The Truth about 911 gutting the disinformation, LETS GET IT ON

[Sub-Zer0]

The Truth about 911 gutting the disinformation, LETS GET IT ON!

This is to all of the people who still believe 9/11 was the work of 19 Arabic Hijackers and an operation entirely masterminded by Osama Bin Laden, mainly because he hates our freedom’s and disagrees with American Liberalism. Despite all of their hard work, the United States Government simply could not see the attack coming.

When one considers all of the hardcore facts, there is no way this excuse holds even a grain of truth in it. The official story is impossible and simply does not stand up to scrutiny. Even more laughable is the excuse given by government officials that it was simply a "failure of intelligence" and the attack could not be averted. Politicians should not even form their mouths to even use an incompetence excuse. Warnings were received by the US by at least 18 other countries, and agents in the CIA, and the FBI were warned. The FAA got warnings too. In fact,

Prior Knowledge:

CIA had high-jacker details
Taliban warned the US of huge attack
FBI warned of plot to high-jack planes in 1995
http://www.thedossier.ukonline.co.uk/Web%20Pages/FOX%20NEWS_FBI%20Agent%20Warned%20of%20Suspicious%20Flight%20Students%20Last%20Summer.html
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,47133,00.html
http://www.thedossier.ukonline.co.uk/Web%20Pages/MSNBC_The%20airlift%20of%20evil.htm
Threat of US attacks passed Taliban weeks before the attacks
http://www.thedossier.ukonline.co.uk/Web%20Pages/NEWS%20DAY_US%20Clamps%20Secrecy%20on%20Warnings%20Before%209-11.htm


It seems that there were so many warnings, that


"The information provided by European intelligence services prior to 9/11 was so extensive that it is no longer possible for either the CIA or FBI to assert a defence of incompetence." Micheal Meacher, Tony Blairs former environmental advisor until 2003. London Guardian

In addition to these Government officials and other people received individuals warnings as well. Mayor Willie Brown of San Francisco was warned a full eight hours before the attack not to fly on 911, author Salmon Rushdie was publicly banned from flying before 911, and John Ashcroft former Attorney General stopped flying commercially six months before 911. Even some people working inside of the towers got instant messages, telling them to evacuate the WTC.

We must ask ourselves, where did all this prior knowledge come from, and why was it all ignored? Is it possible for that this much information of this magnitude of importance to get tangled up in a beaurecratic web of telephone lines? The answer is NO, people in side of the Trade Towers got INSTANT MESSAGES telling them the buildings were going to be destroyed two hours before it happened. You’re going to tell me someone can get an INSTANT MESSAGE to someone inside the World Trade Center two hours before the attack, but no one can get the message to the President of the United States? Impossible, this is the equivalent to saying people who work in the WTC has access to better intelligence than the president does. Someone calls up calls Mayor Willie Brown eight hours before the attack, and tells him not to fly, BUT THEY CAN'T CONTACT THE AIR TRAFFIC CONTROLERS AND WARN THEM AHEAD OF TIME?!??!

Sources:

Odigo Says Workers Were Warned of the Attack
http://www.sfgate.com/today/0912_chron_mnreport.shtml
http://www.thetruthseeker.co.uk/article.asp?ID=1000
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2001/07/26/national/main303601.shtml


In addition there are over 600 smoking gun holes and unanswered questions in the official story of 911; I'm only going to scratch the surface, w/ some of the main ones.

First thing is the NORAD stand down order.

"The first hijacking was suspected at not later than 8.20am, and the last hijacked aircraft crashed in Pennsylvania at 10.06 am. Not a single fighter plane was scrambled to investigate from the US Andrews air force base, just 10 miles from Washington DC, until after the third plane had hit the Pentagon at 9.38 am. Why not? There were standard FAA intercept procedures for hijacked aircraft before 9/11. Between September 2000 and June 2001 the US military launched fighter aircraft on 67 occasions to chase suspicious aircraft" (AP, August 13 2002)
guardian, once again

NORAD completely stood down, this is a clear violation of FAA flight regulations, and NORAD could have probably stopped the attack, at least partially. The morning of 911 NORAD was training in a war game of flying hijacked aircrafts into buildings ON the Morning of 911. On the Morning of 911? Yep, the drill stopped just 50 minutes before the Hi-Jacking began. No wonder there was no Military Response, NORAD was told that the planes being Hijacked were just part of a drill. That's why they stood down.

What are the chances of this happening? It's just a coincidence that they were running a war-game drill, mirroring the same monumental event to be documented in history books for centuries? Of course it’s possible, but very unlikely.

This is so weird to have happened, and even weirder is the fact that this type of a war-game is going on the morning of 911. This type of event would be similar to seeing Oswald and the CIA training how to kill Kennedy in Dealy Plaza an hour before it happened.

http://www.thedossier.ukonline.co.uk/Web%20Pages/YAHOO%20NEWS_Agency%20planned%20exercise%20on%20Sept%2011%20built%20around%20a%20plane%20crashing%20into%20a%20building.htm
USA Today - NORAD has drills to use jets as weapons
Associated Press - Exercise built around crashing planes into buildings



In addition, the list of the 19 hijackers and their picture identification was assembled and aired just hours after the attack. How do we jump to the accusations that 19 suspects are guilty of 3,000 American murders when most, if not all of the evidence, is twisted metal and degenerated ashes that used to be people? Actually by the time the hijackers had their mug shots aired on TV, all of the crime scenes had been destroyed. Buildings one and two collapsed, as well as the mysterious building seven collapsing on its own, the plane that hit the pentagon disintegrated, and flight 93 was likely shot down, hours later we miraculously post all of their mug shots on the news? Damn, we must be good.

So how exactly did the United States leap to their allegations of guilt?

A travel bag belonging to one of the 911 hijackers was found at the airport after the attacks, absolutely ruling beyond any doubt, that this was the work of Al-Queda.

Question: Why would a hijacker, planning to commit suicide, even BRING A BAG? Let alone pack it w/ incriminating evidence sure to unleash a fire storm of military hell on all of his fellow Mid Eastern people? The bag contained enough evidences to precisely tie the perpetrators to the Taliban and Al-Queda justifies the assault in Afghanistan.


Answer: this is MANUFACTURED EVIDENCE


Now BBC has began running stories that many of these men have shown up as being still alive. The 911 Hijackers steal our planes to suicide attack us because were apparently not in sync with what the Qu'ran says, and then they show up still being alive. So that means that at least five of the men on the hijackers list cannot be the same men who were on the plane. But the government has stuck to their official story on this, and no one in the mainstream media has ever brought this up, or challenged them on it. Many of the hijackers are now appearing on television in their countries and professing their innocence. A lot of information like this has been circulating around other parts of the world, and it is likely part of the reason why America's image has dropped from negative to terrible. Most people in other countries know this is going on, but Americans are sleeping.


The Truth is unleashed in other parts of the world but it’s concealed from American eyes as a way to demonize Americans to the rest of the world, while American media demonizes the rest of the world (particularly Arabs) to America, this is a way of polarizing both side to inspire conflict on both sides.

Sources:


High JAck Suspects alive and well
High Jack Suspects Alive in Morroco


Bombs in the Towers


http://www.prisonplanet.tv/images/may2004/050504collapse.jpg

___ This next part is important, because it's hardcore visual evidence of government involvement in 9/11 and is nearly impossible to deny.

Building seven, first of all, was the third building to collapse within the World Trade Center Complex. According to the government’s official story, building seven was destroyed from fire, along with buildings one and two.

Videos Show Building 7's 6.5 second symmetrical collapse

http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/SMALL_wtc-7_1_.gif

First of all it’s important to say that fire has never once brought a steel structure down. Out of 100 uncontrolled fires in the last 50 years NEVER has fire collapsed a steel building, only earthquakes and explosives have been able to flatten these modern structures.

So, why is building seven so significant? It’s important because building seven collapsed without being struck by an airplane or anything else, almost as if it were the wind that knocked it over.

