Calculus vs Calculus for Engineers (The community college only has the former)

[SeasonalBeef]

I'm doing 2 years at a community college before transferring to a university for the last 2 years to become a Civil engineer. I was looking at the courses at the university, granted these are for all 8 semesters not simply post transfer courses. One thing I saw was that the 3 calculus classes are calculus for engineers. However the community college is go to only offers regular calculus. And I can't skip these courses and take them instead at the university because they are required to transfer.

So I have some questions:

1. Does this mean I'll need to retake these classes at the university?

2. If I don't need to retake them how much will I not benefit and be behind in understanding by taking regular calculus vs calculus for engineering?

 

[fresh_42]

I think the basic difference is the amount of practice of actual problems. Calculus by itself is likely very theoretical, whereas calculus for engineers has likely more problems to solve. Whether you have to retake the course or not is hard to tell. Just ask the university!

As far as content is concerned, I recommend taking ordinary calculus and additionally studying these books:
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0007BNL1W/?tag=pfamazon01-20
https://www.amazon.com/dp/1941691242/?tag=pfamazon01-20

The first one is quite expensive, but it is a classic book and you can always use it to look up technics.

 

[vela]

Calculus for engineers is likely more application oriented than the regular calculus course. Personally, I think you'd be better off taking the regular calculus course. You'll get plenty of practice doing calculations in your other classes. Also, you get a fair amount of practice applying concepts in the typical lower-division calculus already. It's worth being exposed to a little of the theory behind the applications, just to learn how to think.

I'd expect at the university, engineering majors have a choice between taking calculus for engineers and the regular calculus course, so I don't think you have to worry about having to retake any calculus course. You should ask the university engineering department if you're still concerned.

 

[MidgetDwarf]

I believe the distinction between Calculus and Calculus for Engineers. Is that the Calculus class may be aimed at math majors, which would probably have proof, and theory.
The Calculus for Engineers may be a class based on a more calculation version. Ie., something like Stewart

 

[mpresic3]

Perhaps the best answer will come from a professor / department chairman in the university you wish to attend after community college. Be prepared to inform them about the textbook being used for problems in your calculus class, and perhaps the syllabus for the classes. It is possible the university mentions calculus for engineers to distinguish it from other forms of calculus. For example, in my school we had 4 different sequences:

1. Honors calculus: A two-year sequence that included credit for undergraduate real analysis.
2. Calculus (for engineers) a 3 semester sequence that was quite rigorous (the usual one for STEM)
3. A year of Calculus for Biology/Pre-med who would not be expected to go any further in Math
4. A Survey of calculus for "math appreciation" to fill an elective requirement in arts/music/ etc.

The university professor for your particular candidate university can give you the best answer as to whether your calculus qualifies. I think in most cases, it will, if you are using Thomas, Stewart, and many others. The university likely wants programs at the level of 1 or 2 above. In community colleges, you will not often get the sequence 1 above.

Another possible source for the answer lies in a faculty member in the community college you are attending. Sometimes, community colleges have "articulation agreements" with specific 4 year institution that accept the courses at community colleges fully or partially. A faculty member might know or can find out more detail on the specifics of the articulation agreement and what grade etc, you might need to get appropriate credit.

Best of Luck

 

[Frabjous]

My guess is that it is just semantics. If the community college is only offering one calculus sequence, it is probably the applied one. It is something to confirm.

 

[Astronuc]

1. Does this mean I'll need to retake these classes at the university?

One should consult the faculty advisor(s) in the Civil Engineering department at the university one expects to attend.

2. If I don't need to retake them how much will I not benefit and be behind in understanding by taking regular calculus vs calculus for engineering?

One should not be behind with a Calculus class as opposed to Calculus for Engineers. In my high school, students who took Calculus also took chemistry and physics. At the university, engineering and physics students took the same calculus courses through the second year.

 

[symbolipoint]

I'm doing 2 years at a community college before transferring to a university for the last 2 years to become a Civil engineer. I was looking at the courses at the university, granted these are for all 8 semesters not simply post transfer courses. One thing I saw was that the 3 calculus classes are calculus for engineers. However the community college is go to only offers regular calculus. And I can't skip these courses and take them instead at the university because they are required to transfer.

So I have some questions:

1. Does this mean I'll need to retake these classes at the university?

2. If I don't need to retake them how much will I not benefit and be behind in understanding by taking regular calculus vs calculus for engineering?

I have some trouble understanding clearly what you ask and describe. Does your community college deliver a set of common basic courses for Engineering students? The recommendation should list at least three consecutive Calculus courses and maybe one more blended with linear algebra and differential equations. These should correspond very closely to whichever uni program you expect to transfer yourself to. The c.c. should offer and list as for science & engineer students Calculus 1 (mostly differential, and intro to integration), Calculus 2 ( Integration, Integrals, other things) , and Intermediate-or-alsocalled-Multivariable Calculus.

Do not skip any of these at your community college. Go in sequence. You MAY need to repeat one of them AT the university in case you did poorly with the equivalent course at the community college.

