Change of Variables Question with chain rule

In summary: But with ##\frac{\partial}{\partial y}\left( \frac{\partial f}{\partial x} \right)##, you read this right to left, meaning that you differentiate wrt x first, then with respect to y. That is the reason that physicists and engineers often use superscripts instead of subscripts, as in ##f^{xy}##, which is read from left to right, just like ##f_{xy}##, meaning that you differentiate wrt x first and then with respect to y.In summary, using the change of variables s = x-y and t = x-(1/3)y, we can determine the first and second derivatives of u with respect to x and y in terms of
  • #1
RYANDTRAVERS
11
0

Homework Statement


Consider the function of two variables:
u(x,y) = f(x-y) + g(x+(1/3)y)
where f(s) and g(t) are each arbitrary functions of a single variable.

Using the change of variables:
s = x-y
t = x-(1/3)y

use the chain rule to determine the first and second derivatives of u with respect to x and y in terms of derivatives of f and g.

Hence, show that the second derivatives satisfy
u_xx = 2u_xy + 3u_yy

where u_xx is the second derivative of u with respect to x, etc.

The Attempt at a Solution


My attempt, along with the original question paper, is attached as a PDF. It looks very fiddly but I have attempted the question a few times and still can’t satisfy the last equation.
 

Attachments

  • Scan1.pdf
    2.1 MB · Views: 252
  • Scan2.pdf
    2.1 MB · Views: 266
  • Scan3.pdf
    2.3 MB · Views: 246
  • Scan4.pdf
    1.1 MB · Views: 219
Last edited:
Physics news on Phys.org
  • #2
Dear RY&T,

It's not all that difficult to use the subscript button on the green menu bar. makes life a lot easier for you and us...

Anyway, I'm not completely happy with ux = uf fs + ug gt
uf and ug are trivially 1 and I propose to carry it a little further:
ux = fs fx + gt gx
where fx and gx are trivially 1 also, leaving ux = fs + gt
(which incidentally may well be what you intended).

Similarly, uy = fs fy + gt gy = - fs + gt/3

The next step (on scan2 -- by the way: PF frowns on posting pictures when you can also type it out using the buttons -- or better: LaTeX) is a derailment:

uxx is the derivative of fs + gt and that certainly is not the same as ux ux :H !

Simply repeat what you did with u to get ux:

uxx = ( fs + gt )x = ( fs )x + ( gt )x

analogously with uyy and uxy (which I think is (uy)x -- someone correct me if I am wrong here -- too long ago :rolleyes: )

- [edit] corrected myself -- see post #4
 
Last edited:
  • #3
I agree with you that uf and ug are trivially 1; however, with the uxx there is the derivative operator with respect to x acting on ux to give uxx. I wasn't multiplying ux by ux.
 
  • #4
Hi,

I see what you mean. It just looked a lot like multiplying. Still a derailment to interpret ##\partial\over \partial x## as ##(f_s {\partial\over \partial f }+ g_t {\partial\over \partial g})##.

The incomplete way to write ##u_x## avenges itself somewhat.

Instead you want to differentiate ##u_x = u_f f_s s_x + u_g g_t t_x = f_s+g_t ## as ##(f_s)_x + (g_t)_x##. Write it out.

[edit]Or, if you want to write the whole thing, e.g. for the first term:

##{\partial\over \partial x} u_f f_s s_x = u_{fx} f_s s_x+u_f f_{sx} s_x+u_f f_s s_{xx}##​

And treat ##f_s## in ##(f_s)_x## the same way as you treated ##f## in ##(f)_x##:rolleyes: I have now also corrected myself in post #2. Really had to look it up: ##f_{xy} = (f_x)_y = \partial_{yx}f = {\partial^2f\over \partial y \partial x}={\partial\over \partial y}\left(\partial f\over \partial x\right )##

-
 
Last edited:
  • #5
BvU said:
:rolleyes: I have now also corrected myself in post #2. Really had to look it up: ##f_{xy} = (f_x)_y = \partial_{yx}f = {\partial^2f\over \partial y \partial x}={\partial\over \partial y}\left(\partial f\over \partial x\right )##
Yes, the notation is counterintuitive, with ##f_{xy}## being read one way and ##\frac{\partial}{\partial y}\left( \frac{\partial f}{\partial x} \right)## being read the other way. IOW, with ##f_{xy}##, you read this left to right, meaning that you differentiate wrt x first, then with respect to y.
 

Related to Change of Variables Question with chain rule

What is a change of variables question with chain rule?

A change of variables question with chain rule is a mathematical problem that involves using the chain rule to solve for the derivative or integral of a function when the variables are changed. It is commonly used in calculus and other areas of mathematics to simplify calculations and solve complex problems.

What is the chain rule?

The chain rule is a rule in calculus that allows us to find the derivative of a composite function. It states that the derivative of a composite function is equal to the derivative of the outer function multiplied by the derivative of the inner function.

Why is the chain rule important in change of variables questions?

The chain rule is important in change of variables questions because it allows us to break down a complex function into simpler functions and find the derivative or integral of the entire function using the derivatives or integrals of the individual parts. This makes solving for the derivative or integral of a function with changed variables much easier and more efficient.

What are some common examples of change of variables questions with chain rule?

Some common examples of change of variables questions with chain rule include finding the derivative or integral of a function with trigonometric, logarithmic, or exponential functions, or when the variables are expressed in terms of other variables or functions.

How can I approach solving a change of variables question with chain rule?

To solve a change of variables question with chain rule, first identify the individual parts of the composite function and use the chain rule to find the derivatives or integrals of each part. Then, substitute these derivatives or integrals back into the original function to find the final solution. It is also important to carefully consider the chain rule and any other relevant rules or formulas to ensure an accurate solution.

Similar threads

  • Calculus and Beyond Homework Help
Replies
2
Views
439
  • Calculus and Beyond Homework Help
Replies
2
Views
1K
  • Calculus and Beyond Homework Help
Replies
2
Views
537
  • Calculus and Beyond Homework Help
Replies
5
Views
1K
  • Calculus and Beyond Homework Help
Replies
9
Views
2K
  • Calculus and Beyond Homework Help
Replies
3
Views
1K
  • Calculus and Beyond Homework Help
Replies
3
Views
1K
  • Calculus and Beyond Homework Help
Replies
23
Views
2K
  • Calculus and Beyond Homework Help
Replies
8
Views
770
  • Calculus and Beyond Homework Help
Replies
5
Views
3K
Back
Top