At what level will the water settle in this system?

In summary, the water will settle about 10 metres above the spillway of the catch tank. That is the height of a water-filled barometer, a column of water supported by atmospheric pressure with a near vacuum of water vapour above.
  • #1
mcmpw
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TL;DR Summary
starting with all tanks and lines full with water, what level(s) water settle in this system?

each grid is 2 meters.......catch tank is 6 meters deep with open spillway..........inlet from line to "tank a" line is 12 meters above water level in catch tank. blue arrows indicate check valves and flow direction.......pink lines represent sluice valves.......... edit and submit photo representing water levels
asd.jpg
 
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  • #2
The answer has not changed.
The water will settle about 10 metres above the spillway of the catch tank. That is the height of a water-filled barometer, a column of water supported by atmospheric pressure with a near vacuum of water vapour above.
 
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  • #3
Baluncore said:
The answer has not changed.
The water will settle about 10 metres above the spillway of the catch tank. That is the height of a water-filled barometer, a column of water supported by atmospheric pressure with a near vacuum of water vapour above.
all other tanks will drain to the same elevation which will complete drain tanks b and c, while leaving tank d full?
 
  • #4
mcmpw said:
all other tanks will drain to the same elevation which will complete drain tanks b and c, while leaving tank d full?
That may be the case. I see no information on the heights of the other tanks.
 
  • #5
Baluncore said:
I see no information on the heights of the other tanks.
There is a faint green grid, which looks to be 2 meters per square...
 
  • #6
yes each square is 2 meters
 
  • #7
mcmpw said:
yes each square is 2 meters
I see no squares on my monitor.
That makes it your problem.
 
  • #8
Baluncore said:
I see no squares on my monitor.
I darkened the background grid a bit...

water tanks.jpg
 
  • #9
Draw a horizontal line 10 m above the spillway and you have your answer.
 
  • #10
Baluncore said:
Draw a horizontal line 10 m above the spillway and you have your answer.
Note that this is below the highest junction. So do you not get a 10m high column above the spillway in the left hand vertical and a 10m column in the right hand sloped pipes?
 
  • #11
Baluncore said:
Draw a horizontal line 10 m above the spillway and you have your answer.
consindering volumes, molecular weights and tank a pipe junction is approximately 14 meters above catch tank water level?
 
  • #12
mcmpw said:
consindering volumes, molecular weights ...
They are irrelevant in this case. Water is still water, and hydrostatic pressure is a simple function of height, not of volume.
mcmpw said:
...and tank a pipe junction is approximately 14 meters above catch tank water level
That makes a slow siphon. After the initial flow, water will evaporate on the high side and condense lower down on the other side. It will take time, but an equilibrium will be reached.

The circuit was clearly designed originally as a potential PMM. As fascinating as you may find it, every PMM must evolve complexity, sufficient to baffle its designer and aficionados. The beauty of engineering and physics is that we can identify and reject the analysis of PMMs.

In a nutshell, it is a useless mechanism, that I do not consider worthy of deeper analysis.
 
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  • #13
Baluncore said:
The circuit was clearly designed originally as a potential PMM. As fascinating as you may find it, every PMM must evolve complexity, sufficient to baffle its designer and aficionados. The beauty of engineering and physics is that we can identify and reject the analysis of PMMs.

In a nutshell, it is a useless mechanism, that I do not consider worthy of deeper analysis.
I agree, though the way I'd say it is:
  • Most perpetual motion machines are just complicated enough that the designer can't identify the flaw.
  • Engineers/scientists can easily identify the natural law violation, so they don't need to bother unraveling the complexity of the machine to identify its flaw (if they don't want to). As you said, not worthy of deeper analysis.
 
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  • #14
Baluncore said:
water will evaporate on the high side and condense lower down on the other side. It will take time, but an equilibrium will be reached
prior natural evaporating and condensing, where water stands in each tank and line?.........and with heavy oil covering, water evaporate or no?

[Mentor Note -- post edited to remove a mild insult]
 
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  • #15
Baluncore said:
The circuit was clearly designed originally as a potential PMM. As fascinating as you may find it, every PMM must evolve complexity, sufficient to baffle its designer and aficionados. The beauty of engineering and physics is that we can identify and reject the analysis of PMMs.

In a nutshell, it is a useless mechanism, that I do not consider worthy of deeper analysis.
Agreed; this thread is done now. @mcmpw -- please do not post again about this here at PF. Thank you.
 
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FAQ: At what level will the water settle in this system?

What factors determine the water level in a connected system of containers?

The water level in a connected system of containers is determined by the principles of fluid statics, primarily the concept that water will seek to equalize its level across connected containers due to gravity. Factors such as the shape and size of the containers, the presence of any barriers or valves, and the initial volume of water added to the system all play a role.

How does the shape of the containers affect the final water level?

The shape of the containers does not affect the final water level if they are open to the atmosphere and connected at the bottom. Regardless of the containers' shapes, the water will settle at the same height in all containers, assuming they are at the same elevation and there is no pressure difference between them.

Will the water level be the same in all containers if they are of different heights?

Yes, the water level will be the same in all connected containers regardless of their individual heights, as long as they are open to the atmosphere and connected at the bottom. This is due to the principle of communicating vessels, where water levels equalize to reach the same height.

What happens to the water level if one container is sealed?

If one container is sealed, the water levels in the connected containers will not equalize. The sealed container will create a pressure difference, preventing the water from reaching the same level as in the open containers. The final water levels will depend on the volume of air trapped and the pressure inside the sealed container.

How does adding more water to one container affect the system?

Adding more water to one container in a connected system will cause the water levels in all containers to rise until they reach a new equilibrium. The added volume of water will distribute itself evenly across the connected containers, maintaining the same water level in each.

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