Exploring the Scientific Validity of Ghosts: Personal Experiences and Theories

[CosmicEye]

I like to ask this question every now and then to new people. So what do you think, real or a bedtime story that has been taken too far?

Me personally, I absolutely believe in ghosts. As a kid I had this crazy experience that lasted all night long and I can't even begin to explain. I've only told a few people but everyone thinks I am smoking crack by the time I finished. One of my friends mom has a eye for the supernatural and I've heard some crazy stories from her.

Aside from demons and evil posessions, what do you think and how do you feel about ghosts. Have you ever had a personal experience? How do you even explain them in a physical sense or scientifically? I am curious to the responses from the scientific community..

PS: Ghost Hunters is awesome and pure proof.

 

[Ivan92]

I personally don't believe in ghosts. It is all in the mind for me. The mind is very powerful and science can account for most paranormal activity.

There is a thread all ready dealing with Ghost Hunters.

https://www.physicsforums.com/showthread.php?t=522083

 

[CosmicEye]

Well I don't really agree with the EMF and the K2 sensors that they use, but they have caught some pretty wild stuff on camera; thing moving, sounds and voices, and most importantly full body abaritions in front of the camera and all. Thats their only credibility for me but its video proof that matters most.

As far as Ghost adventure, wtf... That show is so corny and waaaaay overdramatic. This juicehead guy in a shirt that could fit a 4th grade girl running around "OMG WHAT WAS THAT, DID YOU HEAR THAT! OMG THAT WAS A GHOST!" Nope, don't sit there and listen to it, run around like a little baby making all the noise in the world. They never catch anything on camera anyways. Ghost Hunters is actually professional about it.

But screw all that crap. What do you people really personally think regardless of the shows that air?

 

[Loren Booda]

Once I was tormented by "the devil," and that was enough.

 

[Ivan Seeking]

Have you ever had a personal experience? How do you even explain them in a physical sense or scientifically? I am curious to the responses from the scientific community..

PS: Ghost Hunters is awesome and pure proof.

The Ghost Hunters is proof of nothing, but my wife and I both had a number of strange experiences in our second apartment, so I understand the interest.

Do strange things happen that seem to defy explanation. On that I would have to say yes according to our own experiences. Do I think it was dead person making contact with the living? That is a far different question and I have no idea. I have no reason to default to that as an explanation.

 

[Ivan Seeking]

I've told the story before. He's a copy

The short of it is that we each felt something of significant weight sit on the bed; like a person that wasn't there. I was home alone, had just gone to bed, and was still wide awake when, just as plain as day, I felt a depression form in the mattress near my feet. I layed there for a moment while trying to figure out what I was feeling. I turned, looked, saw the two cats in their normal spot, and then looked directly at the source of the weight still pulling the blankets tightly around my legs. It was unmistakable that someone was there, but there was nothing there. For a moment I even expected to be assaulted by an intruder. Someone had to be in that room, but beyond a doubt I was the only person in the room or even at home. Honestly, it scared the hell out of me. I ran - not walked - out of the room and slept on the couch after I finally managed to settle down.

The key for me - the undeniable proof - is that I had never told Tsu about what happened. Some weeks later when I was out of town and called her - having just arrived at my parents house some 500 miles away - her voice was still shaking as she described an experience that was nearly identical to mine. After that, as long as we lived there we experienced the occasional presence of a strong, flowery odor that would fill the room suddenly and leave just as quickly. It was like opening or even spilling a bottle of perfume in the room. This was in an apartment with virtually no air exchange. We had a sealed heat pump systems and three closed windows.

 

[TheStatutoryApe]

I have had odd experiences but in every situation where I was able to investigate further I found that there was a rather mundane explanation. When I first started working security at night it was rather eerie walking around at night, hearing random noises, and seeing things move in areas that were pretty much deserted save for myself. After a while, especially once you get used to a particular place, the creepiness effect wares off and it mostly seems rather mundane.

