Magnetic field inside a solenoid

In summary, the conversation discusses a problem with a derivation and visual representation of a concept involving angles and infinitesimals. The correct relation is derived, and the book mentioned as a reference is not reliable. The conversation also includes an illustration of the problem and an explanation of the correct derivation.
  • #1
fisher garry
63
1
1576606983811.png
1576607004731.png


1576607180280.png

I have a problem with the derivation above I don't get how
1576607218544.png

Can someone derive this and illustrate this visually for example by using Figure 2 or using another drawing?
 
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  • #2
It looks wrong to me. The book should have ##\theta## going clockwise with ##\theta = 0## as the vertical, and be integrating from ##-\frac{\pi}{2} + \theta_0## to ##\frac{\pi}{2} - \theta_0##.

It looks like the book has two wrongs making a right.

PS with the above I get ##dx = \frac{r d\theta}{\cos \theta}##
 
  • #3
well it is not from a textbook it is a document I recieved. Unfortunately I am a bit lost from
1576610265489.png

and the equations afterwards. Could you derive how to get to:
1576610310258.png

starting from
1576610504513.png
 
  • #4
fisher garry said:
well it is not from a textbook it is a document I recieved. Unfortunately I am a bit lost from
View attachment 254268

You're lost because that is wrong. Try what I posted.
 
  • #5
1576643791061.png


I have tried to illustrate my problem in the drawing above. Since ##r d\theta## is normal to the radius r and approximately linear since it is a short part of the bowlength the angle between dx and ##r d\theta## should be the same as the angle between r and x that makes cosinus. But what if the fraction ##\frac{r d\theta}{dx}## and the ##\frac{r }{x}## is not the same? We don't know the length of ##r d\theta## measured up to r and the length of dx measured up to x?
 
  • #6
fisher garry said:
View attachment 254289

I have tried to illustrate my problem in the drawing above. Since ##r d\theta## is normal to the radius r and approximately linear since it is a short part of the bowlength the angle between dx and ##r d\theta## should be the same as the angle between r and x that makes cosinus. But what if the fraction ##\frac{r d\theta}{dx}## and the ##\frac{r }{x}## is not the same? We don't know the length of ##r d\theta## measured up to r and the length of dx measured up to x?
Angles and infinitesimals - ugh.

Maybe this explanation helps.
##r d\theta## is the arc length, call that da,which for a radius r perpendicular to the axis would have dx = da.
A we deviate from the vertical, r increases in length, the arc length da is no longer parallel to the axis. We have to find the dx portion of da.
 
  • #7
fisher garry said:
View attachment 254289

I have tried to illustrate my problem in the drawing above. Since ##r d\theta## is normal to the radius r and approximately linear since it is a short part of the bowlength the angle between dx and ##r d\theta## should be the same as the angle between r and x that makes cosinus. But what if the fraction ##\frac{r d\theta}{dx}## and the ##\frac{r }{x}## is not the same? We don't know the length of ##r d\theta## measured up to r and the length of dx measured up to x?

As I said above, I'll take ##\theta## going clockwise from the vertical, so that ##\theta## and ##x## have the same sign.

##x = R\tan \theta, \ \ R = r\cos \theta, \ \ x = r\sin \theta##

##dx = R \sec^2 \theta d\theta = \frac{r d\theta}{\cos \theta}##
 
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Likes fisher garry
  • #8
fisher garry said:
@fisher garry: can you please let us know which book you referred for above relation in your picture posted?
 

FAQ: Magnetic field inside a solenoid

What is a solenoid?

A solenoid is a coil of wire that is tightly wound in a helix shape. It is commonly used in electronic devices to create a magnetic field.

How is a magnetic field created inside a solenoid?

A magnetic field is created inside a solenoid when an electric current flows through the wire. The flow of electrons generates a magnetic field that is perpendicular to the direction of the current.

What factors affect the strength of the magnetic field inside a solenoid?

The strength of the magnetic field inside a solenoid is affected by the number of turns in the coil, the current flowing through the wire, and the material of the core (if present). Increasing any of these factors will result in a stronger magnetic field.

Does the direction of the magnetic field inside a solenoid depend on the direction of the current?

Yes, the direction of the magnetic field inside a solenoid is determined by the direction of the current. If the current is flowing in a clockwise direction, the magnetic field will be in a counterclockwise direction, and vice versa.

Can the magnetic field inside a solenoid be turned on and off?

Yes, the magnetic field inside a solenoid can be turned on and off by controlling the flow of current through the wire. When the current is turned off, the magnetic field will also dissipate.

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