 

[SeasonalBeef]

I have some trouble understanding clearly what you ask and describe. Does your community college deliver a set of common basic courses for Engineering students? The recommendation should list at least three consecutive Calculus courses and maybe one more blended with linear algebra and differential equations. These should correspond very closely to whichever uni program you expect to transfer yourself to. The c.c. should offer and list as for science & engineer students Calculus 1 (mostly differential, and intro to integration), Calculus 2 ( Integration, Integrals, other things) , and Intermediate-or-alsocalled-Multivariable Calculus.

Do not skip any of these at your community college. Go in sequence. You MAY need to repeat one of them AT the university in case you did poorly with the equivalent course at the community college.

To put plainly the class titles at the community college are "calculus 1,2,3"

On the university website for the engineering degree the class titles are "Calculus for engineers 1,2,3"

The community college does not have "Calculus for engineers 1,2,3" they only have "Calculus 1,2,3" so I was wondering what the difference was and the significance of that difference. To transfer I need to take Calculus 1,2,3, linear algebra, differential equations. There may be more ill have to look. But I was just curious as to why in order to transfer I need to take Calculus 1,2,3 but had I instead started at the university and not the community college I would have needed to take Calculus for engineers 1,2,3 abd by not taking that at the community college as it's not a provided class will I need to take those classes again or if not what will I be losing out on by not taking them. Though this question has been somewhat answered.

 

[symbolipoint]

rious as to why in order to transfer I need to take Calculus 1,2,3 but had I instead started at the university and not the community college I would have needed to take Calculus for engineers 1,2,3 abd by not taking that at the community college as it's not a provided class will I need to take those classes again or if not what will I be losing out on by not taking them. Though this question has been somewhat answered.

Strong belief is the two course sequences are equivalent.

 

[dlgoff]

@SeasonalBeef
At my University, I started out working toward a BS in Physics which required Calculus 1,2,3, linear algebra & multi-variable calculus, and differential equations but switched to the School of Engineering working toward a BS in Engineering Physics. Both programs had the same above requirements. So in my opinion, I don't think it really matters which ones you take.

BTW, the reason I switched was that the School of Engineering didn't require a foreign language and other Social Science courses. I used those hours for other Math and Engineering courses.

 

[fresh_42]

Strong belief is the two course sequences are equivalent.

I think you are wrong, and you probably won't rely on such an opinion. I strongly recommend asking the university, before studying three semesters in vain! I have had calculus 1,2,3 which was basically real, vector, complex analysis. I have also seen exams for engineers. There is a significant difference. The curriculum for engineers is way closer to actual problems, integral techniques, vector fields, and Cauchy integrals than the curriculum for mathematicians is. There is a reason why jokes along the lines:
Engineer: "About 3."
Physicist: "3.1 within 5 sigma."
Mathematician: "There exists a solution."
work.

 

[symbolipoint]

I think you are wrong, and you probably won't rely on such an opinion. I strongly recommend asking the university, before studying three semesters in vain! I have had calculus 1,2,3 which was basically real, vector, complex analysis. I have also seen exams for engineers. There is a significant difference. The curriculum for engineers is way closer to actual problems, integral techniques, vector fields, and Cauchy integrals than the curriculum for mathematicians is. There is a reason why jokes along the lines:
Engineer: "About 3."
Physicist: "3.1 within 5 sigma."
Mathematician: "There exists a solution."
work.

That makes no sense.
SeasonalBeef can read the course descriptions of the different Calculus courses for the two institutions and can ask people from the two different departments and find the insight he needs.

 

[vela]

I think you are wrong, and you probably won't rely on such an opinion. I strongly recommend asking the university, before studying three semesters in vain!

I seriously doubt this would be the case, at least in the US. In the OP's case, he has to take the courses regardless of whether it counts as Calculus for Engineer because he needs to take them to satisfy transfer requirements, and the courses will almost certainly satisfy the calculus requirements for his major. But if he really wants to be sure, he needs to ask the school in question.

 

[SeasonalBeef]

I seriously doubt this would be the case, at least in the US. In the OP's case, he has to take the courses regardless of whether it counts as Calculus for Engineer because he needs to take them to satisfy transfer requirements, and the courses will almost certainly satisfy the calculus requirements for his major. But if he really wants to be sure, he needs to ask the school in question.

I think this is the best answer. Should I contact the university advisors?

 

[fresh_42]

I think this is the best answer. Should I contact the university advisors?

Yes. It is way cheaper to ask than it is to make a mistake. And whatever a stranger says on the internet: it is irrelevant.

 

[CrysPhys]

I think this is the best answer. Should I contact the university advisors?

By now it should be abundantly clear that the answer is a resounding, "Yes!" Furthermore, contacting the university advisors is the only thing you should do. Your initial question ("What are the differences between a 'Calculus' program and a 'Calculus for Engineers' program?") was based on the premise that there is a formal standardized Calculus program and a formal standardized Calculus for Engineers program for all universities. That premise is incorrect.

So the questions you should be asking are, "What are the differences between the Calculus program offerred at my community college and the Calculus for Engineers program offerred at the university I plan to transfer to? What (if any) transfer credits will I receive? What (if any) supplemental courses will I need to take when I become an engineering major at the university?" Only the advisors at the specific university of interest can answer those questions. The policies of other community colleges and other universities are irrelevant to your specific scenario.

[When I was an undergrad, the first three semesters of math were the same for all students, regardless of their intended major (math, science, engineering, or other). Math courses forked into different courses for different majors in the fourth semester.]