Several videos have been salvaged which show building seven's collapse and shocking evidence has surfaced from scrutiny.

http://www.wtc7.net/vdocs/wtc_7_cbs.mpg
http://wtc7.net/vdocs/wtc7_collapse.mpg
http://www.wtc7.net/vdocs/wtc7_collapse2.mpg

You see, building seven DECENTEGRATED INTO RUBBLE in a vertical symmetrical fashion in 6.5 seconds. If building seven was taken down by an aircraft impact (even though it was not) it would have thrown back horizontally, transferring the energy away from the airplane impacts. And if it was fire, even though the flames would have had to have burnt exponentially hotter for a much longer time, we would have seen the structure reduced into liquid metal, and the streets would be a river of flame. But this building simply fell straight to the ground and crumbled.

I need to explain something about controlled demolition. First of all, when buildings are demolished the explosives are placed in the central column, so the structure falls inwards and does not damage other surrounding buildings. So they only way the building can fall like this or fall period is through the use of explosives.

http://www.whatreallyhappened.com/fema_report.html

“Each of the following videos shows the entire visible portion of the building falling with a vertical precision otherwise seen only in controlled demolition. Moreover, they show that the collapse took only about 6.5 seconds from start to finish. That rate of fall is within a second of the time it would take an object to fall from the building's roof with no air resistance”

BUT, building seven is even more important because the official story of building seven collapse is because it was damaged from fire, HOWEVER, Larry Silverstine the owner of buildings one, two, and seven, got on television on America Rebuilds on PBS, and slipped up, ADMITTING, THAT HE BLEW UP BUILDING SEVEN, He Said "WE PULLED THE BUILDING!" Here's the video from the PBS documentary.

http://infowars.com/Video/911/wtc7_pbs.WMV

Here's another clip where a demolitions expert describes "PULL IT" As a controlled demolition.

http://www.prisonplanet.com/pullit2.mp3

NOW, it's extremely important to mention that rigging buildings with explosives is a tiresome and very time consuming process, and to properly plant explosives in mathematically harmonious fashion to create a smooth symmetrical drop. Actually it would take weeks to prepare for the demolition. So not only does Larry Silverstone, the owner of the complex admit to blowing up building seven, But building seven COULD NOT have been demolished on such short notice. Weeks of demolitions planning does not jive well with Osama's surprise attack. In fact it's impossible.

Another particularly important part of this is to note that Towers one, two, and seven have all of the 10 characteristics of a controlled demolition, a building collapsing from fire and plane impact damage having one of the characteristics of controlled demolition is astronomically rare, the chances of this damage having all 10 characteristics of a controlled demolition and not being a controlled demolition is next to nil. These characteristics are.

1. Each collapse occurred at virtually free fall speed;
2. Each building collapsed straight down, for the most part onto its own footprint;
3. Virtually all the concrete was turned into very fine dust;
4. In the case of the Twin Towers, the dust was blown out horizontally for 200 feet or more;
5. The collapses were total, leaving no steel columns sticking up hundreds of feet into the air;
6. Videos of the collapses reveal "demolition waves", meaning "confluent rows of small explosions";
7. Most of the steel beams and columns came down in sections that were no more than 30 feet long;
8. According to many witnesses, explosions occurred within the buildings;
9. Each collapse was associated with detectable seismic vibrations (suggestive of underground explosions);
10.Each collapse produced molten steel (which would be produced by explosives), resulting in "hot spots" that remained for months.?

Source:

Professor David Ray Griffin
http://www.rbnlive.com/absentia_trial.html

Good lookin to Dem Bruce Lee Stylez, and his MIGHTY nine eleven thread right here

Historical Comparison

http://www.historyproject.net/images/vol01/28-1125a.jpg

----The Burning of the Reichstag



In 1933 Adolph Hitler wanted to seize dictatorial powers and turn Germany into a police state. So he set the massive governmental building on fire that is known as the Reichstag (German Parliament) the blazing infernos sent the population into a state of petrified fear. Adolph Hitler and his party won by a landslide in the election just weeks later and later on was able to merge the Chancellor’s powers with that of the Presidents, and this is the origin of where his dictatorial power came from. Hitler also blamed the terrorist attack on the communists, and received a pretext, or a reason, to attack them.


The real Pretext

Hitler’s conspiratorial tactic of burning the Reichstag to receive dictatorial power, and a pretext to attack his enemies is a method that is known as the Hegelian Dialectic, which is translated simply as problem, reaction, solution. The Hegelian Dialectic is a tactic that was developed by the 19th century German philosopher George Wilhelm Fredric Hegel. The way this works is, you create a crisis, the population is thrown into fear, and then you, the creator of the crisis, step in with a pre-organized solution, and pose as the savior. As soon as 911 occurred, literally while the smoke was still streaming from the building, politicians began targeting us with Doublethink approaches to get us to give up our freedom for security.

I don't want to digress too much, but this is important.

Doublethink is the practice of misrepresenting something bad as something good, such as pushing identity theft propaganda in order to get the people wanting a national ID card. This was the phrase coined in George Orwell's book 1984, which psychologically persuaded the population to relinquish there freedom unto big brother and simultaneously be happy about it. We see doublethink utilized daily by politicians.

The Hegelian Dialectic fused with the double think approach has given ruthless men an unbelievably effective tactic of power consolidation. But this time it's bigger,

 

[Sub-Zer0]

PNAC(Project For a New American Centeury

The Project for a New American Century (PNAC) was founded by Dick Chenney, Donald Rumsfeld, Paul Wolfowitz, Lewis Libby and others in 2000. This is a pro-globalization neo-con think tank. On his website Dick Cheney lays out a Blueprint for America to invade many of it's neighbors and construct a "global command and control system" Cheney sites Syria, Libya, and North Korea as terrorist regimes, and uses their existence to justify invasions and restructuring there powers under a Pax America. It's strange, earlier in the year; Rumsfeld was selling Nuclear Reactors to North Korea. Now he's sitting in meetings at PNAC calling them a dangerous regime. HaHa, who made them more dangerous, Mr. Rumsfeld?
This document also mentions that public support would be very difficult to rally for these upcoming wars, and that a "Pearl Harbor Like Attack" would be very helpful. Now this is a public document, saying we need helpful Pearl Harbor attacks, that's motive, and practically admittance.

Sources:

PNAC offical site read the documents.
Meacher talks about PNAC too
Guardian UK - The Two Faces of Rumseld

Not only this, but


"the US and the UK, are running dangerously low on hydrocarbon energy supplies. And by 2010 the Muslim world will control as much as 60% of the worlds oil production, and 95% of the remaining exportable oil. "

Protecting oil supplies in a crisis
Taliban to Texas for Oil Talks
Bottom of the Barrel, the world is runnin out of oil, why do Politicans refuse to talk about it?
Threats of US to strike Taliban weeks before the attacks



Cui Bono(Who Benefits?)

Three Corporations involved in the war on terror/The World effort. They are the
Carlyle Group, Unocal, and Halliburton,

Carlyle group: Bush and the Bin Laden family are BOTH investors in this company, that is headed almost exclusively by former government officials. They developed missile targeting systems, and have exponentially increased their profits since 911.


Unocal: Bush just hired the former CEO, I believe to his administration, others inside the camp are investors as well. This is the company building the pipeline through Afghanistan, to route the oil out, they are poised to make a killing off of oil deals directly resulting from 911 after math.

Halliburton: I don't even half to say it. Well incase I do, Halliburton is a construction company raking in billions of dollars from rebuilding the spots on the map, after America destroys them.

And to top all that off,

"No serious attempt has ever been made to catch Bin Laden. In late September and early October 2001, leaders of Pakistan's two Islamist parties negotiated Bin Laden's extradition to Pakistan to stand trial for 9/11. However, a US official said, significantly, that "casting our objectives too narrowly" risked "a premature collapse of the international effort if by some lucky chance Mr. Bin Laden was captured". The US chairman of the joint chiefs of staff, General Myers, went so far as to say that "the goal has never been to get Bin Laden" (AP, April 5 2002). The whistle blowing FBI agent Robert Wright told ABC News (December 19 2002) that FBI headquarters wanted no arrests. And in November 2001 the US air force complained it had had al-Qaida and Taliban leaders in its sights as many as 10 times over the previous six weeks, but had been unable to attack because they did not receive permission quickly enough (Time Magazine, May 13 2002). None of this assembled evidence, all of which comes from sources already in the public domain, is compatible with the idea of a real, determined war on terrorism"
Micheal Meacher

The War on terror is not the war on terror, it's putting the PNAC agenda into action.

