Is relying on personal cars for transportation really necessary?

[Ivan Seeking]

http://img366.imageshack.us/img366/5764/newgasprices9qy.jpg

 

[z-component]

Thanks for this, Ivan Seeking! I love it!

 

[Monique]

I don't know what the gasoline prizes are in the US, but I suspect you've got nothing to complain.

Gasoline prizes here:
Unleaded 1,439 euro per liter (1.771 usd/liter or 6.704 usd/gallon)
Super 1,493 euro per liter (1.838 usd/liter or 6.958 usd/gallon)

 

[wolram]

http://img366.imageshack.us/img366/5764/newgasprices9qy.jpg

[/URL]

What does it mean? There are no prices

 

[mattmns]

I don't know what the gasoline prizes are in the US, but I suspect you've got nothing to complain.

Gasoline prizes here:
Unleaded 1,439 euro per liter (1.771 usd/liter or 6.704 usd/gallon)
Super 1,493 euro per liter (1.838 usd/liter or 6.958 usd/gallon)

Yes but the US is designed around needing cars. Here nobody walks, rides a bike, or uses public transportation. Not nobody, but very very few people.

 

[hypatia]

lol thanks Ivan, I needed a smile, cause I need to fill up my tank today
And your right Monique, at $2.85 a gallon for regular, its still cheap by Europes standards.

 

[EnumaElish]

I don't know what the gasoline prizes are in the US, but I suspect you've got nothing to complain.

Gasoline prizes here:
Unleaded 1,439 euro per liter (1.771 usd/liter or 6.704 usd/gallon)
Super 1,493 euro per liter (1.838 usd/liter or 6.958 usd/gallon)

That's your "welfare state membership dues" you are paying for, not gas.

 

[Skyhunter]

Yes but the US is designed around needing cars. Here nobody walks, rides a bike, or uses public transportation. Not nobody, but very very few people.

I love my bicycle more and more everyday!

Hilarious Ivan

 

[Integral]

Yes but the US is designed around needing cars. Here nobody walks, rides a bike, or uses public transportation. Not nobody, but very very few people.

Perhaps that can be changed, maybe $6/gal would be a start. I say bring on public transport!

 

[Townsend]

Perhaps that can be changed, maybe $6/gal would be a start. I say bring on public transport!

It will happen soon enough. The only bad thing is that it greatly affects the price of all other goods as well.

I honestly wish the government would tax gas in the US more...I say prices need to be about $5/gal before people would learn to drive more fuel efficient vehicles...

I wonder what the 405 would look like if gas was 5 to 6 bucks a gallon...

 

[Skyhunter]

It will happen soon enough. The only bad thing is that it greatly affects the price of all other goods as well.

I honestly wish the government would tax gas in the US more...I say prices need to be about $5/gal before people would learn to drive more fuel efficient vehicles...

I wonder what the 405 would look like if gas was 5 to 6 bucks a gallon...

And with the added revenue maybe we could finally have universal healthcare and free education.

 

[Townsend]

And with the added revenue maybe we could finally have universal healthcare and free education.

Ha... No way... The added revenue would just mean we can cut income taxes and perhaps send out some more refunds. Maybe we could also figure out a way to fix SS but I doubt it.

 

[Skyhunter]

Ha... No way... The added revenue would just mean we can cut income taxes and perhaps send out some more refunds. Maybe we could also figure out a way to fix SS but I doubt it.

Why not eliminate income tax altogether.
If we eliminate subsidies, pay the real cost of our wanton consumption, and tax wealth instead of production.

If I trade a portion of my life in exchange for the money I need to live, what right has anyone else to that money?

If I make an income from investments, that income should be taxed, since the social infrastructure is what makes that income possible. If I own property I have an investment in the community and therefore an obligation to support that community, that property should be taxed. If I wish to consume luxury items then I should pay for it with a consumption tax.

Food, water, shelter, healthcare, are not luxuries, they are necessities and should not be taxed.

BTW; Reagan fixed SS, and Clinton created a trust fund with the SS surplus to pay for the time when it would run a deficit. The only crisis in SS is Bush's plan to raid that 4 trillion dollar trust fund.

 

[Townsend]

Why not eliminate income tax altogether.
If we eliminate subsidies, pay the real cost of our wanton consumption, and tax wealth instead of production.

If I trade a portion of my life in exchange for the money I need to live, what right has anyone else to that money?