 

[Ryan_m_b]

Unexplained phenomenon are by definition unexplained. They absolutely are not evidence for the paranormal. Science works like this:

• Observe a phenomenon
• Hypothesise an explanation that is consistent with current science
• Design an appropriate experiment
• Either accept or reject the hypothesis

All proper scientific studies of the paranormal have shown the phenomenon to either be natural or unexplained (and mostly the former). There is no known method by which any paranormal phenomenon could occur and TV shows are not evidence for anything. They have a specific demographic to entertain and thus will do whatever they can (lie, act, distort the truth) to sell the program.

 

[collinsmark]

The concept of a ghost makes for a great movie plot. I love ghost/supernatural/scary movies.

They're my favorite. Especially with popcorn, if you've got it.

But I don't take it much farther than that.

 

[Tosh5457]

What I don't get is how people like Anne Germaine can know the details of your life. It's true that I've only seen on TV, but she spoken with so many people in 1 show that it'd have to be a big lie for that to be fake. She looks like the typical scam artist, but if she's a scammer I don't see how she does it...
It'd be cool if Houdini was here today to try finding it out...

 

[Ryan_m_b]

What I don't get is how people like Anne Germaine can know the details of your life. It's true that I've only seen on TV, but she spoken with so many people in 1 show that it'd have to be a big lie for that to be fake. She looks like the typical scam artist, but if she's a scammer I don't see how she does it...
It'd be cool if Houdini was here today to try finding it out...

Things like http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cold_reading" and other tricks. I can't find a link now but earlier this year I saw a documentary on megachurch scams. They would do things like get everyone to fill out a prayer card for their problem, then these would be read and cross checked with tickets. The preacher would do his usual "praise jesus" stuff and then pick a 'random' member of the audience. He would proceed to be filled with the voice of God and know everything about this person, then he'd cure their disease or w/e it was. In reality he had an earpiece and people were reading him information.

http://www.randi.org/site/" has done a lot of work into this. Remember that "miraculous" feats are not evidence of the miraculous, they are evidence of the appearance of miracles. The explanation for this is always trickery.

 

[lisab]

I don't believe in the supernatural, period.

 

[HeLiXe]

I don't believe in the supernatural, period.

You don't believe in me?

I have always thought that the perception of ghosts may have something to do with the brain's interpretation of "energy waves" which may be similar to brainwaves or something but alas... I have no evidence or proof of this, it is just something I ponder.

 

[Ryan_m_b]

I have always thought that the perception of ghosts may have something to do with the brain's interpretation of "energy waves" which may be similar to brainwaves or something but alas... I have no evidence or proof of this, it is just something I ponder.

Is this sarcasm? If so lol, if not it makes no sense. I know that this is GD but this thread is pretty foolish...

 

[HeLiXe]

I was definitely not being sarcastic, and I have no proof of it so it may not make any sense...and who are you to judge me?

I guess I am being facetious after all -_- sorry. I blame the History Channel for filling my mind with things to ponder. "God on the Brain."

 

[I like Serena]

I don't believe in the supernatural, period.

As I have understood it "supernatural" is basically anything that is as yet not explained by empirical science.
If we find a phenomenon that is reproducible and measurable, we'll just incorporate it into our physical laws of nature.
So yes, I do believe in the supernatural since I do not believe we have discovered all the laws of nature yet. :)

 

[lisab]

As I have understood it "supernatural" is basically anything that is as yet not explained by empirical science.
If we find a phenomenon that is reproducible and measurable, we'll just incorporate it into our physical laws of nature.
So yes, I do believe in the supernatural. :)

Ah, I was using the word to mean, "Of or relating to existence outside the natural world", so it would not be measurable. Alternatively, "make-believe".

 

[I like Serena]

Ah, I was using the word to mean, "Of or relating to existence outside the natural world", so it would not be measurable. Alternatively, "make-believe".

Isn't that just an interpretation?
We cannot know for sure if a "supernatural" phenomenon is outside the natural world.
We can only believe that it is.

Btw, I do believe in "make-believe".
I do it all the time!
I call it daydreaming.

 

[rootX]

I would have voted if there were a third option: I don't care.

 

[FlexGunship]

I have always thought that the perception of ghosts may have something to do with the brain's interpretation of "energy waves" which may be similar to brainwaves or something but alas... I have no evidence or proof of this, it is just something I ponder.