Not only have they blatantly avoided chances to catch Bin Laden, but many reporters have written articles about top government officials holding the investigation in the dark, delaying them, and in some cases even protecting the terrorists. I'd post the actual document but I'm out of picture slots so you have to settle for the article, or research the rest yourself.

http://www.thedossier.ukonline.co.uk/Web%20Pages/WASHINGTON%20POST_Bush%20Seeks%20To%20Restrict%20Hill%20Probes%20Of%20Sept%2011.htm
http://www.sptimes.com/2002/05/09/Worldandnation/Graham__911_study_hin.shtml
http://www.miami.com/mld/miamiherald/news/nation/5993628.htm
911 documents to sensitive for realse
Bush discourages 911 investagations
http://www1.timesofindia.indiatimes.com/cms.dll/articleshow?art_id=1030259305
Guardian UK - Agent Blasts FBI over 11 Sept 'cover up'


Goes on and on


ILLUMINATI NEW WORLD ORDER, THE CARD GAME

Not only has PNAC directly stated that they want "helpful Pearl Harbor Attacks" in their official documents, but a card game entitled Illuminati New World Order, surfaced in 1995, which described the events of 911 with a shocking level of accuracy. The game INWO contained cards that said the words "Terrorist Nuke" at the top with an illustration of the Twin Towers being destroyed clearly shows tower one being demolished first.

-This amazingly means, that this card predicted almost exactly what happened in New York City, six years before the actual event. It also identifies the villains as "Terrorist" at the top, which was not a term used nearly as much before 911, I don't know about the nuke part, although explosives were definitely in use on September 11th.

-The explosion on the card is very close to the actual planes entry point.

-Another interesting thing to note, is the illuminati pyramid to the left of tower two.

This card is chilling. We know that the plane or the missile or whatever hit the pentagon, pierce through several walls puncturing holes through several of the steel reinforced concrete walls at the Pentagon, and actually exploded somewhere in the middle, Although it took out a wing, the rest of the pentagon was unscathed.

Here is a flash of the Pentagon which accurately shows the damage very similar to this card.

http://www.freedomunderground.org/memoryhole/pentagon.php#Main

Funny how they got both of these elements of the attacks right and didn't make any mistakes six years before the attack, perhaps someone had advanced knowledge of it.

On March 1st 1990 the Secret Service and Austin Police raided Steve Jackson, the maker of the games, office and confiscated four of his computers. Steve Jackson games fought back in court, but nearly suffered bankruptcy in the process. The charges were so bogus on the affavid that the judge awarded $50,000 as well as attorneys fees to SJG. It's strange the secret service would bother the manufacture of a role playing game, perhaps it was to stop them from releasing Illuminati New World Order. This is definitely not the strongest piece of evidence in this expose, but it does show prior knowledge, and is quite interesting.

Here is the website of the game maker.
http://www.sjgames.com/inwo/

And props to the Cutting Edge for bringing this to my attention, most of what I have articulated is paraphrased from their article on INWO. Although theirs gets a bit too weird for me, here is the original article and props to them once again.


http://www.cuttingedge.org/news/n1753.cfm

The really scary thing is,


Home Land security = Police State Mechanism

New Laws in the Works, are...

Patriot Act: Old school now, Police and government officials do not need warrants to enter homes now, and can seize anything in your house, and not tell you they were there for 60 days. Also ambiguous language could allow for secret juryless trials and even executions for supposed "Terrorists". The definition of a terrorist as shown in the Patriot Act is one who commits "Any act that endangers human life, IN VIOLATION WITH ANY FEDERAL OR STATE LAW" So Jay walkers and pot dealers are terroist too. The Patriot Act has been used on many "domestic terrorists" for crimes such as being a gang member to writing a story here are some of the many examples, of new laws designateing all American citizens as enemeis of the state.




Pot dealears are terrorists now.
http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/localnews/2001992821_smuggling29m.html
http://stopthedrugwar.org/chronicle/349/creep.shtml
http://vancouver.cbc.ca/regional/servlet/View?filename=bc_patriot20040805
http://talkleft.com/new_archives/007442.html

People who write storries about Zombies, are terrorists too,
http://www.lex18.com/Global/story.asp?S=2989614&nav=EQlpWjof
http://www.paxtonland.com/archives/2005/03/002907.php
http://minorkey.deviantart.com/journal/4729752/


Gang members are terrorists too
http://www.newstarget.com/003554.html
http://www.terroranalysis.com/story/107777.html
http://www.mydd.com/story/2004/12/30/23170/828

Who else?
People who own Toy Stores are being visited by Home Land Security, why would they do that?
http://abcnews.go.com/US/wireStory?id=206591
http://www.stupidsecurity.com/article.pl?sid=04/10/29/0014238&mode=thread
http://www.stupidsecurity.com/article.pl?sid=04/10/29/0014238&mode=thread

Photographers have been arrested under the Patriot Act
http://grep.law.harvard.edu/article.pl?sid...247&mode=thread

FBI says Patriot Act used in Vegas strip club corruption probe
http://www.reviewjournal.com/lvrj_home/200...s/22521283.html
http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/metro/probe/20031104-0835-nv-corruptionprobe.html
http://www.lasvegassun.com/sunbin/stories/sun/2003/nov/04/515818511.html
http://msnbc.msn.com/id/3540572/
http://news.neilrogers.com/news/articles/2003111407.html



Anti-terror laws increasingly used against common criminals
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?...1259EDT0480.DTL

Shopkeeper deported from South Carolina under PATRIOT Act killed in Pakistan
http://www.unknownnews.net/030929dead.html

And there's even more examples of this here, I don't feel the need to post
http://www.prisonplanet.com/articles/octob...4patriotact.htm


National ID cards, are also on the agenda which contain name, address the usual things, but also a finger and a retinal print, also rumors are circulating about a possible tracking chip inside of them. Homeland security had a fetish w/ RFID technology, and may use it to track us all w/ it through are cards.

We have the National all Prescriptions reporting act, which makes all of your medical drug information accessible by Federal agencies, all of them in fact since their all allowed sharing information now.

And the possible enactment of mandatory psychological testing for children and prescribing drugs without the parents consent.
There are also talks of extending the program to the entire population. (Note: The Forced psychological testing bill has already been passed, search “new freedom initiative” for more info)

AND the mother of them all of course, the Patriot Act II, while the first Patriot Act is just a destruction first, third, fourth and fifth amendments, Patriot Act II is a carbon copy of the powers that Hitler and Julius Caesar gave themselves
Patriot Act II creates an expanded definition for domestic terrorism, And it allows any terrorism act to result in the death penalty, allows federal access to your bank, educational, and financial records, and makes conspiracy to commit terror a crime without endangering any life what so ever. And amazingly makes information gathering illegal, in fact this post right here would go under the heading of "Info Terrorism"

Patriot act II is enormously unpopular, and received massive amounts of bad press, so it's being passed in smaller increments, 10% of it has already been passed as HR2417, which allows for the pulling of all Financial and Medical transcripts.

"Strengthening Patriot Act I is code for passing Patriot Act 2."
There trying to do this now.

Prominent 911 whistle blowers

One might wonder, if all of this evidence which literally Swiss chesses the official story being in existence, why has there not been more of an outcry about it? Well, there has, famous people all over the world have been questioning and exposing the 911 cover-up.

