I with this question about vectors

In summary: That and the now changed original position of Q. So now you can show us how you calculate Q and P's positions at time t. Then think about what must be true about Q-P for Q to be northeast of P at time t.
  • #36
Are you asking me to subtract the new coordinates of P and Q or the initial coordinates given in the question?
 
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  • #37
lioric said:
I m very confused
In post #25 it seems that the vectors are in the format that you asked (...)i+(...)j and you asked me to simply them. So I expanded them and now your asking me to revert them back again.
OK, never mind about the i and j comments.
This thread is getting very jumbled. There are multiple arithmetic errors and/or typos. In post #25 you have an arithmetic mistake in the new position of P. Then in post #32 you carried the same mistake through. Also in post #32 you dropped the ##t## in the calculation of Q-P, as I told you in post #33. Fix those. Once you finally get Q-P correct, with a ##t## in it, it is a simple one more step to finish your problem.
 
  • #38
LCKurtz said:
OK, never mind about the i and j comments.
This thread is getting very jumbled. There are multiple arithmetic errors and/or typos. In post #25 you have an arithmetic mistake in the new position of P. Then in post #32 you carried the same mistake through. Also in post #32 you dropped the ##t## in the calculation of Q-P, as I told you in post #33. Fix those. Once you finally get Q-P correct, with a ##t## in it, it is a simple one more step to finish your problem.
That's what I was clarifying in post 36
The initial P and Q position vectors given in the question has no t in it
So which P and Q are you referring to?
Is it the answers on post 25?
 
  • #39
lioric said:
That's what I was clarifying in post 36
The initial P and Q position vectors given in the question has no t in it
So which P and Q are you referring to?
Is it the answers on post 25?
Think about the problem you are trying to solve. You are given original positions P and Q and their velocities. They are moving. Then you are asked at what time ##t## is Q northeast of P. So you need their positions at time ##t## don't you? So you need to know for what ##t## does Q-P point northeast. Fix your arithmetic and show Q-P as a function of ##t## and you are almost done.
 
  • #40
LCKurtz said:
Think about the problem you are trying to solve. You are given original positions P and Q and their velocities. They are moving. Then you are asked at what time ##t## is Q northeast of P. So you need their positions at time ##t## don't you? So you need to know for what ##t## does Q-P point northeast. Fix your arithmetic and show Q-P as a function of ##t## and you are almost done.

Ok
Let's think here
I'm just trying to clear my confusion please do tell if I'm thinking right

Let's keep the vector situation and go to a simpler linear one
Let's say P is on (1,1) on a grid
And Q is on ( 5,-5) on the same grid
P is moving on positive x-axis (to the right) at let's say 1 unit/s
And Q is moving in the positive y-axis (upward) 1 unit/s
Let's say the question is asking to find the time that P moves east of Q

Is this the same or similar sort of thing?
 
  • #41
lioric said:
Ok
Let's think here
I'm just trying to clear my confusion please do tell if I'm thinking right

Let's keep the vector situation and go to a simpler linear one
Let's say P is on (1,1) on a grid
And Q is on ( 5,-5) on the same grid
P is moving on positive x-axis (to the right) at let's say 1 unit/s
And Q is moving in the positive y-axis (upward) 1 unit/s
Let's say the question is asking to find the time that P moves east of Q

Is this the same or similar sort of thing?
I am not going to go off on another tangent with you. You have understood the problem well enough to draw a picture long ago in post #19. Just finish the problem as I have suggested to you.
 
  • #42
LCKurtz said:
I am not going to go off on another tangent with you. You have understood the problem well enough to draw a picture long ago in post #19. Just finish the problem as I have suggested to you.

If I understood I wouldn't ask

But from what I have gathered and from the things you have asked me to do this is what I came up with
P initial position (i +7j) velocity (5i-5j)
Q initial position (3i-8j) velocity (6i+5j)

P new position
(i +7j)+(5i-5j)t.
(1+5t)i + (7-5t)j

Q new position
(3i-8j)+(6i+5j)t
(3+6t)i +(5t-8)j

Now Q-P

(3+6t)i + (5t-8)j - [ (1+5t)i + (7-5t)j ]
(3+6t)i + (5t-8)j - (1+5t)i - (7-5t)j
(3+6t)i + (5t-8)j +(-1-5t)i +(-7+5t)j
(3-1+6t-5t)i + (5t+5t-8-7)j
(2+t)i + (10t-15)j

Is this what you asked?
 
  • #43
Yes. Finally! Now, for what ##t## does that point northeast? What do you require about the components for a vector to point northeast?
 