That's not how brainwaves work. A brainwave is the rhythmic coordinated firing of a network of neurons. There isn't actually a "wave" to speak of. There is no propagation of a brainwave through a medium. It's more like turning the dimmer switch on a light from on to off over and over.

 

[russ_watters]

As I have understood it "supernatural" is basically anything that is as yet not explained by empirical science.
If we find a phenomenon that is reproducible and measurable, we'll just incorporate it into our physical laws of nature.
So yes, I do believe in the supernatural since I do not believe we have discovered all the laws of nature yet. :)[emphasis added]

That's not what "supernatural" means. The definition is "unexplainable..." http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/supernatural

 

[I like Serena]

That's not what "supernatural" means. The definition is "unexplainable..." http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/supernatural

I believe you're ripping it out of context: "unexplainable by natural law or phenomena".
In my interpretation that is unexplainable by our current laws of nature.
Or otherwise it is within our current laws, but we just have not explained it yet and believe it to be unexplainable.

Edit: I believe it to be unscientific to believe something does not exist, just because we cannot explain it (yet).

 

[HeLiXe]

I was definitely not being sarcastic, and I have no proof of it so it may not make any sense...and who are you to judge me?







I guess I am being facetious after all -_- sorry. I blame the History Channel for filling my mind with things to ponder. "God on the Brain."

That's not how brainwaves work. A brainwave is the rhythmic coordinated firing of a network of neurons. There isn't actually a "wave" to speak of. There is no propagation of a brainwave through a medium. It's more like turning the dimmer switch on a light from on to off over and over.

Thanks but I was actually just joking around -_-

 

[Ivan Seeking]

I believe you're ripping it out of context: "unexplainable by natural law or phenomena".
In my interpretation that is unexplainable by our current laws of nature.
Or otherwise it is within our current laws, but we just have not explained it yet and believe it to be unexplainable.

Edit: I believe it to be unscientific to believe something does not exist, just because we cannot explain it (yet).

I've been making the same argument here for years. Given that science doesn't accept the notion of the supernatural, to declare a claim to be supernatural is a judgement. The logic that often follows is that since the supernatural does not exist, the claim must be false. This implicitly denies the possibility that it may be an observation of an unrecognized natural phenomenon. Here, the word "ghost" has no specific meaning. Are we talking about souls of the dead, or do we mean the experiences that people claim to have? By using the word "ghost", we avoid having to make this distinction, and the question is meaningless.

By definition, any phenomenon that is real must be natural. So the word "supernatural" has no meaning unless one accepts the existence of such in the first place. And then the definition becomes arbitrary. Even devout believers don't deny the possibility that the so-called supernatural can me understood in a scientific context. That is why they use all of the equipment that they do in these ghost hunting adventures. Furthermore, phenomena once denied to exist, or claims relegated to the t file, such as rogue waves, ball lightning, sprites, earthlights, and even claims of wild, hairy, man-like creatures roaming the jungles of Africa - the great apes - are considered to be real. But there was a time when many people scoffed at all of these claims as nonsense, or as simple misinterpretations or misunderstandings.

 

[Ivan Seeking]

When you think about it, just the use of the word "supernatural" is a cop out. It is as if to say, not only do I require scientific evidence for a claim, but I also deny the possibility that you could have any. Therefore I will mock your claim.

It really is just a judgment masked as scientific rigor.

 

[lisab]

When you think about it, just the use of the word "supernatural" is a cop out. It is as if to say, not only do I require scientific evidence for a claim, but I also deny the possibility that you could have any. Therefore I will mock your claim.

It really is just a judgment masked as scientific rigor.

The definition of supernatural is:

1. Of or relating to existence outside the natural world.
2. Attributed to a power that seems to violate or go beyond natural forces.
3. Of or relating to a deity.
4. Of or relating to the immediate exercise of divine power; miraculous.
5. Of or relating to the miraculous

It's clear to me "supernatural" things are not in realm of science, which is precisely why I use the term as I do. I don't believe in the supernatural.

 

[Evo]

Looks like a good place to end.