Micheal Meacher MP, former environmental advisor in the British Government - This War on Terrorism is Bogus
former UK Government Minister speaks out about the standdown of NORAD on September 11th, PNAC and the pre-planned wars in Afghanistan and Iraq.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/comment/story/0,...1036571,00.html
http://www.prisonplanet.tv/audio/070204meacher.htm

Andre Van Buelow
Von Buelow is the former German Defense Minister and Minister of Technology. Von Buelow went public to say the US government carried out 9/11. His book is one of the bestsellers across Europe.
http://www.prisonplanet.com/021104vonbuelow.html
http://www.prisonplanet.com/020804vonbuelow.html

Robert Wright, FBI special Agent,
http://www.prisonplanet.com/FBI_agent_I_wa...error_probe.htm

Cynthia Mckinney (Representative D-GA) Grills Rumsfeld on wargames going on the morning of 9/11, he does not deny
http://www.infowars.com/articles/us/mckinney_grills_rumsfeld.htm

Morgan Reynolds, (former chief economist for the Department of Labor during President George W. Bush's first term) says 911 Offical story is a fruad
http://washingtontimes.com/upi-breaking/20...02755-6408r.htm
http://www.lewrockwell.com/reynolds/reynolds7.html
http://worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=44787


AND, Jimmy Walters the billionaire activist has gone so far as to, run commericals on televission, showing the evidence behinde building seven, and has also offered a $100,000 reward to any enginner who can proove that the towers fell the way they were said to have fallen in the offical story.

http://inn.globalfreepress.com/modules/news/article.php?storyid=1013
http://reopen911.org/Yahoo!%20News%20-%20September%2011%20conspiracy%20theorist%20offers%20prize.htm

 

[Sub-Zer0]

Summary:


911 was such a cataclysmic event, it galvanized both the idiots and the intellectuals of America into a flag waving frenzy for nearly five years. 911 has become a never ending excuse to fight any war over seas, and implement any authoritarian rule domestically. Politicians were so quick to exploit this event, jumping into there tanks and battle suits while rushing 1000 page bills through the Senate and House. One has to wonder, why the knee jerk reaction of this attack was to shift into throwing a doublethink deception at the people, telling them to give up freedom for liberty before the smoke had yet to even clear from the air.

Giving up freedom for Liberty is a False Paradigm. No Liberty = Tyranny.

The freedom for security trade off is a sham, because a population enslaved to their government is not safe, it’s is doubly unsafe, and incapable of defending itself from any outside threat. And even if we had an ethically loving government, (which I don’t believe we do) we’re paving the way for tyranny if an evil leader ever got into power. Most politicians and leaders know this, the fact that they instantaneously jumped into this deceptive and seemingly well planned out strategy is suspicious.

As the Roman judges used to say when a crime was committed, “key bono?”, or who benefits? The extremely powerful globalists who masterminded this attack want to put America in a permanent state of emergency to place authoritarian our nation, and so we will allow the invasions of uncontrolled Arab states, (Perhaps others too) to create a global climate in which people will beg them for a one world government. A government ruled by them. It’s Order out of chaos.

I've developed quite a case here, and I think my arguments are supported extremely well, even without all of my information on the towers; this is very strong evidence that we are being lied too, almost on a daily basis. Most of this literally proves the official story is a fraud and there's a lot of things I chose not to talk about, like 100s of Al-Queda and Taliban being flown out after 911, Insider trading right before 911, or Bush pulling FBI agents off of the Trail of the Bin Laden right before 911 (Edit: I did touch on that) and signing documents to protect them. However I've come to the conclusion that in this instance, the problem is there is actually TOO MUCH evidence here, so I won't even bother with the links for my last claims.

If you think I've made a compelling case, than I urge you learn more about this, because if I'm even remotely correct, and this New World Order a.k.a. the "Global Union" is created, by the same creatures who carried out this attack, I don't think your going to want to live under the tyranny grids they've constructed for you. I'm not charging the government with carrying this out, but these Rogue elements with tentacles into our government, who live in families who are worth five times as much as our countries annual budget. If you look more into this, I know you'll see that what I'm saying is true, this is what has happened with me. So please spread this thread around as much as you can, watch some of these movies I post at the bottom, PLEASE look into this more. I know when you find out what I'm saying is real; you'll fight it with even more compassion.

In the past only small pockets of people have had information on this subject, which served to cloak events in a protective secrecy. But lately a plethora of new information has been consolidated, creating an incredibly chaotic environment for the globalist where the risk of mass exposure is becoming very real. So once you learn, please spread this information on to others.

This is an information war, against elites with 90% of the wealth trying to control the political and financial systems to control mankind, and doing it for there own selfish desires. And information of this type is so much more powerful than any gun or grenade or tank or anything. Every single word we spew of resistance is a bullet, discharged from a chamber and sent into the heart of the New World Order Demon, and it will take a lot to kill it, but humanity will prevail.

911 Documentaries


Martial Law: 911 Rise of the Police State (The best damn 911 movie ever made)
http://www.prisonplanet.tv/images/march2005/040305martialcover.jpg
Windows Media Player:
Broadband:

http://www.revradio.org/movies/ml.wmv

Dial up:

http://www.revradio.org/movies/ml56k.wmv

Stream:

Broadband:

http://www.revradio.org/movies/ml.wmx

Dial up:

http://www.revradio.org/movies/ml56k.wmx

911- The Road To Tyranny

Paineful Deceptions
http://reopen911.org/video/painful_deceptions-an_analysis_of_the_911_attack_part1.wmv
http://reopen911.org/video/painful_deceptions-an_analysis_of_the_911_attack_part2.wmv
http://reopen911.org/video/painful_deceptions-an_analysis_of_the_911_attack_part3.wmv

The Masters of terror
2:00:09
http://thewebfairy.com/video/collected/Mas...ror_128KBps.wmv

911 Truth and Lies 4 parts

http://www.illuminaticonspiracy.org/files/...ndLiesPart1.wmv
http://www.illuminaticonspiracy.org/files/...ndLiesPart2.wmv
http://www.illuminaticonspiracy.org/files/...ndLiesPart3.wmv
http://www.illuminaticonspiracy.org/files/...ndLiesPart4.wmv

Michael Parenti-Terrorism, Globalism and Conspiracy
http://www.workingtv.com/media5/parenti1.wmv
http://www.workingtv.com/media5/parenti2.wmv
http://www.workingtv.com/media5/parenti3.wmv
http://www.workingtv.com/media5/parenti4.wmv
http://www.workingtv.com/media5/parenti5.wmv

Illuminazi 9-11
http://www.nwowatcher.com/downloads/illuminazi.wmv

The Microchip
http://www.nwowatcher.com/downloads/The%20Microchip.wmv

Free ebooks

http://www.nwowatcher.com/ebooks/The%20Secret%20Rituals%20of%20the%20O.T.O.%20(Illuminati,%20Templars,%20Freemasons,%20etc.).pdf
http://www.nwowatcher.com/ebooks/Order%20Out%20of%20Chaos%20-%20By%20Paul%20Joseph%20Watson.pdf
http://www.nwowatcher.com/ebooks/Chronological%20History%20of%20The%20New%20World%20Order%20-%20By%20Dennis%20Cuddy.pdf
http://www.nwowatcher.com/ebooks/conspiracy%20ebook%20-%20New%20World%20Order%20by%20Milton%20William%20Cooper.pdf
http://www.nwowatcher.com/ebooks/Global%20Tyranny%20Step%20By%20Step%20-%20By%20William%20F%20Jasper.pdf


http://www.nwowatcher.com/downloads.html

 

[Evo]

Looks like a thread for the round file.

 

[Ivan Seeking]

We'll see how your posts hold up to scrutiny, but a nice effort in any case.

 

[Ivan Seeking]

Looks like a thread for the round file.

Wow, there's too much on the plate for me to tell.

 

[Pengwuino]

Anyone else feel like this is a Ronco commercial tryen to sell you more crap? I skimmed through and felt like I needed to get my credit card...

And haven't we gone over this like 10 times...

 

[Evo]

Anyone else feel like this is a Ronco commercial tryen to sell you more crap? I skimmed through and felt like I needed to get my credit card...

And haven't we gone over this like 10 times...

Yes, this is "same old, same old" stuff that has already been shown wrong.

Ivan this should be merged with the other conspiracy threads or deleted? It's already been discussed ad nauseum. I see nothing new here.

edit: Lots of what he's posted such as "Insider trading right before 911" has been publicly shown to be inaccurate, it was in another thread a few months ago. Lots of his links are in the current conspiracy thread.

