Is a PhD in physics worth it?

[BadgerBadger92]

I am going to community college this summer with a focus on physics. I am VERY excited!

I know it’s early to ask this, but is a PhD in physics worth it career wise? I hear actual jobs in physics are few in number, but they open up possibilities in other fields. Is it worth it in your opinion?

 

[WWGD]

I am going to community college this summer with a focus on physics. I am VERY excited!

I know it’s early to ask this, but is a PhD in physics worth it career wise? I hear actual jobs in physics are few in number, but they open up possibilities in other fields. Is it worth it in your opinion?

" Worth" depends on your likes, dislikes, personal goals. What are yours?

 

[BadgerBadger92]

" Worth" depends on your likes, dislikes, personal goals. What are yours?

I love relative physics mainly, but I love all of it. I’m not equipped with the mathematical knowledge to understand these theories yet, but I’ve been studying hard with the YouTube channel Khans Academy and the Math and Sciencr channel which have helped me tremendously.

Other realms of physics I’m interested in are quantum mechanics/field theory, string theory, Newtonian physics, etc.

I’m preparing hard before college. My hope is to have a physics job someday. Doesn’t necessarily matter to me as long as it’s in the field. I’d also be okay at a hospital or working in economics.

And btw, since you’re here, what are good study methods?

 

[CrysPhys]

I’m preparing hard before college. My hope is to have a physics job someday. Doesn’t necessarily matter to me as long as it’s in the field. I’d also be okay at a hospital or working in economics.

Here's a revised version of some of my previous posts:

* If you speak the language of ROI and opportunity costs, then you probably shouldn't do it (go for a PhD in physics).

* If you speak the language of following your passion and not wanting to look back with regret decades from now, then you probably should do it.

* As I've posted many times, my perspective is that a PhD in physics does not necessarily have to be a means to an end, it can be an end in itself. This is in stark contrast, e.g., to going to medical school.

* You said you are about to start community college. That will take at least 2 yrs. Then you will need to complete a BS physics program. That will take at least 2 more yrs. After that, a PhD physics program. That will take ~6+ more yrs. So ~10+ yrs total.

* If after 10+ yrs, you accept, "Well, I've accomplished what I set out to do (complete a research project that I was passionate about and that I found satisfying in and of itself). Now it's time to move on to the next phase of my life, regardless of whether it's related to my PhD research or not." Then OK. But, if after 10+ yrs, you lament, "The likelihood of landing a long-term career as a researcher in physics is slim. Damn, I've just wasted 10+ yrs of my life. Why, oh why, was I so stupid." Then NOT OK.

 

[BadgerBadger92]

Here's a revised version of some of my previous posts:

* If you speak the language of ROI and opportunity costs, then you probably shouldn't do it (go for a PhD in physics).

* If you speak the language of following your passion and not wanting to look back with regret decades from now, then you probably should do it.

* As I've posted many times, my perspective is that a PhD in physics does not necessarily have to be a means to an end, it can be an end in itself. This is in stark contrast, e.g., to going to medical school.

* You said you are about to start community college. That will take at least 2 yrs. Then you will need to complete a BS physics program. That will take at least 2 more yrs. After that, a PhD physics program. That will take ~6+ more yrs. So ~10+ yrs total.

* If after 10+ yrs, you accept, "Well, I've accomplished what I set out to do (complete a research project that I was passionate about and that I found satisfying in and of itself). Now it's time to move on to the next phase of my life, regardless of whether it's related to my PhD research or not." Then OK. But, if after 10+ yrs, you lament, "The likelihood of landing a long-term career as a researcher in physics is slim. Damn, I've just wasted 10+ yrs of my life. Why, oh why, was I so stupid." Then NOT OK.

I love science, which is one of my motivations. I also want a good job, and apparently physics majors can become engineers. Is engineering a big field?

 

[CrysPhys]

Is engineering a big field?

Yes.

 

[berkeman]

apparently physics majors can become engineers.

If your end goal is to become an engineer in one of the specialties (EE, ME, CE, CS, etc.), then getting a physics degree is not the way to get there, IMO. Lower division (first 2 years) of university is pretty much the same for engineering and physics majors, but upper division classes are totally different.

