Could the LHC Really Create Earth-Eating Black Holes?

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In summary, the lawsuit seeking to stop the LHC from operating was dismissed by a Hawaiian judge. There is still a disagreement among scientists about the possible ramifications of the LHC, but this should be resolved through congress rather than the federal courts.
  • #1
Mk
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http://fliptomato.wordpress.com/2008/03/28/litigious-lhc/
In the case Sancho & Wagner v. DOE, CERN, NSF, W. Wagner and L. Sancho are litigating (the American way) to postpone the LHC. Their reason? There should be further investigation of the possible production of environmental threats such as: Earth-eating black holes, Earth-eating strangelets, Earth-enslaving armies of apes from parallel dimensions, or even the dreaded ManBearPig. [...] This isn’t the first time the LHC has been cast as a `doomsday machine.’ The Cocktail Party Physicist wrote a nice piece on it a while ago, and you can find references all over the blogosphere [1]. The whole `LHC can destroy the world’ scenario had been something of a running joke among physicists, until the press pounced on it and a few people took it too seriously.
Sanchez & Wagner v. DOE
http://cosmiclog.msnbc.msn.com/archive/2008/03/27/823924.aspx

Hmmmmm...
 
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  • #2
But I love that album!

Oh, the LHC?

God damn Hawaiians, they have sun, fruit, the ocean, hot women, and they STILL complain?
 
  • #3
One of the plaintiffs claimed to have discovered the magnetic mono-pole, sorry but that's where I would stop listening to him.
 
  • #5
mbrmbrg said:
I prefer the http://www.nytimes.com/2008/03/29/science/29collider.html?_r=1&pagewanted=2&th&emc=th&oref=slogin". So... assuming this is crackpottery (which it sure sounds like), why the patooties is it ending up all over the media?

Because the media can't tell the difference between crackpottery and legitimate news either. Besides, it makes for an eye-grabbing headlines that sells.

This is just one example where "crackpots" are no longer just confined to being internet nuisance.

Zz.
 
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  • #6
I don't understand what the big deal is! I think it would be a crime to spend all this money on a collider and then to not turn it on to see all the super-cool results.
Look at it another way -- even if they DO end up creating a black hole on Earth, such an event could only galvanize public support for funding a massive star-trek style human project to colonize the solar system! And who here can be against THAT? :)

In all seriousness (not that this lawsuit actually deserves it), let's hope that just like the other much-hyped lets-settle-science-in-the-courts type case (the Dover evolution trial), the judge will be convinced by a little thing called highly unambigious science.
 
  • #7
mbrmbrg said:
I prefer the http://www.nytimes.com/2008/03/29/science/29collider.html?_r=1&pagewanted=2&th&emc=th&oref=slogin". So... assuming this is crackpottery (which it sure sounds like), why the patooties is it ending up all over the media?

because scary news stories sell! I remember reading something like this back when RHIC was turning on. In fact, if anything, this time around I havn't read anything on the possibility of creating a false vacuum that engulfs the rest of the universe. So I guess, we should all be happy because this is progress.
 
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  • #8
Mike Cookson said:
One of the plaintiffs claimed to have discovered the magnetic mono-pole

That's a claim that bound to go south!
 
  • #9
No, actually, he discovered an entirely north monopole.
 
  • #10
Why Hawaiians? The LHC is way the hell away from them, no?
 
  • #11
binzing said:
Why Hawaiians? The LHC is way the hell away from them, no?

Yeah, they live on volcanoes, but are worried about the LHC? :smile:
 
  • #12
Lawsuit status update: http://cosmiclog.msnbc.msn.com/archive/2008/06/16/1146317.aspx"
Highlights
  • Trial date is set for June 16, 2009.
  • The federal government plans to file for dismissal by June 24, 2008.
  • Luis Sancho and Walter Wagner plan to file for a preliminary injunction that would put a hold on LHC operations.
  • The two motions, once filed, could be heard together during a yet-to-be-scheduled session.
 
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  • #13
CERN doomsday black hole lawsuit dismissed by Hawaiian judge:

http://www.starbulletin.com/news/hawaiinews/20080928_Doomsday_suit_dismissed.html

U.S. District Court Judge Helen Gillmor dismissed a so-called "doomsday lawsuit" filed in Hawaii to stop the operation of a subatomic particle accelerator in Europe.

Gillmor said the plaintiffs failed to prove that U.S. support of the project is a "major federal action" under the National Environmental Policy Act.

The judge noted that the United States provided $531 million for the construction of the $5.84 billion collider; less than 10 percent of the total cost.

Unfortunately, this judge seems to have taken seriously some of the popular sensationalism surrounding this case when she writes that

She said there is a disagreement among scientists about the possible ramifications of the collider.

"This extremely complex debate is of concern to more than just physicists," Gillmor said.

Is this over?

But [the judge] said the proper venue for the debate over U.S. support for the program is in Congress, not the federal courts.

Let's hope that if this goes to congress, that the congresspeople don't base their decision to support (or withdraw) future physics funding by hearing about this type of sensationalism from the popular press.
 

Related to Could the LHC Really Create Earth-Eating Black Holes?

1. What is the "Hawaiins Sueing Doomsday Machine"?

The "Hawaiins Sueing Doomsday Machine" is a fictional scenario that has been used in various scientific discussions and thought experiments. It involves the idea of a group of Hawaiians filing a lawsuit against the creators of a doomsday machine, claiming that it poses a threat to their well-being and the environment.

2. Is there a real doomsday machine that exists?

No, the concept of a doomsday machine is purely hypothetical and has not been created in reality. It is often used as a thought experiment to explore the potential consequences of advanced technology and the responsibility of its creators.

3. What are the potential dangers of a doomsday machine?

A doomsday machine is a theoretical device that has the power to destroy all life on earth. The potential danger lies in the fact that it could be activated accidentally or intentionally, leading to catastrophic consequences for humanity and the planet.

4. Why would Hawaiians be the ones to sue the creators of a doomsday machine?

The use of Hawaiians in this thought experiment is purely symbolic and does not pertain to any specific group or culture. It is simply used to represent the idea of a group of people who are directly affected by the potential dangers of a doomsday machine.

5. Can a doomsday machine be stopped once it has been activated?

It is impossible to definitively answer this question as a doomsday machine does not exist in reality. However, it is assumed that once activated, a doomsday machine cannot be stopped and its effects would be irreversible.

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