If I make an income from investments, that income should be taxed, since the social infrastructure is what makes that income possible. If I own property I have an investment in the community and therefore an obligation to support that community, that property should be taxed. If I wish to consume luxury items then I should pay for it with a consumption tax.

Food, water, shelter, healthcare, are not luxuries, they are necessities and should not be taxed.

BTW; Reagan fixed SS, and Clinton created a trust fund with the SS surplus to pay for the time when it would run a deficit. The only crisis in SS is Bush's plan to raid that 4 trillion dollar trust fund.

Well I do agree with everything except the last part...

And here I thought you were just another pro progressive income tax liberal...

Sorry for assuming so much...

 

[Skyhunter]

Well I do agree with everything except the last part...

And here I thought you were just another pro progressive income tax liberal...

Sorry for assuming so much...

So happy to disilusion you.

 

[Pengwuino]

Perhaps that can be changed, maybe $6/gal would be a start. I say bring on public transport!

and $200 fish for someone who lives in oklahoma. I say stay with the freedom to go out to eat when I damn well please without the possibility of being mugged on my way there

But then again I don't see how I could get any more traffic tickets... hell what am I saying, they'll find a way to give me a ticket on a bus... jerks.

 

[Pengwuino]

And with the added revenue maybe we could finally have universal healthcare and free education.

wooo yah, nothing like mediocre service!

BTW; Reagan fixed SS, and Clinton created a trust fund with the SS surplus to pay for the time when it would run a deficit. The only crisis in SS is Bush's plan to raid that 4 trillion dollar trust fund.

You do realize that the numbers are very very very clear when it comes to Social Security. Unless mathematics are completely the wrong way to go, we will run out within the next 50 years. It only takes a 6th grade education to see that when your paying out more then your taking in and expect to pay out even more soon, your in trouble.

 

[Ivan Seeking]

If we paid for the real price of gasoline, which includes much of the national defense, a myriad of health issues [due to pollution], not to mention compensation for all of the environmental damage done, we would probably be paying ten dollars per gallon or more. This is the great fallacy that makes alternatives appear to be economically uncompetitive: We pay for gasoline through income taxes, health care costs, and many other hidden costs.

Late edit.

 

[Moonbear]

Perhaps that can be changed, maybe $6/gal would be a start. I say bring on public transport!

It might be working with the current prices. With the most recent increase in prices, our city's public buses reported an increase in riders. I'm also just laughing my butt off watching the SUV owners crying and running to the dealers to trade them in (there are a lot of used SUVs pretty cheap right now). I'm suddenly thinking it'll be good when I move to a small town where nothing is more than 5 miles away, and lots of stuff on campus is accessible via monorails (they're so cool, I just love that it's an option to not have to drive all over the place once I'm on campus, even if I have stuff to carry some distance). Now, if only the roads were flat, not mountains, and had shoulders, I might have considered taking up biking, but I'd be scared to death to do the downhills, and would probaby drop dead of a heart attack before I got to the top on the uphills.

 

[Pengwuino]

I'm also just laughing my butt off watching the SUV owners crying and running to the dealers to trade them in (there are a lot of used SUVs pretty cheap right now).

How pathetic. Pay $30,000 for an SUV and now you just got to trade it back in because your paying a couple thousand more in gas each year. I suppose it might make some mathematical sense in say, California with a cheapo SUV that isn't maintained very well. Talk about public histeria

 

[Townsend]

How pathetic. Pay $30,000 for an SUV and now you just got to trade it back in because your paying a couple thousand more in gas each year. I suppose it might make some mathematical sense in say, California with a cheapo SUV that isn't maintained very well. Talk about public histeria

They were idiots for buying the wasteful gas guzzlers in the first place. I detest SUVs and loath the soccer moms that have nearly killed me because of their inept driving skills while maneuvering a man crushing 4 by 4 four ton tank in heavy traffic.

I hope everyone of those morons lose their a$$e$ on the trade in.

 

[Ivan Seeking]

How pathetic. Pay $30,000 for an SUV and now you just got to trade it back in because your paying a couple thousand more in gas each year. I suppose it might make some mathematical sense in say, California with a cheapo SUV that isn't maintained very well. Talk about public histeria

Have you seen the commercial with the guy with the big beautiful house, a new car, a membership at the country club, and who can barely pay the interest on his credit cards? "Somebody help me" he begs.

In order to have those houses and SUVs, many people live right on the edge with credit debt. An extra $100 per month can break the budget.