 

[BadgerBadger92]

If your end goal is to become an engineer in one of the specialties (EE, ME, CE, CS, etc.), then getting a physics degree is not the way to get there, IMO. Lower division (first 2 years) of university is pretty much the same for engineering and physics majors, but upper division classes are totally different.

What about medical jobs? From what I heard you could get a job as an MRI technologist.

 

[berkeman]

What about medical jobs? From what I heard you could get a job as an MRI technologist.

Paging @gleem @Dale

 

[Dale]

What about medical jobs? From what I heard you could get a job as an MRI technologist.

You could do that. But you can also get a job as a MRI technologist with about 2 years of training. And with a physics PhD you would still need much of that training.

With a physics degree you would probably be better set for a medical physics role. Those roles are related to medical imaging, but more focused on radiation safety than on operating the imaging equipment

 

[Choppy]

This article might be helpful if you're considering medical physics...
How to Become a Medical Physicist
It's a well-paying and highly rewarding profession. In recent years the demand for qualified medical physicists has increased tremendously.

 

[BadgerBadger92]

This article might be helpful if you're considering medical physics...
How to Become a Medical Physicist
It's a well-paying and highly rewarding profession. In recent years the demand for qualified medical physicists has increased tremendously.

Thank you! I’ll check it out!

 

[CrysPhys]

If your end goal is to become an engineer in one of the specialties (EE, ME, CE, CS, etc.), then getting a physics degree is not the way to get there, IMO. Lower division (first 2 years) of university is pretty much the same for engineering and physics majors, but upper division classes are totally different.

True. But the OP's initial priority is not to become an engineer; it's to become a research physicist (physicist with a PhD in physics). Then, once the OP has become a research physicist, what are the OP's career options (i.e., how do they earn an income), should they not land a long-term (whatever that means these days) career as a research physicist? Engineering then would be one Plan B option (among a number of Plan B options), after completion of the physics PhD for its own sake, should the need arise. You certainly wouldn't want to complete a physics PhD with the express goal of becoming an engineer.

 

[CrysPhys]

OP: What your career options will be after completion of your PhD will depend heavily on the job market at that time and on what you did for your PhD. It will make a big difference, e.g., whether your thesis is in the field of theoretical cosmology (e.g., what came before the Big Bang) or experimental condensed matter physics (e.g., a new class of high-temperature superconductors). What skill sets will you have (modelling of complex systems, software engineering, computer simulation, instrumentation, apparatus design, analysis and characterization methods, ...)?

There will be jobs that will require additional formal academic training or degrees to receive requisite certifications (e.g., medical physicist, professional licensed engineer, patent attorney, ...). There will be jobs that will not require additional formal academic training or degrees (e.g., analyst in finance or business, industrial development engineer that does not require a professional license, patent agent, private tutor, ...).

 

[BadgerBadger92]

OP: What your career options will be after completion of your PhD will depend heavily on the job market at that time and on what you did for your PhD. It will make a big difference, e.g., whether your thesis is in the field of theoretical cosmology (e.g., what came before the Big Bang) or experimental condensed matter physics (e.g., a new class of high-temperature superconductors). What skill sets will you have (modelling of complex systems, software engineering, instrumentation, apparatus design, ...)?

There will be jobs that will require additional formal academic training or degrees to receive requisite certifications (e.g., medical physicist, professional licensed engineer, patent attorney, ...). There will be jobs that will not require additional formal academic training or degrees (e.g., analyst in finance or business, industrial development engineer that does not require a professional license, patent agent, private tutor, ...).

I’ll keep that in mind. I want to learn about relativity and quantum mechanics mainly, so I’m not sure so I don’t think there’s much in that field, at least relativity. I imagine QM may have a lot.

I hope as I go to school I can ask questions. I’m afraid of asking questions here because a lot of people here can be impatient.

 

[gleem]

I hope you can ask questions as you go to school too. You asked for opinions and you got them. Are you afraid to ask questions because you might hear something you don't like?

 

[BadgerBadger92]

I hope you can ask questions as you go to school too. You asked for opinions and you got them. Are you afraid to ask questions because you might hear something you don't like?

