds and all of the tours and everything to be going on, cause you can take your time and enjoy it more IMO.

We were walking through the fields and they had an awesome re-enactment going on. Looked spot-on from the era, people falling off of horse back.. It was pretty awesome.

We ended up rounding our way back to the gift shop and I mentioned how good the re-enactment was today. He looked kinda confused and said there wasn't one scheduled for today. I didn't believe him, being a practical joker myself, so I told him so and asked to see the schedule for the re-enactments, and nothing was on that day.

Still gives me goosebumps thinking about it today..

I was just about to make all of those points.

Haha beat-cha to it...

But the firefly is good.. I didn't think of that.. They tend to be more yellow-ish though.

 

[Pinu7]

A possible explanation: There is a truck outside passing by with it's headlights on. You and your girl's eyes are a bit too moist, so you can't discern the origin of the light. Therefore, you two assume it is directly in front of you.

We have good, replicated empirical evidence for the one. We have none for the other.

Except for personal experiences. If his girlfriend had an unlikely experience with a ghost(for example, a white figure resembling a dead relative appearing to her and then disappearing.) it would be completely reasonable for her to believe in ghosts.

If she, and this most likely the case, believes in ghosts from watching a little to much horror movies, then it would be a bit silly.

 

[robertm]

I second the possibility of a firefly, It being peak mating season during the summer, they are out in force.

Being in a dark room for any amount of time can drastically change ones perception of color, i.e. green/yellow tinted light might appear white in an instant. A moving insect would also explain your lady friend seeing a trail, while you saw a point.

What action did you take after the event? Did you wait in the dark to see if the flash would repeat? Did you immediately turn on the lights?

What was your guy's physical and mental conditions leading up to the event? Was the room a familiar/comfortable one? Where you listening to music at the time? Have either of you had experiences with psychoactive substances? Your previous experiences with minor synesthesia is also an interesting possibility, ask your partner if she has had similar blending of the senses before.

How effectively did your blinds/window shade shut out light? What is in the immediate vicinity of your window/s? Any light sources from other areas inside the house? What reflective surfaces are in the room, how are they arranged? Chi had some good questions as well.

If you are seriously interested, it seems to me that you have a fair chance in at least ruling out some possibilities.

But remember, If ever the laws of nature seem to have been suspended or bended for your viewing pleasure, ask your self which is more likely: that the normal workings of the universe have skipped a beat, or that you are under a misinterpretation.

 

[negitron]

Except for personal experiences.

There's no "except" about it. Personal experience is NOT replicable, objective data. No matter how much you might want it to be. It is unreasonable to base a belief on nothing more than one's personal experience because human perception is not to be trusted. Ask any prosecutor.

 

[ideasrule]

A firefly is possible, but the ones I've seen always glow for much longer than a split second. I've no idea whether this is true for all firefly species, though.

 

[fleem]

Suddenly we both jumped because we experienced a very short lived but bright flash of white light that seemed to emanate from a point about 50cm above the bed, directly between us. I saw it as a point but she described it as a streak.

Do you have any fluorescent lights in the room? If so, it might have been a pulse from a distant lightning strike, or a spike from a breaker flipping somewhere.

On a related note: Sometimes when I'm in bed in the dark and the quietness is punctuated by a loud unexpected sound, I experience a bright flash as I hear the sound. Has anyone else experienced this? Presumably its some artifact of sudden neural activity or blood pressure change?

Yep. Been there, done that. Mine is a flash of a blue splotch about 40 degrees across my center of vision and with a handful of whitish speckles. It lasts maybe 80ms. It happens when I'm resting in a dark room with my eyes shut--usually when I'm half asleep,and there is a sudden noise. The noise doesn't have to be that loud, just loud enough to startle me. I think its simply the sudden neural activity causes a bit of crosstalk in my visual cortex. Sorta like a micro-seizure (not enough feedback to sustain an oscillation, fortunately).

 

[Leah]

I had an unexplained event happen too when I was about 13 years old. My stepsister and I were looking out the window of our second story bedroom at night and saw a glowball hovering over the ground. I said, "What the hell is that?" "It's coming over here". My stepsister fell to the ground and I looked back at her and then back out the window and saw nothing until this glowball creaped up from the window below to be facing me. I looked into it and it went on forever. There was no concrete object to fix your eyes on. I then felt 3 thumps inside my chest, each one harder than the one before. I got spooked and decided to wave at it and say "hi". When I did that, it tore out of my chest and flew across the street over a house top. I felt great sorrow and violated. My stepsister til this day says she saw it hovering in the yard. Pretty weird!

 

[junglebeast]

I had an unexplained event happen too when I was about 13 years old. My stepsister and I were looking out the window of our second story bedroom at night and saw a glowball hovering over the ground. I said, "What the hell is that?" "It's coming over here". My stepsister fell to the ground and I looked back at her and then back out the window and saw nothing until this glowball creaped up from the window below to be facing me. I looked into it and it went on forever. There was no concrete object to fix your eyes on. I then felt 3 thumps inside my chest, each one harder than the one before. I got spooked and decided to wave at it and say "hi". When I did that, it tore out of my chest and flew across the street over a house top. I felt great sorrow and violated. My stepsister til this day says she saw it hovering in the yard. Pretty weird!

It's unfortunate that you have this memory, because I don't think anyone in their right mind would believe this was an accurately perceived and recalled event.

My explanation:

http://psychcentral.com/news/2009/01/29/study-confirms-memories-change-over-time/3765.html

And

http://books.google.com/books?id=6F...ndjMAg&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=2

 

[Leah]

I guess that is why it is unexplained. I swear it happened.

 

[junglebeast]

I guess that is why it is unexplained. I swear it happened.