 

[Ivan Seeking]

I did see some new information. I would like to give our newest member a chance to defend his or her case. Maybe once I have time to review in greater detail I will change my mind.

 

[Evo]

I did see some new information. I would like to give our newest member a chance to defend his or her case. Maybe once I have time to review in greater detail I will change my mind.

You're the boss.

His posts are so long, anything we haven't already discussed will probably be lost, should you prune it down to just the new stuff?

So much is bunk, like the "standown of NORAD"

 

[Ivan Seeking]

Consider this thread Custer's last stand.

Take that as a hint conspiracy theorists.

 

[Pengwuino]

So who is firing the first shell?

 

[russ_watters]

I used the term "word salad" in the previous thread, and I'll use it again. Lots and lots and lots and lots and lots and lots of nothing there, Sub_Zero. If you want a discussion, we'll take these things one at a time: pick your one strongest point and argue it.

How about the the-buildings-fell-at-freefall-speeds point...? That's my personal favorite...

 

[russ_watters]

So much is bunk, like the "standown of NORAD"

Well, the factually wrong stuff doesn't trouble me anywhere near as much as the my-intuition-is-better-than-an-engineering-degree crap. Its easier to debunk, imo. But hey - let's start an argument over which aspect of the crackpottery is the worst!

 

[russ_watters]

Ok, before I wrote the first post, I hadn't even skimmed the opening posts. Now that I have, whoa - its worse than I thought. It's not just a 9/11 conspiracy theory, its a mixture of half a dozen of the nuttiest of conspiracy theories out there.

 

[Pengwuino]

I'm sure I saw some NORAD crap in there so without further adieu...

http://www.popularmechanics.com/science/defense/1227842.html?page=3&c=y

 

[Entropy]

First of all it’s important to say that fire has never once brought a steel structure down. Out of 100 uncontrolled fires in the last 50 years NEVER has fire collapsed a steel building, only earthquakes and explosives have been able to flatten these modern structures.

Okay, I'll take the first crack at this. Alright, let's say the government was responsible for the attacks. Then why did they bother putting explosives in the towers and crashing a plane into it? Even if a plane crash wasn't capable of destroying the towers, why have a plane hit it AND put bombs in it? Wouldn't a plane crashing into a building prompt just as much vigor against terrorism even if it didn't bring the entire building down?

 

[Pengwuino]

Okay, I'll take the first crack at this. Alright, let's say the government was responsible for the attacks. Then why did they bother putting explosives in the towers and crashing a plane into it? Even if a plane crash wasn't capable of destroying the towers, why have a plane hit it AND put bombs in it? Wouldn't a plane crashing into a building prompt just as much vigor against terrorism even if it didn't bring the entire building down?

Although it can be said that having the 2 largest towers actually collapsing could be a better motivator for war in the publics mind... why in gods name would they intentionally collapse the other WTC buildings as well? If there was a conspiracy, it would have made no sense to bring down the other smaller towers as well for many reasons. 1) No one will notice htem compared to the 2 largest tower to add to the "effect". 2) Why wait 8 hours for the rest? Thats 8 whole hours that more and more cameras and people and experts can arrive on the scene to see signs of a controlled demolition on the smaller tower (7 i believe) if it did occur.

 

[Rude Boi MC!]

I used the term "word salad" in the previous thread, and I'll use it again. Lots and lots and lots and lots and lots and lots of nothing there, Sub_Zero. If you want a discussion, we'll take these things one at a time: pick your one strongest point and argue it.

How about the the-buildings-fell-at-freefall-speeds point...? That's my personal favorite...

Yo I’ve reviewed the things you’ve been saying and it certainly appears to me that you truly don’t know what in the hell your talking about, you seem to justify your arguments with a incorrect and smug self belief that your correct. The evidence you site for the most part and the conclusions you draw are not convincing proof of anything. So I would suggest that you take a deep breath, sit back and consider that you’ve been lied to by the Bush Administration and mass media, and challenge critically the official 9/11 story. Which in fact by it’s nature being nothing but an idea about what happened that day, is a conspiracy theory, that you have to be a conspiracy theorist to believe. And that's assuming if you genuine, because your not one of these “disinfo agents" that I’ve heard so much about, are you?

http://xs40.xs.to/pics/05312/Disinfo-agent.png

“Flood the Internet with agents. This is the answer to the question, "What could possibly motivate a person to spend hour upon hour on Internet news groups defending the government and/or the press and harassing genuine critics?" Don't the authorities have defenders enough in all the newspapers, magazines, radio, and television? One would think refusing to print critical letters and screening out serious callers or dumping them from radio talk shows would be control enough, but, obviously, it is not.”


I’m personally convinced that the Bush Administration has fed the mass media wholly treasonous lies about what happened on 9/11. And the Mass media being corporate has been told not to question 9/11 because it’s owned by the same people profiting from war, in the Military Industrial Complex. Sub-Zero has put up conclusive evidence to any open mined person that at least, there’s something wrong with the official 9/11 story. If people are refusing to accept that then they’re probably suffering from what’s called “cognitive dissidence”!

Watch this speech by Dr David Ray Griffin, he explains excellently why we've been lied to over 9/11;

http://www.911busters.com/911_new_video_productions/MOV/DR_Griffin_Santa_Rosa_Oct_04.html

 

[Pengwuino]

Rude boi MC, the ironic part about all this is that we have brought up unrefutable evidence concerning 9/11 and your response is "You guys are stupid, you just don't want to believe it and don't want to look at the facts".

I hope that theologian has some intensive engineering background to back up his rhetoric

Oops guess he doesnt. This is basically a live version of all the conspiracy theory BS. "Never before in history has steel framed high-rise buildings collapsed because of fire". Wow i think I've heard that word for word a few times and then he calls the fires "insignificant". Then he questions why the towers fell in the order they did. He thinks they hsould fall in the order they were hit. Ohhh ohh, oh god, the phd in theology is giving me a lecture in engineering and metallurgy... This is a conspiracy website implanted in someones brain and then the body turned on.

Oh wow, "all the gas was thrown outside, didn't you see the fireball? There goes all the fuel!". Oh my jesus... he's giving everyone an engineering lecture not knowing anything about what he's talking about. Ah yes "No one has ever explained how tower #7 came down". Except like... a hundred structural engineers... didn't PBS have an entire show on this?

ahahaha oh my jebus. "And they could have just flown into one of hte largest nuclear power plants and devasted the US economy". My god, i wish i could get this guy to remodel my house because he obviously has massive amounts of knowledge about engineering and stuff like that.

Man, what a self-strokeathon.

 

[Rude Boi MC!]

Rude boi MC, the ironic part about all this is that we have brought up unrefutable evidence concerning 9/11 and your response is "You guys are stupid, you just don't want to believe it and don't want to look at the facts".

I hope that theologian has some intensive engineering background to back up his rhetoric

Oops guess he doesnt. This is basically a live version of all the conspiracy theory BS. "Never before in history has steel framed high-rise buildings collapsed because of fire". Wow i think I've heard that word for word a few times and then he calls the fires "insignificant". Then he questions why the towers fell in the order they did. He thinks they hsould fall in the order they were hit. Ohhh ohh, oh god, the phd in theology is giving me a lecture in engineering and metallurgy... This is a conspiracy website implanted in someones brain and then the body turned on.

Oh wow, "all the gas was thrown outside, didn't you see the fireball? There goes all the fuel!". Oh my jesus... he's giving everyone an engineering lecture not knowing anything about what he's talking about. Ah yes "No one has ever explained how tower #7 came down". Except like... a hundred structural engineers... didn't PBS have an entire show on this?

ahahaha oh my jebus. "And they could have just flown into one of hte largest nuclear power plants and devasted the US economy". My god, i wish i could get this guy to remodel my house because he obviously has massive amounts of knowledge about engineering and stuff like that.

Man, what a self-strokeathon.