 

[Monique]

SUVs are gaining popularity in Europe, don't ask me why! All our roads, in the Netherlands anyway, are straight and flat without potholes or mud. You can't even fit such a car in most streets in the old part of Amsterdam and they take up 1.5 parking spot, you can't even get in when one is parked next to you!

Certain cities actually started banning SUVs, they were not allowed to park if they were larger than certain dimensions, I think they took back the ban after a while since it is hard to implement or something.

 

[Moonbear]

They were idiots for buying the wasteful gas guzzlers in the first place. I detest SUVs and loath the soccer moms that have nearly killed me because of their inept driving skills while maneuvering a man crushing 4 by 4 four ton tank in heavy traffic.

I hope everyone of those morons lose their a$$e$ on the trade in.

You caught me...that's the real reason I'm laughing my butt off.

In order to have those houses and SUVs, many people live right on the edge with credit debt. An extra $100 per month can break the budget.

I hate to break it to them, but their budget was broken a long time ago if they're existing on just the minimum payments. No wonder credit card companies keep raising interest rates.

 

[Pengwuino]

Have you seen the commercial with the guy with the big beautiful house, a new car, a membership at the country club, and who can barely pay the interest on his credit cards? "Somebody help me" he begs.

In order to have those houses and SUVs, many people live right on the edge with credit debt. An extra $100 per month can break the budget.

I love that commercial!

Well they're stupid. If that kinda person traded in their SUV, they probably have done much stupider things in the past. I mean if your putting money into luxuries such as SUV's (unless of course, you have real reasons such as those stupid soccer moms who actually do need to transport 15 whiney kids to soccer practice each day), you shouldn't have a budget that can't accommodate an extra $100/month.

 

[Pengwuino]

They were idiots for buying the wasteful gas guzzlers in the first place.

Theres much better reasons to laugh at these people then the "wasteful" argument. We're americans, what DONT we waste :P

 

[Moonbear]

(unless of course, you have real reasons such as those stupid soccer moms who actually do need to transport 15 whiney kids to soccer practice each day)

Except those won't fit that many kids anyway. If you need to tote around lots of kids, you get a van. The only reason you'd need an SUV is if you live out on a dirt road somewhere that gets muddy when it rains and isn't plowed when it snows, or if you need to tow something heavy.

 

[mattmns]

My step-mom owns an SUV and complains about gas prices. I tell her that she has no right to complain because she drives such a gas guzzler, but she says that she likes her SUV because it is higher off the ground than most cars and therefore she can see things easier. My parents are morons though and cannot back up any decisions they make so I say let them pay for it.

 

[Pengwuino]

My step-mom owns an SUV and complains about gas prices. I tell her that she has no right to complain because she drives such a gas guzzler, but she says that she likes her SUV because it is higher off the ground than most cars and therefore she can see things easier. My parents are morons though and cannot back up any decisions they make so I say let them pay for it.

Free country.

And that actually is one of the only valid reasons to have an SUV. They are much safer in collisions because of your higher position.

 

[Pengwuino]

Except those won't fit that many kids anyway. If you need to tote around lots of kids, you get a van. The only reason you'd need an SUV is if you live out on a dirt road somewhere that gets muddy when it rains and isn't plowed when it snows, or if you need to tow something heavy.

ewww we don't need more vans out on the road...

Stop having kids, simple.

I have stopped global warming.

 

[Townsend]

Free country.

And that actually is one of the only valid reasons to have an SUV. They are much safer in collisions because of your higher position.

Why should they have greater safety at the expense of others? That is a very selfish thing to do...

But I agree it is one of the only valid reasons to have an SUV. It is also the most pathetic...

 

[Pengwuino]

Why should they have greater safety at the expense of others? That is a very selfish thing to do...

But I agree it is one of the only valid reasons to have an SUV. It is also the most pathetic...

What do you mean at the expense of others? You mean at the expense of their own pocket books. You're telling me we all need to be out as vulnerable to being killed in an accident as everyone else?

 

[Moonbear]

What do you mean at the expense of others? You mean at the expense of their own pocket books. You're telling me we all need to be out as vulnerable to being killed in an accident as everyone else?

No, he means they're only safer to the person inside them, not to the people they hit. They cause a lot more damage to the other cars because of their size, and when you combine that with a moron behind the wheel, they're a hazard to everyone else.

 

[JamesU]

I don't get it

 

[Pengwuino]

No, he means they're only safer to the person inside them, not to the people they hit. They cause a lot more damage to the other cars because of their size, and when you combine that with a moron behind the wheel, they're a hazard to everyone else.

So should we ban volvos as well? Semis? Buses?