I believe you are telling the truth, but of the three alternatives I see...

A) You have discovered something unknown to science and the rest of the world

B) Your memory is incorrect. Memory is known to change incorrectly over time to make embellishments, block out painful events, or simply due to lack of use.

C) Your perception of the event as a 13 year old girl was incorrect. People often think that they see something which they don't really see. Perhaps you saw a light or a reflection, and the thumps in your chest where your heart beating due to your fear.

I find some combination of the last 2 to be the more believable.

 

[ideasrule]

I had an unexplained event happen too when I was about 13 years old. My stepsister and I were looking out the window of our second story bedroom at night and saw a glowball hovering over the ground. I said, "What the hell is that?" "It's coming over here". My stepsister fell to the ground and I looked back at her and then back out the window and saw nothing until this glowball creaped up from the window below to be facing me. I looked into it and it went on forever. There was no concrete object to fix your eyes on. I then felt 3 thumps inside my chest, each one harder than the one before. I got spooked and decided to wave at it and say "hi". When I did that, it tore out of my chest and flew across the street over a house top. I felt great sorrow and violated. My stepsister til this day says she saw it hovering in the yard. Pretty weird!

If both you and your sister saw a glowing ball, there probably was a glowing ball, but you say it went into you and then flew out of your chest? Did your stepsister see this?

 

[fleem]

Although its certainly true there are a lot of people hallucinating and dreaming out there, the shear magnitude and consistency (in certain areas) of reported supernatural events makes it unscientific to be completely convinced there is nothing to any of it. Near-death experiences (NDEs) are the prime example, in my mind, for several reasons. The majority of NDEs have several unique attributes in common. Most everyone at least knows somebody who knows somebody that had one (my father had one), and some reports include events witnessed by others proving, at least as far as their witness goes, that the out-of-body part of the NDE really happened (like a patient describing the contents of a room he never entered, etc.).

I'm not saying scientists must therefore believe completely in NDEs. But I am saying it is grossly unscientific for someone to insist he knows that there is nothing to any of it.

Once two guys in a boat saved me from drowning, and about eight people, including myself, saw those two, after they brought me to shore in a boat, disappear. I was standing about one foot from the boat when it happened, and the others were about 40 feet away. It was a clear calm sunny day. I tell you this not so much because I think you'll believe it, I know you probably won't. But I tell you because I am obliged to tell you so that I can't be accused of hiding valuable info--its up to me to bring the message, its up to you to accept or reject it.

I've often thought about why there are only certain physical laws, and pondered our discovery of them. It seems to me that Occam's razor tells us that the two simplest possibilities are that ALL rules are true or that NO rules are true. Not just some/i] rules are true. Or at least that ALL non-paradoxical rules are true. So I wonder if the universe is actually simply the set of ALL POSSIBLE non-paradoxical rules. If that's the case, then there are quite a few non-paradoxical rules we haven't yet noticed.

 

[negitron]

The majority of NDEs have several unique attributes in common. Most everyone at least knows somebody who knows somebody that had one (my father had one), and some reports include events witnessed by others proving, at least as far as their witness goes, that the out-of-body part of the NDE really happened (like a patient describing the contents of a room he never entered, etc.).

Nevertheless, I'm not aware of anything probative in this regard. The plural of data is not anecdote.

 

[junglebeast]

Near-death experiences (NDEs) are the prime example, in my mind, for several reasons. The majority of NDEs have several unique attributes in common. ...I'm not saying scientists must therefore believe completely in NDEs. But I am saying it is grossly unscientific for someone to insist he knows that there is nothing to any of it.

It is known that "NDE's" are caused by lack of oxygen to the brain which cause hallucination. NDE's can be reliably reproduced in the laboratory using research centrifuges...the ones that they use to train astronauts and pilots.

 

[Chi Meson]

I've often thought about why there are only certain physical laws, and pondered our discovery of them. It seems to me that Occam's razor tells us that the two simplest possibilities are that ALL rules are true or that NO rules are true.

That is NOT "Occam's razor," that is a "false dichotomy."

 

[negitron]

It is known that "NDE's" are caused by lack of oxygen to the brain which cause hallucination. NDE's can be reliably reproduced in the laboratory using research centrifuges...the ones that they use to train astronauts and pilots.

They can be induced electrically and chemically, as well.

 

[leroyjenkens]

I hate it when someone tells a story that you KNOW isn't true, but for some reason it's not very socially acceptable to just say "you're lying, that never happened". You're supposed to actually entertain the bogus story as if you think it's possible.
"Oh really, then fireballs shot out of his eyes and he flew away? Everyone saw it? That's weird."

I had a friend who had no problem straight up telling somebody that the story they just told is a lie and it never happened. But it kinda made everyone uncomfortable when he did that. It caused a sort of negative vibe for a while everytime he did that.
He also had no problem turning to stranger and telling them to be quiet in a movie theater. It was pretty amazing.

 

[fleem]

That is NOT "Occam's razor," that is a "false dichotomy."

If there is a limit to the number of non-paradoxical rules in the universe, then there must be some mechanism imposing that limit. If there is no limit, then no mechanism need be explained. You are claiming there is an extra mechanism, yet offering no explanation. That is a case for Occam's razor.

 

[fleem]

They can be induced electrically and chemically, as well.

What's you point? That the fact that they can be induced proves there cannot be anything surprising about them?

 

[negitron]

What's you point? That the fact that they can be induced proves there cannot be anything surprising about them?

No. The point is the fact that they can be induced indicates they are most likely somatic in origin. And not, therefore, some mystical state of living after death.

Also look up Occam's Razor. You are incorrect as to its meaning.