No, I’m just afraid people will make fun of me which happens all the time here. I’m open to facts, that’s why I’m asking. Just here especially people don’t treat me very kindly.

 

[CrysPhys]

I’ll keep that in mind. I want to learn about relativity and quantum mechanics mainly, so I’m not sure so I don’t think there’s much in that field, at least relativity. I imagine QM may have a lot.

I hope as I go to school I can ask questions. I’m afraid of asking questions here because a lot of people here can be impatient.

Well, first things, first. Under the normal scheme of things in the US, you will apply for a PhD program towards the end of the first semester senior year. So you'll need to have your plans defined by the end of your junior year. A lot can change by then.

And there is some wiggle room. As I mentioned in previous posts, I once served as an industry mentor to STEM students. One was an undergrad senior physics major. She hadn't found a field or problem that she was willing to devote 6+ yrs to in a PhD program. So she got a job working as a research assistant for a company that designs and manufactures accelerators for medical radiation treatment. As I expected, she got bored with her job within her first year. But she did develop a keen interest in medical physics. She completed her PhD in medical physics and started her residency this year.

 

[CrysPhys]

No, I’m just afraid people will make fun of me which happens all the time here. I’m open to facts, that’s why I’m asking. Just here especially people don’t treat me very kindly.

That shouldn't be an issue if you are sincerely asking for advice. Problems usually arise with posters who have already made up their minds and are seeking validation only (some become openly hostile when others explain why what they plan to do is not wise).

 

[dlgoff]

... apparently physics majors can become engineers.

My university (University of Kansas, School of Engineering) offered a BS in Engineering Physics which I did. I enjoyed the math and could have double majored in Physics and Math. I had several Engineering related jobs.

Edit: This doesn't really answer your question about getting a PhD. Just wanted to throw this out there.

 

[BadgerBadger92]

That shouldn't be an issue if you are sincerely asking for advice. Problems usually arise with posters who have already made up their minds and are seeking validation only (some become openly hostile when others explain why what they plan to do is not wise).

Not really. I come to this forum because I trust the communities opinion. I am no professional which is why I come here

 

[CrysPhys]

Not really. I come to this forum because I trust the communities opinion. I am no professional which is why I come here

Then you should not be reluctant to ask questions here as you travel along your academic and professional journey.

 

[BadgerBadger92]

Then you should not be reluctant to ask questions here as you travel along your academic and professional journey.

Thanks, I just have low confidence. These people may not really being mean to me but I perceive it as such. I have schizophrenia which makes me think that way.

 

[gleem]

Thanks, I just have low confidence. These people may not really being mean to me but I perceive it as such. I have schizophrenia which makes me think that way.

Perhaps a better question for you is how the stress of a very competitive activity, such as studying and doing well in physics will impact your condition or vice versa. We cannot provide guidance in this matter except talk with your healthcare provider.

 

[BadgerBadger92]

Perhaps a better question for you is how the stress of a very competitive activity, such as studying and doing well in physics will impact your condition or vice versa. We cannot provide guidance in this matter except talk with your healthcare provider.

I don’t want to get into physics to necessarily make ideas, I just love the field. I do have one idea but I doubt it’s true. I don’t have a solid understanding of math nor physics to make an idea. Physics can really calm me down.

 

[gleem]

I don’t want to get into physics to necessarily make ideas,

But you want it as a gateway to a relevant career not as a recreational pursuit. You will have to meet some standards within a certain time frame. Will you be able to work within this framework? Do you like challenges for example? How do you deal with the failure to meet someone else's expectations?

 

[BadgerBadger92]

But you want it as a gateway to a relevant career not as a recreational pursuit. You will have to meet some standards within a certain time frame. Will you be able to work within this framework? Do you like challenges for example? How do you deal with the failure to meet someone else's expectations?

I’m not sure but I plan on trying. Schizophrenia never got in the way of my intellectual persuits. .i think i can keep up with the work. I have been studying three hours per day in math to prepare myself. Can I meet people’s expectations? I’m not sure.

 

[hutchphd]

Can I meet people’s expectations? I’m not sure.