No I’m not calling anyone stupid, because that would be hypocritical of me as I also believed the brainwashing about "19 magic Arabs and their mastermind OBL". What I'm saying is that the official 9/11 story needs to be questioned and challenged independently. What David Ray Griffin is doing is academically outlining the inconsistencies with the official story, and it's whitewash Whitehouse investigating it’s self commission. He's talking about research from qualified people, read this;

http://911research.wtc7.net/essays/nist/index.html

 

[Pengwuino]

No I’m not calling anyone stupid, because that would be hypocritical of me as I also believed the brainwashing about "19 magic Arabs and their mastermind OBL". What I'm saying is that the official 9/11 story needs to be questioned and challenged independently. What David Ray Griffin is doing is academically outlining the inconsistencies with the official story, and it's whitewash Whitehouse investigating it’s self commission. He's talking about research from qualified people, read this;

http://911research.wtc7.net/essays/nist/index.html

No its not, its total lies or ignorance. Everything he said about the engineering aspects were 100% debunked BS. He shows 0 understanding of engineering and how the military works... or hell, how the entire government works. He says the CIA is suppose to be on watch for stock trades (I wonder what the SEC does all day)

 

[Rude Boi MC!]

No its not, its total lies or ignorance. Everything he said about the engineering aspects were 100% debunked BS. He shows 0 understanding of engineering and how the military works... or hell, how the entire government works. He says the CIA is suppose to be on watch for stock trades (I wonder what the SEC does all day)

No I think for you to say "its total lies or ignorance" as if you've closed the case, shows you're ability to tell "total lies" and be "ignorant"! And if it were "100% debunked BS" who's debunked it because I've been researching this for a while now, and I've seen no dismantle of his prima facie case, please show me it!

Since 9/11 was essentially a murder let's investigate it like one. What’s the first thing that you do when you investigate a murder, you see who benefited. If someone was killed, and two months before, her husband took out a huge life insurance policy on her, he would be the prime suspect. Well guess what, two months before 9/11, Larry Silverstine took out a 3.6 BILLION, dollar insurance policy out the Towers, and the surrounding buildings that he owned. And guess what else, every single one of those buildings that Larry Silverstine owned were destroyed. And did he collect the insurance money? Well technically no, but this is because he is trying to collect twice the insurance money that his policy guaranteed. The case is currently pending. Now that we found one person that benefited, let's see who else benefited, for one, our current president. He benefited politically because immediately after 9/11 his approval rating soared. It was either the highest of all time, or the highest since FDR, I can't remember. He passed the Patriot Act, which goes DIRECTLY against our constitution and bill of rights. Next our president's father benefited hugely financially, because he was on the board of the company that most profited when we invaded Afghanistan (a direct result of 9/11) the Carlyle group, which makes equipment, vehicles and munitions for the US military. I can't even imagine the stock options that he gets from being on its board. And you can bet the stock shot up when we went to war. So now on our list of people who profited from a mass murder we have, Larry Silverstine, our president, and our president's father. Next we have our vice president, he profited hugely financially since he was the former CEO of Halliburton (like Bush you can be sure he has ridiculous stock options). If you don't know, Halliburton helped the United States build a pipeline in Afghanistan, and helped sealing up oil wells (and many other things) in Iraq. So far on our list of those who profited we have, Larry Silverstine, George W. Bush, George Bush Sr., and Dick Cheney. Since we are detectives and we have to entertain every possibility let's see if it could have been a conspiracy. Because it appears that “Ossama Bin Laden’s attack” did nothing but conveniently bring the hammer down on the Middle East, which is something that those in the Bush Administration were itching to do from the second they took office!

 

[Pengwuino]

No I think for you to say "its total lies or ignorance" as if you've closed the case, shows you're ability to tell "total lies" and be "ignorant"! And if it were "100% debunked BS" who's debunked it because I've been researching this for a while now, and I've seen no dismantle of his prima facie case, please show me it!

Search this forum, very easy. I find it almost impossible to believe you have researched it and have not found the concrete evidence very easily accessable on the internet.

Since 9/11 was essentially a murder let's investigate it like one. What’s the first thing that you do when you investigate a murder, you see who benefited. If someone was killed, and two months before, her husband took out a huge life insurance policy on her, he would be the prime suspect. Well guess what, two months before 9/11, Larry Silverstine took out a 3.6 BILLION, dollar insurance policy out the Towers, and the surrounding buildings that he owned. And guess what else, every single one of those buildings that Larry Silverstine owned were destroyed. And did he collect the insurance money? Well technically no, but this is because he is trying to collect twice the insurance money that his policy guaranteed. The case is currently pending.

1) Proof?
2) Was insurance ever taken out before? Possibly a recurring insurance?

Now that we found one person that benefited, let's see who else benefited, for one, our current president. He benefited politically because immediately after 9/11 his approval rating soared. It was either the highest of all time, or the highest since FDR, I can't remember. He passed the Patriot Act, which goes DIRECTLY against our constitution and bill of rights.

Irrelevant.
Plus of course, how does it go against our constitution? ("and bill of rights"? What the hells that? Is the Bill of Rights a separate entity?). I'd like actual verbatim text from the legislation as well. How does this "profit" anyone?

Next our president's father benefited hugely financially, because he was on the board of the company that most profited when we invaded Afghanistan (a direct result of 9/11) the Carlyle group, which makes equipment, vehicles and munitions for the US military. I can't even imagine the stock options that he gets from being on its board. And you can bet the stock shot up when we went to war. So now on our list of people who profited from a mass murder we have, Larry Silverstine, our president, and our president's father. Next we have our vice president, he profited hugely financially since he was the former CEO of Halliburton (like Bush you can be sure he has ridiculous stock options).

Proof? SEC filings should be rather easy to obtain...

If you don't know, Halliburton helped the United States build a pipeline in Afghanistan, and helped sealing up oil wells (and many other things) in Iraq. So far on our list of those who profited we have, Larry Silverstine, George W. Bush, George Bush Sr., and Dick Cheney. Since we are detectives and we have to entertain every possibility let's see if it could have been a conspiracy. Because it appears that “Ossama Bin Laden’s attack” did nothing but conveniently bring the hammer down on the Middle East, which is something that those in the Bush Administration were itching to do from the second they took office!

Your opinion is irrelevant. You must prove, like in a murder case, that these people actually did do it.

 

[Esperanto]

Intercepts Not Routine
CLAIM: "It has been standard operating procedures for decades to immediately intercept off-course planes that do not respond to communications from air traffic controllers," says the Web site oilempire.us. "When the Air Force 'scrambles' a fighter plane to intercept, they usually reach the plane in question in minutes."

FACT: In the decade before 9/11, NORAD intercepted only one civilian plane over North America: golfer Payne Stewart's Learjet, in October 1999. With passengers and crew unconscious from cabin decompression, the plane lost radio contact but remained in transponder contact until it crashed. Even so, it took an F-16 1 hour and 22 minutes to reach the stricken jet. Rules in effect back then, and on 9/11, prohibited supersonic flight on intercepts. Prior to 9/11, all other NORAD interceptions were limited to offshore Air Defense Identification Zones (ADIZ). "Until 9/11 there was no domestic ADIZ," FAA spokesman Bill Schumann tells PM. After 9/11, NORAD and the FAA increased cooperation, setting up hotlines between ATCs and NORAD command centers, according to officials from both agencies. NORAD has also increased its fighter coverage and has installed radar to monitor airspace over the continent.

http://www.popularmechanics.com/sci...html?page=3&c=y

In response to Pengwuino's NORAD comment.

These were well-practiced routines. With more than 4,500 aircraft continuously sharing US airspace, between September 2000 and June 2001 the Pentagon launched fighters on 67 occasions to escort wayward aircraft. [FAA news release, Aug 9, 2002; Associated Press Aug 13, 2002]

http://www.septembereleventh.org/airdefense.php

Can you see the discrepancy here?

Two possible reasons for blowing up more buildings.

1. Collect insurance (Larry Silverstein collected twice the amount for the two buildings than he should have).

2. Blow up the evidence.

NEW YORK -- Two months before the World Trade Center collapsed, leaseholder Larry Silverstein's insurance brokers changed the trade center's policy form from one that defined the towers' destruction as one event to another form, Silverstein's lawyer said Wednesday, according to The Associated Press.

Closing arguments began after a contentious, 10-week trial that Silverstein hopes is the first round in a bid to collect twice the $3.5 billion insurance policy he took out on the center, one for each tower that fell on Sept. 11, 2001.