  • #44
LCKurtz said:
Yes. Finally! Now, for what ##t## does that point northeast? What do you require about the components for a vector to point northeast?
It should point to somewhere in the first quadrant meaning it should not have a bearing exceeding 90 degrees
 
  • #45
I would assume in this problem that the meaning of northeast means exactly northeast, that is midway between north and east.
 
  • #46
LCKurtz said:
I would assume in this problem that the meaning of northeast means exactly northeast, that is midway between north and east.
So that means as I said before bearing of 45 degrees
 
  • #47
lioric said:
So that means as I said before bearing of 45 degrees
Yes. And the question asks at what time does that happen? So...
 
  • #48
LCKurtz said:
Yes. And the question asks at what time does that happen? So...

We have to find the time taken to make 45 degrees between P and Q
But I don't know how
 
  • #49
Do you know how to tell if any vector points NE? Which, if any, of the following vectors point NE?
3i - 5j
2i +3j
-i - 2j
3i + 3j
i - j
-2i + 2j
Explain how you can tell.
 
  • #50
LCKurtz said:
Do you know how to tell if any vector points NE? Which, if any, of the following vectors point NE?
3i - 5j
2i +3j
-i - 2j
3i + 3j
i - j
-2i + 2j
Explain how you can tell.
Ya the 3i+3j
It means the position is 3,3 on an x,y axis
The gradient of that would be 1 and that gives a 45 degrees
 
  • #51
OK. So what, if any, value of ##t## makes Q-P point NE? That answer is the solution to your problem. Although the problem may want to know what time of day is it, given it started at noon.
 
  • #52
LCKurtz said:
OK. So what, if any, value of ##t## makes Q-P point NE? That answer is the solution to your problem. Although the problem may want to know what time of day is it, given it started at noon.
Multiply by sin45?
 
  • #53
lioric said:
Multiply by sin45?
That answer makes no sense at all. You are asked for a value of ##t## and you reply "multiply by sin45".
 
  • #54
LCKurtz said:
That answer makes no sense at all. You are asked for a value of ##t## and you reply "multiply by sin45".
sorry
well in order to be 45 degrees Q has to have the same amount of x and y values away from P
eg: if Q if 3i away from Q it should also have 3j away from P
But you have to understand this that I'm trying but I don't know how to use this information to find a t value for this problem
I do understand that Q-P was to find the distance between P and Q at a certain time t
But I don't know how to find t when Q is 45 degrees to P
I'm just having this problem because I'm not used to doing vector type questions.
If it was simple distance and time I could cope.
So please lend me a hand
Thanks to you I can this far and I really appreciate it
 
  • #55
From post #42:
lioric said:
Now Q-P

lioric said:
(2+t)i + (10t-15)j
From post #43:
LCKurtz said:
Yes. Finally! Now, for what t does that point northeast? What do you require about the components for a vector to point northeast?
What relationship has to exist between the i and j coordinates for a vector to point northeast?
 
  • #56
Mark44 said:
From post #42:From post #43:

What relationship has to exist between the i and j coordinates for a vector to point northeast?
They have to be positive and same magnitude
 
  • #57
lioric said:
They have to be positive and same magnitude
You could have answered that way back when I asked it in post #43.

So, what value of ##t##, if any, makes that happen for Q-P?
 
  • #58
From post #42:
lioric said:
Now Q-P
.
.
.
(2+t)i + (10t-15)j
Mark44 said:
What relationship has to exist between the i and j coordinates for a vector to point northeast?
lioric said:
They have to be positive and same magnitude
So what do you get?
 
  • #59
Mark44 said:
From post #42:So what do you get?

Ok I get what your saying
As I mentioned before I'm having such a hard time due to vector with i & j form
I know if it's pointing to NE the values have to be positive and same
I just don't know how to change it or in other words the proper way to do the sum when it comes to vectors
I'm not clear about the "protocol " to change the i and j in relation with time
 
  • #60
Put ##t=1## in your vector. Does it point NE? How about ##t = 2## or ##t=3## etc. The question is, is there any value of ##t## that gives a vector that points NE.
 
  • #61
LCKurtz said:
Put ##t=1## in your vector. Does it point NE? How about ##t = 2## or ##t=3## etc. The question is, is there any value of ##t## that gives a vector that points NE.
I get it now
I have to find out by changing t which changes the values inside the bracket
Hence giving magnitude to i & j

I completely understand
Thank you very much

(2+t)i + (10t-15)j

2+t=10t-15
t-10t=-2-15
-9t=-17
t=-17/-9
t=1.889
 
  • #62
So that's 1hr 53min 20sec past noon
Thank you very much
And thank you for being so patient with me
 
  • #63
You are welcome. I'm curious what math courses you have had or are taking now.
 
  • #64
Non actually
I just find questions here and there and try to attempt them
 

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