That was not the question. The issue raised by @gleem is more personal and perhaps more relevant: "How do you deal with the failure to meet someone else's expectations?" Sometimes you will, in fact, fail. In my experience how you internalize this will largely determine both your success and your happiness. This becomes more important as your goals become more challenging.

 

[BadgerBadger92]

Can I meet people’s expectations? I’m not sure.

That was not the question. The issue raised by @gleem is more personal and perhaps more relevant: "How do you deal with the failure to meet someone else's expectations?" Sometimes you will, in fact, fail. In my experience how you internalize this will largely determine both your success and your happiness. This becomes more important as your goals become more challenging.

If I fail I fail. I can’t tell the future so I can’t tell you how I’d feel.

 

[hutchphd]

You will discover this as you continue your education. It is an important thing to know. Some people thrive on challenges........some do not ( this is not a value judgement !!)

 

[BadgerBadger92]

You will discover this as you continue your education. It is an important thing to know. Some people thrive on challenges........some do not ( this is not a value judgement !!)

I like challenges too, just I hope I can succeed. Just how the universe is a huge interest of mine.

I think I’m gonna try to go for it. But first things first. First step: community college. I start in the summer.

Btw, do you have good study tactics you can suggest to me? I seem to learn more easily with videos than books.

 

[hutchphd]

Think of the lecture as a human interactive video and put energy into making it useful to you via proper preparation. Do not get behind. Get to know your prof (she will be more useful than YouTube).

 

[CrysPhys]

You will have to meet some standards within a certain time frame. Will you be able to work within this framework? Do you like challenges for example? How do you deal with the failure to meet someone else's expectations?

That was not the question. The issue raised by @gleem is more personal and perhaps more relevant: "How do you deal with the failure to meet someone else's expectations?" Sometimes you will, in fact, fail. In my experience how you internalize this will largely determine both your success and your happiness. This becomes more important as your goals become more challenging.

I'm puzzled by this question. Does it arise because the two of you have additional insights into the OP's situation from the OP's posts in other threads? I myself have not looked at the OP's posts in other threads.

Otherwise, I don't think it's a reasonable question to ask someone just prior to their first year of college. If many, many moons ago, someone had asked graduating-high-school-senior me that question, I likely would have paused and answered, "I really don't know. I haven't faced that situation." I'm sure some in similar situations would have a more interesting backstory to relate (I know some); but many won't.

That question would be more appropriate further down the road; e.g., when someone is applying for a PhD program or applying for a job ... when they have accumulated more life experience. And perhaps an even more critical question at that time, "How do you deal with failure when you do not meet your own expectations?" This is related to the last bullet item in my Reply #4.

 

[mcastillo356]

Hi, @BadgerBadger92

I am going to community college this summer with a focus on physics. I am VERY excited!

I know it’s early to ask this, but is a PhD in physics worth it career wise? I hear actual jobs in physics are few in number, but they open up possibilities in other fields. Is it worth it in your opinion?

I would personally choose to study a PhD; the reason is not other that I love studying.

Thanks, I just have low confidence. These people may not really being mean to me but I perceive it as such. I have schizophrenia which makes me think that way.

I also suffer that disease. Don't give up!

Marcos

 

[gleem]

I'm puzzled by this question. Does it arise because the two of you have additional insights into the OP's situation from the OP's posts in other threads? I myself have not looked at the OP's posts in other threads.

I had not looked at the OP's previous threads until you mentioned them. You should have. The current assumption is that the OP is an HS senior. His previous posts cast much doubt on that. This might change the advice given in this thread.

So why did I ask this question? The OP is like many we have seen, and the advice following was reasonable. I felt I could not contribute, so I stayed out of it until the OP stated he was afraid of asking questions here. What got past me was his possible reaction or reference to previous posts on other topics that might not have been received well. Anyway trying to explore this fear led to the revelation of his mental condition which in my opinion greatly changed the way this thread should be handled. Stress is one thing that schizophrenics usually find difficult to adapt to. A physics major is under a lot of stress. I expected that he would know this and have considered this in his plan. In self-study you regulate your pace and can devote as much time to a topic as you need. Not so in university let alone graduate school.

@BadgerBadger92 go to CC and then consider university. Graduate with a GPA>3.5 then consder the options. Know Thyself.

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