Find Perfect Square $m,n \in N$ with $m^2-4n$ & $n^2-4m$

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In summary, the conversation discusses finding solutions for $m$ and $n$ if they are natural numbers and both $m^2-4n$ and $n^2-4m$ are perfect square numbers. It is mentioned that there may be restrictions, like $m > n$, and that there are infinite solutions if negative integers are allowed. The conversation also acknowledges that the original question may have a flaw.
  • #1
Albert1
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$m,n \in N$
if $m^2-4n ,\,\, and \,\, n^2-4m$ are all perfect square numbers , please find all $m$ and $n$
 
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  • #2
Should you not have some restrictions, like m > n?
Asking because these are 3 of the solutions:
m = 4, n = 4
m = 6, n = 5
m = 5, n = 6
 
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  • #3
Wilmer said:
Should you not have some restrictions, like m > n?
Asking because these are 3 of the solutions:
m = 4, n = 4
m = 6, n = 5
m = 5, n = 6
your answers are corret,please state with reason
 
  • #4
without loss of generality we can assume m >=n. if(m,n) is a solution then (n,m) is another
now 4n is even so $m^2 - 4n <= (m-2)^2$
or $-4n<=-4m + 4$
or $n >=m-1$

case 1)
$m=n$
then $m^2 -4m = m(m-4)$ is perfect square = $(k+2)(k-2)$ taking $k = m-2$

$(k+2)(k-2) = k^2 - 4 = p^2(say)$
$(k+p)(k-p) = 4$ so $k+ p = k- p = 2$ as both are even or both odd
so $k = 2, p = 0$ or $m = 4$
so solution $m=n= 4$

case 2)
$n >=m-1$
or $n = m- 1$
now $m^2- 4n = m^2-4(m-1) = (m-2)^2$ always whole square
check the other one
$n^2 - 4m = n^2 - 4(n+1) = n^2 - 4n - 4 = (n-2)^2 + 8 = q^2(say)$

or $(n+2)^2-q^2 = 8$ giving $n-2 + q =4$ and $n-2-q=2$ as both are even
solving $n= 5$ and as $m = n+1$ we have (m,n) = (6,5)
by symmetry (m,n) = (5,6)

combining both we have (m,n) = (6,5) or (5,6) or (4,4)
 
  • #5
Albert said:
your answers are correct,please state with reason
Sorry. Was intending to ask question only...gave those as examples.

Didn't realize negative integers were not allowed.
If they were, then there's infinite solutions:
if m = x then n = -(x + 1)
 
  • #6
Wilmer said:
Sorry. Was intending to ask question only...gave those as examples.

Didn't realize negative integers were not allowed.
If they were, then there's infinite solutions:
if m = x then n = -(x + 1)
yes this original qustion has a flaw:
here we treat $m^2-4n , and \, n^2-4m $ separately
 

FAQ: Find Perfect Square $m,n \in N$ with $m^2-4n$ & $n^2-4m$

What does $m^2-4n$ and $n^2-4m$ represent in the context of finding a perfect square?

In this context, $m^2-4n$ and $n^2-4m$ represent two different equations that must both equal a perfect square in order for $m$ and $n$ to be considered a solution. This means that both equations must have integer solutions in order for $m$ and $n$ to be perfect squares.

What is the importance of finding a perfect square in this scenario?

Finding a perfect square is important because it ensures that the solutions for $m$ and $n$ will be integers, which is necessary for both equations to equal a perfect square. It also narrows down the possibilities for $m$ and $n$, making it easier to find a solution.

Are there any specific strategies or methods for finding a perfect square in this scenario?

Yes, there are several strategies that can be used to find a perfect square in this scenario. One approach is to use trial and error, plugging in different values for $m$ and $n$ until both equations equal a perfect square. Another approach is to use algebraic manipulation and factoring to simplify the equations and identify possible solutions.

What are some common mistakes to avoid when trying to find a perfect square in this scenario?

One common mistake is to only focus on one of the equations and try to find a solution for $m$ or $n$ that makes that equation a perfect square. Both equations must equal a perfect square in order for $m$ and $n$ to be considered a solution. Additionally, it's important to check that the solutions for $m$ and $n$ make both equations true, as well as checking that they are both integers.

How does finding a perfect square in this scenario relate to other mathematical concepts?

Finding a perfect square in this scenario involves concepts such as algebraic manipulation, factoring, and number properties. It also relates to the concept of Diophantine equations, which involve finding integer solutions to polynomial equations. Additionally, finding a perfect square can be used in other mathematical problems such as finding Pythagorean triples or determining the solutions to Pell's equation.

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