Is Biden's daughter's drug habits news worthy

[jaap de vries]

I remember from working for the Salvation Army that alcohol is a hard drugs...when you are adicted to it. However, recreational use is possible. I love to watch football with some friends and some beers. I wondered if I could enjoy the game if me and my friends would shoot up some heroin first. The problem with hard drugs is that recreational usage is not really possible. A serious alcohol adiction is right up there with other hard drugs.

 

[russ_watters]

Wow...

Yes, alcohol abuse is a big problem. But neither that fact, nor any of what you just said has any relevance whatsoever to your previous claim or the flaws in it I pointed out. In fact, the issue of drinking and driving is actually quite similar in most respects to the issue of driving while texting/talking on a cell phone. Both activities are otherwise legal but are extremely dangerous when combined with driving and as a result are both illegal while driving (in a growing number of states for cell phone use).

Just a thought but if alcohol is not addictive, why did so many people risk fines and jail to drink it during prohibition when they could have just drank coffee or ate a Hershey Bar.

I said alcohol is not chemically addictive. Alcohol is psychologically addictive in the same way that any enjoyable activity is, especially since alcohol is associated with other fun activities, and that made it very difficult to change behaviors. I was careful to specify because i figured if i didn't, you would throw up the psychological addiction concept as a red herring argument. The big difference between a psycological addiction associated with specific other activities and a chemical addiction is a key point here. People who are actual alcoholics need alcohol all the time, whereas people who drink socially might not be able to fathom watching a football game without a beer in their hand, but they aren't going to get drunk on Monday morning instead of going to work, unlike a crack addict or alcoholic, who will do precisely that. Social drinking is not inherrently life destroying, whereas alcoholism and hard drug usage is.

And also, what does addiction have to do with doing illegal things? Do people drive over the speed limit because they are addicted to it?

 

[russ_watters]

I remember from working for the Salvation Army that alcohol is a hard drugs...when you are adicted to it. However, recreational use is possible. I love to watch football with some friends and some beers. I wondered if I could enjoy the game if me and my friends would shoot up some heroin first. The problem with hard drugs is that recreational usage is not really possible. A serious alcohol adiction is right up there with other hard drugs.

I'll agree with that.

 

[Proton Soup]

alcohol is definitely physiologically addictive. you can even kill someone who is a hardened alcoholic if you cut them off abruptly.

 

[russ_watters]

alcohol is definitely physiologically addictive. you can even kill someone who is a hardened alcoholic if you cut them off abruptly.

See:

Physical addiction to alcohol occurs in consistently heavy drinkers. Since their bodies have adapted to the presence of alcohol, they suffer alcohol Withdrawal if they suddenly stop drinking.

http://www.addictionwithdrawal.com/alcohol.htm

In other words, the abuse leads to the addiction, not the other way around (unlike, say, nicotine). The abuse of the damaging substance forces the body to make adjustments to protect itself. These adjustments cause the addiction/withdrawal symptoms, not the substance itself. So the alcohol itself is not physically addictive...

...If you don't like that logic because it looks like a caveat, let me just bypass it: alcohol is not physically/chemically addictive for those who do not abuse it. The point, as before, is that alcohol can be safely used. Hard drugs have no safe dosage, nor are they ever inended to be used safely anyway (that last part applies to softer drugs like pot as well).

 

[Proton Soup]

See: http://www.addictionwithdrawal.com/alcohol.htm

In other words, the abuse leads to the addiction, not the other way around (unlike, say, nicotine). The abuse of the damaging substance forces the body to make adjustments to protect itself. These adjustments cause the addiction/withdrawal symptoms, not the substance itself. So the alcohol itself is not physically addictive...

...If you don't like that logic because it looks like a caveat, let me just bypass it: alcohol is not physically/chemically addictive for those who do not abuse it. The point, as before, is that alcohol can be safely used. Hard drugs have no safe dosage, nor are they ever inended to be used safely anyway (that last part applies to softer drugs like pot as well).

yeah, it's not very satisfying. there certainly are people who smoke (say an occasional cigar) but aren't heavy smokers. and it would take about 2 weeks for my body to adjust to life without caffeine.

i would prefer to just stick with recognizing that some drugs are a lot more addictive than others, and some are a lot more damaging than others. and the amount of overlap varies, as do the mechanisms of addiction.