Thirteen insurance companies led by Swiss Reinsurance Ltd. have sued Silverstein Properties Inc., arguing that they agreed to coverage under an insurance form issued by Silverstein broker Willis Group Holdings Ltd., which specifically defines the word "occurrence" and holds that the Sept. 11, 2001, destruction of the trade center was one event.

Silverstein has argued that Willis switched to a form issued by Travelers Property Casualty Corp. from the Willis form, known as Wilprop.

-- NYSCPA.org News Staff

http://www.nysscpa.org/home/2004/404/2week/article61.htm

Building 7 was one of New York City's larger buildings. A sleek bronze-colored skyscraper with a trapezoidal footprint, it occupied an entire city block and rose over 600 feet above street level.

Built in 1985, it was formerly the headquarters of the junk-bond firm Drexel Burnham Lambert, which contributed to the Savings and Loans collapse, prompting the $500-billion taxpayer-underwritten bailout of the latter 1980s. At the time of its destruction, it exclusively housed government agencies and financial institutions. It contained offices of the IRS, Secret Service, and SEC.

It also housed then-Mayor Giuliani's Office of Emergency Management, and its emergency command center on the 23rd floor. This floor received 15 million dollars worth of renovations, including independent and secure air and water supplies, and bullet and bomb resistant windows designed to withstand 200 MPH winds. 1 The 1993 bombing must have been part of the rationale for the command center, which overlooked the Twin Towers, a prime terrorist target.

How curious that on the day of the attack, Guiliani and his Entourage set up shop in a different headquarters, abandoning the special bunker designed precisely for such an event. 2

http://www.wtc7.net/background.html

And to those people who want to point to the fuel tanks in building 7

“The fuel absolutely could be a factor," said Silvian Marcus, executive vice president for the Cantor Seinuk Group and a structural engineer involved in the original design of the building, which was completed in 1987. But he added, “The tanks may have accelerated the collapse, but did not cause the collapse.”

http://www.ilaam.net/Sept11/LiesAndVideotape.html

And here is an engineer's opinion on airplanes crashing the wtc in an interview clip.

Frank A. DeMartini, Manager, WTC Construction and Project Management, discusses the fact that the WTC towers were designed to take multiple hits from airliners and not collapse, comparing it to poking a pencil through fly netting, DeMartini was adament that the towers would not collapse. DeMartini died in the towers on 9/11, this interview clip was taken from video shot in January 2001.

http://www.prisonplanet.com/articles/november2004/141104designedtotake.htm

Enough, I am convinced this place is a disinfo agent haven.

Released: August 30, 2004

Half of New Yorkers Believe US Leaders Had Foreknowledge of Impending 9-11 Attacks and “Consciously Failed” To Act; 66% Call For New Probe of Unanswered Questions by Congress or New York’s Attorney General, New Zogby International Poll Reveals

http://www.zogby.com/news/ReadNews.dbm?ID=855

I'll leave you alone to wallow in the pigsty now, tata.

 

[0m3ga]

White House Disclosures Lead to 'Hal'

While the months pass for US troops occupying Iraq, the financial value and taxpayer-funded cost of Halliburton's extensive Iraq contracts increase.

Halliburton, a huge global conglomerate in the oil field business, landed a non-competitive-bid contract for work in Iraq that now looks almost open-ended. The cost, recently reported by the New York Times at over $2 billion, has led to inquiries being sent to the Office of Management and Budget by Reps. Henry A. Waxman (D-Calif.) and John D. Dingell (D-Mich.).

Among other issues, Vice President Richard Cheney was head of Halliburton from 1995 to 2000 and may receive deferred compensation and other benefits (not yet calculated) from Halliburton for a period of five years, according to his 2001 financial disclosure statement. Cheney's "golden handshake," however, is not the administration's only link to Halliburton. The company's chief shareholders, whose top management can be predicted to benefit financially from war in Iraq, also have administration ties.

David Letterman-style, the Top Ten shareholders for Halliburton Company, Inc., are as follows: (see biz.yahoo.com/hd/h/hal.html):

#10: The Vanguard Group, with 7.6 million shares of Halliburton stock, worth about $176 million. Vanguard, also 10th largest mutual-fund shareholder in Halliburton, is a huge owner in ExxonMobil and ConocoPhillips. It moved onto this list recently when Dallas-based Maverick Capital, privately owned by the Wylie family, moved off. Vice President Cheney's disclosure statement (above) shows millions of his retirement money invested through Vanguard.

Vice presidential candidates have traditionally been chosen for the political advantage of a background, region, age, etc., different from that of the presidential candidate. The American system of orderly transmission of power indulges this political expediency partly because it helps prevent the formation of a behind-the-scenes cabal. Good idea.

This list footnotes some of the recent public discussion about Halliburton. On Meet the Press Sept. 14, Cheney disavowed any present connection to Halliburton: "And since I left Halliburton to become George Bush's vice president, I've severed all my ties with the company, gotten rid of all my financial interests. I have no financial interest in Halliburton of any kind and haven't had now for over three years." The statement was subsequently reinforced by spokespersons for both Cheney and Halliburton, who pointed out that Cheney's contract protects his benefits even if the company loses money.

The disclosure form paints a somewhat more nuanced picture. The Vanguard Group holdings are easily among Cheney's largest holdings. Assets are given in ranges (from $100,000 to $1M; from $1M to $5M; etc). Cheney's statement includes two holdings in the $500,000-$1M range; two holdings in the $1M-$5M range; and three holdings in the $5M-$25M range. Thus Cheney's assets invested with Vanguard Group total $18M to $87M. Given the size of Vanguard's stake in Halliburton, it is hard to imagine a mathematical possibility that Cheney's assets are unconnected to Halliburton's fortunes.

Probable return on assets is obviously hard to quantify. Some estimate can be provided by George W. Bush's own financial disclosure statement (see www.opensecrets.org). Bush had relatively piddling assets of $68,766 invested in Vanguard in 2001, on which he declared a quite respectable capital gain of $4,735, or about 6%.

halliburton stock holding

 

[russ_watters]

Yo I’ve reviewed the things you’ve been saying and it certainly appears to me that you truly don’t know what in the hell your talking about, you seem to justify your arguments with a incorrect and smug self belief that your correct. The evidence you site for the most part and the conclusions you draw are not convincing proof of anything. So I would suggest that you take a deep breath, sit back and consider that you’ve been lied to by the Bush Administration and mass media, and challenge critically the official 9/11 story.

I don't see an argument anywhere in that post, Rude Boi MC - do you have one or is namecalling all there is? If I don't know what I'm talking about, show us why you think that.

And that's assuming if you genuine, because your not one of these “disinfo agents" that I’ve heard so much about, are you?

And for my part, I'll assume that you're serious about all this.

What’s the first thing that you do when you investigate a murder, you see who benefited.

No, first you examine the victim and the scene to determine if a crime even took place. This is a big part of the problem with conspiracy theory - you start with an assumption about the crime and jump straight to the suspects. But oops... the crime didn't happen the way you wanted it to, so your suspects are, well, suspect. So again, make an argument as to why you think the WTC was felled by explosives. And by "why", I don't mean the motive, I mean what evidence is there that it was felled by explosives. Again, if I can make a suggestion, my favorite bit of evidence is the speed at which it collapsed. Would you like to discuss that piece of evidence? If so, lay out a case for what that piece of evidence shows.

Esperanto, one of the problems with conspiracy theory sites is they copy and paste each other's material. As a result, there really isn't any confirmation, just regurgitation. For example, that August 9, 2002 news release from the FAA is probably talking about intercepts from September of 2001 to June of 2002, but since none of the conspiracy theory sites have/link a copy of the news release, we can't check to be sure. Heck, its even possible it was made up by one of the conspiracy theory sites and the others just keep regurgitating it because they want to believe it.

Regarding Payne Stewart's plane, the http://www.ntsb.gov/Publictn/2000/AAB0001.htm is available online, so there is no need for 3rd party accounts. A careful read shows it was, indeed, an hour and 19 minutes, not just 19 minutes for the intercept. A careless conspiracy theorist missed the fact that the plane moved from the eastern to the central time zone.

