In summary, the FTS Michelson interferometer is the most accurate way to measure the wavelength of isolated and very bright and narrow spectral lines.
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Thanks - read your article with interest albeit perhaps needing to do some careful study to properly understand all the equations.

In the Insights article I wrote on the Deuterium Lyman Alpha line, the claimed resolution with a "3 metre vacuum grating spectrograph in fifth order" was:

$$L_\alpha(D)=1215.3378\pm0.00025 Å$$

Is this level of resolution achievable with a modern diffraction grating spectrometer and if so why has there been no attempt to repeat Herzberg's measurement (at least not as far as I can make out anyway) ?
 
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Thanks Charles! It's a welcome addition to your knowledge base!
 
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neilparker62 said:
Thanks - read your article with interest albeit perhaps needing to do some careful study to properly understand all the equations.

In the Insights article I wrote on the Deuterium Lyman Alpha line, the claimed resolution with a "3 metre vacuum grating spectrograph in fifth order" was:

$$L_\alpha(D)=1215.3378\pm0.00025 Å$$

Is this level of resolution achievable with a modern diffraction grating spectrometer and if so why has there been no attempt to repeat Herzberg's measurement (at least not as far as I can make out anyway) ?
That kind of resolution would be very difficult to achieve, and I believe it is well beyond the accuracy of any commercially available instrument. To achieve anywhere near this kind of precision would be quite painstaking. I can see where no one has attempted to repeat it to that level of accuracy. (Edit note: These initial comments may be in error. See post 5, etc.). With a commercially available instrument, one would typically measure something like ##\lambda= 1215.3 ## angstroms at first order, and you can get additional precision by doing it at fifth order. In general, the accuracy would be limited to the accuracy of the other spectral lines that you use as a standard. ## \\ ## In the Herzberg measurement, he most likely measured it from first principles=i.e. measuring ## \sin{\theta_i} ## and ## \sin{\theta_r} ##, rather than using other spectral lines. Alternatively, he could have calibrated his spectrometer with another source, such as the iron lines, that are commonly used as a wavelength standard. I don't have access to any iron calibration standard handbook at present, but if I remember correctly, the precision is perhaps ##+/- .001 ## angstroms. @neilparker62 Perhaps you could try to find some info on the currently available precision of these standards.
When working from first principles, besides measuring ## \theta_i ## and ## \theta_r ## very accurately, to get tremendous accuracy, you need to know the dimensions of the grating, i.e. the spacing ## d ## between the lines of the grating, to very high precision.
 
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Charles Link said:
@neilparker62 Perhaps you could try to find some info on the currently available precision of these standards.
Re-Optimized Energy Levels and Ritz Wavelengths of ##^{ 198}##Hg I,
A. Kramida,
J. Res. Natl. Inst. Stand. Technol. 116, 599–619 (2011)
DOI:10.6028/jres.116.008
You can compare and make your own correction for Herzberg’s D measurement. In the H-D-T compilation, I used the values from Saloman. This is the update mentioned in the H-D-T compilation.


See page 610 of above reference for the Mercury standard lines used by Herzberg.
 
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Thank you @neilparker62 I need to look these over carefully, but a quick comment=on at least one of them, they are using an FTS=Fourier transform spectrometer, which uses a Michelson interferometer based system. In any case, the resolution is quite phenomenal. ## \\ ## Edit: I also see that another of the measurements uses a Fabry-Perot interferometer. The reader may find this write-up that I previously did of interest: https://www.physicsforums.com/insights/fabry-perot-michelson-interferometry-fundamental-approach/
 
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Charles Link said:
they are using an FTS=Fourier transform spectrometer, which uses a Michelson interferometer based system. In any case, the resolution is quite phenomenal.
Frequency measurement and resolution at RF will take you easily to One part in 1011. Pretty damn good eh?
 
