Deriving Navier-Stokes: Lagrangian & Hamiltonian Methods

In summary, the conversation discusses the possibility of deriving the Navier-Stokes equations using Lagrangian and Hamiltonian methods. The speaker mentions trying to Google the question and not finding a satisfactory answer, leading them to ask for help. The possibility of using these methods is mentioned, as well as a resource for further reading on the topic.
  • #1
Hari Seldon
5
1
Is that possible to derive the Navier-Stokes equations with Lagrangian and Hamiltonian methods? If yes, how? and if it is not possible, why?
 
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  • #2
Did you try Googling this question first? It seems to turn up several hits.
 
  • #3
Hello, thank you for your reply. Yes, I tried to Google it, but I didn't find what I wanted. I expected an approach like, for example, estabilish the generalized coordinates, calculate the kinetic energy and so on. Finally, that is why I wrote here, I tought that maybe I was thinking in a wrong way.
boneh3ad said:
Did you try Googling this question first? It seems to turn up several hits.
 
  • #4
Hari Seldon said:
Is that possible to derive the Navier-Stokes equations with Lagrangian and Hamiltonian methods? If yes, how? and if it is not possible, why?
the Navier-Stokes is a system with energy dissipation. The variational principle for the Euler equations is contained in M. Taylor's PDE vol 3
 
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Likes Hari Seldon, Orodruin and vanhees71
  • #5
Hari Seldon said:
Is that possible to derive the Navier-Stokes equations with Lagrangian and Hamiltonian methods? If yes, how? and if it is not possible, why?
It seems to some that those equations could be approached with such methods:

An Eulerian-Lagrangian approach to the Navier-Stokes equations. ##-## by Peter Constantin ##-## https://web.math.princeton.edu/~const/xlnsF.pdf
 

FAQ: Deriving Navier-Stokes: Lagrangian & Hamiltonian Methods

What is the Navier-Stokes equation and why is it important in fluid dynamics?

The Navier-Stokes equation is a set of partial differential equations that describe the motion of fluid particles in a continuous medium. It is important in fluid dynamics because it allows scientists to predict the behavior of fluids in various scenarios, such as in pipes, around objects, and in turbulent flows.

What is the difference between the Lagrangian and Hamiltonian methods for deriving the Navier-Stokes equation?

The Lagrangian method is a mathematical approach that describes the fluid motion in terms of individual fluid particles, while the Hamiltonian method describes the fluid motion in terms of the overall energy of the system. The Lagrangian method is often used for problems involving small-scale fluid motion, while the Hamiltonian method is more suitable for large-scale fluid motion.

How do the Navier-Stokes equations account for the effects of viscosity and turbulence?

The Navier-Stokes equations incorporate the effects of viscosity and turbulence through the inclusion of the viscous stress tensor and the turbulent stress tensor, respectively. These terms account for the friction and random fluctuations within the fluid that affect its motion.

Can the Navier-Stokes equations be solved analytically?

No, the Navier-Stokes equations cannot be solved analytically for most real-world scenarios. This is due to their nonlinear nature and the complex boundary conditions that are often present in fluid dynamics problems. Instead, numerical methods and approximations are used to solve these equations.

What are some applications of the Navier-Stokes equations?

The Navier-Stokes equations have numerous applications in various fields, including aerodynamics, weather prediction, oceanography, and engineering. They are used to design efficient aircraft and cars, understand weather patterns, and optimize the performance of turbines and pumps, among others.

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