Also, the intercepting planes were not part of a combat unit, they were part of a flight-test unit. So it took an hour and 19 minutes for the intercept, and then only from unarmed planes because they were the closest at the time (already airborne on a training/test flight). Makes the difficulty of an armed intercept on 9/11 a lot clearer, doesn't it?

How curious that on the day of the attack, Guiliani and his Entourage set up shop in a different headquarters, abandoning the special bunker designed precisely for such an event.

Um, you find it curious that Guiliani didn't set up headquarters in a burning building?

And here is an engineer's opinion on airplanes crashing the wtc in an interview clip.

Quote:
Frank A. DeMartini, Manager, WTC Construction and Project Management, discusses the fact that the WTC towers were designed to take multiple hits from airliners and not collapse, comparing it to poking a pencil through fly netting, DeMartini was adament that the towers would not collapse. DeMartini died in the towers on 9/11, this interview clip was taken from video shot in January 2001.

And he was right: the buildings did withstand the impact!

 

[Rude Boi MC!]

I don't see an argument anywhere in that post, Rude Boi MC - do you have one or is namecalling all there is? If I don't know what I'm talking about, show us why you think that. And for my part, I'll assume that you're serious about all this. No, first you examine the victim and the scene to determine if a crime even took place. This is a big part of the problem with conspiracy theory - you start with an assumption about the crime and jump straight to the suspects. But oops... the crime didn't happen the way you wanted it to, so your suspects are, well, suspect. So again, make an argument as to why you think the WTC was felled by explosives. And by "why", I don't mean the motive, I mean what evidence is there that it was felled by explosives. Again, if I can make a suggestion, my favorite bit of evidence is the speed at which it collapsed. Would you like to discuss that piece of evidence? If so, lay out a case for what that piece of evidence shows.

Esperanto, one of the problems with conspiracy theory sites is they copy and paste each other's material. As a result, there really isn't any confirmation, just regurgitation. For example, that August 9, 2002 news release from the FAA is probably talking about intercepts from September of 2001 to June of 2002, but since none of the conspiracy theory sites have/link a copy of the news release, we can't check to be sure. Heck, its even possible it was made up by one of the conspiracy theory sites and the others just keep regurgitating it because they want to believe it.

Regarding Payne Stewart's plane, the http://www.ntsb.gov/Publictn/2000/AAB0001.htm is available online, so there is no need for 3rd party accounts. A careful read shows it was, indeed, an hour and 19 minutes, not just 19 minutes for the intercept. A careless conspiracy theorist missed the fact that the plane moved from the eastern to the central time zone.

Also, the intercepting planes were not part of a combat unit, they were part of a flight-test unit. So it took an hour and 19 minutes for the intercept, and then only from unarmed planes because they were the closest at the time (already airborne on a training/test flight). Makes the difficulty of an armed intercept on 9/11 a lot clearer, doesn't it?

No why don't YOU provide the strongest argument that 9/11 is how the corporate mass media and Bush Administration say, and let ME tear that apart!

 

[Esperanto]

Ahem, do you people see now what lunatics I have to deal with?

These were well-practiced routines. With more than 4,500 aircraft continuously sharing US airspace, between September 2000 and June 2001 the Pentagon launched fighters on 67 occasions to escort wayward aircraft. [FAA news release, Aug 9, 2002; Associated Press Aug 13, 2002]

How in the world can you believe this means September 2001-June 2002? This is Associated Press regurgitating the FAA.

 

[russ_watters]

No why don't YOU provide the strongest argument that 9/11 is how the corporate mass media and Bush Administration say, and let ME tear that apart!

Sorry, Boi, that just ain't how this works. You claim that it was demolished, you need to prove it. I won't play your games. You think the official report is flawed, you need to find a specific flaw and explain why it is a flaw.

 

[russ_watters]

Ahem, do you people see now what lunatics I have to deal with?

Watch your tone. We don't allow personal attacks here.

How in the world can you believe this means September 2001-June 2002? This is Associated Press regurgitating the FAA.

The link you gave was to a conspiracy theory website, not to the AP, not the FAA, and not a news article that used that quote. Just because you read it somewhere, doesn't automatically make it true (see the similar error about the time to intercept Payne Stewart's jet...).

 

[Rude Boi MC!]

Sorry, Boi, that just ain't how this works. You claim that it was demolished, you need to prove it. I won't play your games.

No you claim that 9/11 was not an inside job, SO YOU PROVE THAT THEN!

And if you're confident enough that you can back up the official government story for why the towers fell, why don't you think about making $100,000!



NEW YORK (Reuters) - Jimmy Walter has spent more than $3 million (1.5 million pounds) promoting a conspiracy theory the September 11, 2001, attacks on the United States were "an inside job" and he is offering more cash to anyone who proves him wrong.


Reuters Photo



The millionaire activist is so convinced of a government cover-up he is offering a $100,000 reward to any engineering student who can prove the World Trade Centre buildings crashed the way the government says.


"Of course, we expect no winners," Walter, 57, heir to an $11 million fortune from his father's home building business, said in a telephone interview from California on Wednesday.


He said a panel of expert engineers would judge submissions from the students.


Next month, he also launches a nationwide contest seeking alternative theories from college and high school students about why New York's World Trade Centre collapsed. The contest offers $10,000 to the best alternative theory, with 100 runner-up awards of $1,000. Winners will be chosen next June.


The World Trade Centre's twin towers were destroyed after hijackers slammed two commercial airliners into them. The attack in New York killed 2,749 people.


Various official investigations give no credence to Walter's theory. A September 11 commission spokesman did not return calls seeking comment.


Walter insists there had to be explosives planted in the twin towers to cause them to fall as they did, and also rejects the official explanation for the damage done at the Pentagon (news - web sites).


"We have all the proof," said Walter, citing videotapes and testimony from witnesses.


"It wasn't 19 screw-ups from Saudi Arabia who couldn't pass flight school who defeated the United States with a set of box cutters," he said. He dismissed the official September 11 commission report, saying, "I don't trust any of these 'facts.'"


Walter has spent millions of dollars to bolster support for his case, running full-page ads in The New York Times, the Wall Street Journal, The New Yorker and Newsweek, as well as alternative newspapers and 30-second TV spots.


He points to a Zogby poll he commissioned last summer that showed 66 percent of New Yorkers wanted the 9/11 investigation reopened.


Walter has spent about 30 percent of his net worth on his efforts.


"I am a patriot fighting the real traitors who are destroying our democracy. I resent it when they call me delusional," he said.

 

[russ_watters]

No you claim that 9/11 was not an inside job, SO YOU PROVE THAT THEN!

No. I did not and would not, just as I would not attempt to claim/prove that aliens took it down - that would be a meaningless/pointless negative claim. There simply isn't any reason for me to do that.

What I do say is that I accept the generally accepted viewpoint. If you disagree with it or wish to advance your own theory, please do so.

And if you're confident enough that you acn back up the official government story for why the towers fell, why don't you think about making $100,000!

Heh, right.

This thread isn't going to go anywhere if all you want to do is banter, guys. It needs to find a point, or it will need to be closed.

 

[Esperanto]

The building seven was burning for seven hours before it collapse at 5:30 p.m. People were evacuated an hour or two before. That's how mild the fires were.

Let's just forget about all that evidence and compare what Larry Silverstein and FEMA say.

n a September 2002 PBS documentary called 'America Rebuilds,' Silverstein states, in reference to World Trade Center Building 7, "I remember getting a call from the, er, fire department commander, telling me that they were not sure they were going to be able to contain the fire, and I said, "We've had such terrible loss of life, maybe the smartest thing to do is pull it. And they made that decision to pull and we watched the building collapse."

http://www.prisonplanet.com/pullit.mp3

http://www.prisonplanet.com/011904wtc7.html

“The specifics of the fires in WTC 7 and how they caused the building to collapse remain unknown at this time.”

http://www.prisonplanet.com/011904wtc7.html

How can you defend that?

 

[Evo]

This has all been discussed before. This thread is redundant.