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sophiecentaur said:
Frequency measurement and resolution at RF will take you easily to One part in 1011. Pretty damn good eh?
It appears that the FTS Michelson interferometer may have the best (absolute) resolution/precision for determining the wavelength of isolated and very bright and narrow spectral lines, to be used as wavelength calibration standards. Once these "standard" wavelengths are determined, a diffraction grating spectrometer can be used to accurately measure the wavelengths of other sources, including those that have many spectral lines. ## \\ ## With a diffraction grating spectrometer, when working from first principles, (i.e. working with ##d, \theta_i ##, and ## \theta_r ##, and computing ## \lambda=\frac{d(\sin{\theta_i}+\sin{\theta_r})}{m} ##), the highest (absolute) precision that can be readily achieved may be on the order of +/- .001 angstroms. Using wavelength calibration standards from an FTS, relative precision for the diffraction grating instruments can then be taken to the diffraction limit of resolution, which may be a couple orders of magnitude smaller.
 
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In light of the last few posts then, is there any reason in principle why we can't 're-run' Herzberg's measurement with anyone - or combination of - the above-mentioned methods ? The impression I have is that this measurement represented some kind of 'pinnacle' in what was achievable by using diffraction grating technology. Thereafter laser-based methods took over leading (for example) to resolution of fine structure lines associated with Hydrogen/Deuterium Balmer alpha. And also to a very accurate measurement of "Ground State Lamb Shift" - the original intent of Herzberg's work. Although (for some reason) this term - ie "Ground State Lamb Shift" - seems to have more or less disappeared from the scientific landscape as of about 1995 - I'm not sure why ?
 
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Yes - I was aware of Parthey's measurements. In fact it was only because of comparing these against calculated values (per Dirac energy formula), that I discovered there were discrepancies and hence eventually came to learn firstly about fine structure differences (2p 1/2 - 2p 3/2) , then about the 'original' Lamb shift (2s - 2p 1/2) and so-called 'ground state lamb shift'.

The simplified Dirac energy equation I have used calculates the 1s - 2p 3/2 energy difference which should differ from an accurately measured value mainly on account of QED contributions - ie "ground state Lamb shift". Herzberg sought to obtain a value for this 1s lamb shift by measuring the same transition and subtracting from theory.

In my article on the Deuterium Lyman Alpha line I said I thought it was perhaps a little surprising that if the Hydrogen and Deuterium 1s - 2s transitions could be measured with such precision, why not also the 1s - 2p 3/2 transitions ? Herzberg's 1950s measurement remains the most accurate we have of this particular transition - at least for Deuterium. In his paper he explains why he measured Deuterium and not Hydrogen 1s - 2p 3/2.
 
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FAQ: Learn the Fundamentals of the Diffraction Grating Spectrometer

What is a diffraction grating spectrometer?

A diffraction grating spectrometer is a scientific instrument used to analyze the properties of light. It consists of a grating, a device with a series of closely spaced parallel lines, which separates light into its component wavelengths. This allows scientists to measure the intensity and wavelength of light, which can provide valuable information about the composition and structure of materials.

How does a diffraction grating spectrometer work?

A diffraction grating spectrometer works by using the principle of diffraction, which is the bending of light as it passes through a narrow slit or closely spaced lines. The grating in the spectrometer acts as a diffraction grating, separating the different wavelengths of light. The light then passes through a slit and is focused onto a detector, which measures the intensity of light at each wavelength.

What are the applications of a diffraction grating spectrometer?

A diffraction grating spectrometer has a wide range of applications in various fields of science, including astronomy, chemistry, and physics. It is commonly used to study the properties of light emitted by stars and other celestial bodies, as well as to analyze the composition of materials in chemistry experiments. It is also used in the development of optical instruments and in the study of atomic and molecular structures.

How do you use a diffraction grating spectrometer?

To use a diffraction grating spectrometer, you first need to set up the instrument by aligning the grating, slit, and detector. Then, you can place the sample or light source in front of the slit and adjust the instrument to select the desired wavelength range. The detector will then measure the intensity of light at each wavelength, which can be recorded and analyzed to gather information about the sample or light source.

What are the advantages of using a diffraction grating spectrometer?

A diffraction grating spectrometer offers several advantages over other methods of light analysis. It is highly accurate and precise, allowing for the measurement of even small changes in light intensity. It also has a wide range of wavelength coverage, making it suitable for a variety of applications. Additionally, it is a non-destructive technique, meaning the sample or light source is not altered or damaged during the analysis process.

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