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DatsRadBro
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Biology? Biochemistry? Chemistry? Geology? Physics?
What do you think?
What do you think?
That is incredibly gross hyperbole. Consider, as one example out of many, a semiconductor device company. A candidate with strong applied math competency, and nothing else, could be considered, e.g., for a position in the quality or reliability depts doing statistical analysis. But he wouldn't be considered for device design, device fabrication, or device testing positions.Nidum said:The subjects offering the best employment prospects at graduate entry level in industry are always the ones which have a strong core content of applied maths .
A graduate with applied maths skills can be trained quite quickly to do almost any task and employers know this .
CrysPhys said:That is incredibly gross hyperbole.
CrysPhys said:If you want as near a guarantee of employment as possible, become an MD.
That's a distorted and incorrect assessment of what I wrote. If the question is what course of study and what degree will give you the highest probability of getting a job upon completion, an MD is either at or near the top of the list. Unless there's some magic breakthrough in which people don't get sick, don't get injured, don't grow old ..., there won't be a market inversion for medical doctors between the start of the program and the completion of the program. You can't say that for most other fields. What motivates people to enter any field of endeavor (whether it's employability, money, power, fame, serving the public good, saving the polar bears, solving world hunger, ...) is not for me to pass judgement on.StatGuy2000 said:@CrysPhys, we do not need someone who chooses to pursue a medical degree solely for the sake of employment (rather than the desire to help people, which should be the primary, if not the only, reason to pursue medicine). So you are not giving the OP good advice.
CrysPhys said:That's a distorted and incorrect assessment of what I wrote. If the question is what course of study and what degree will give you the highest probability of getting a job upon completion, an MD is either at or near the top of the list. Unless there's some magic breakthrough in which people don't get sick, don't get injured, don't grow old ..., there won't be a market inversion for medical doctors between the start of the program and the completion of the program. You can't say that for most other fields. What motivates people to enter any field of endeavor (whether it's employability, money, power, fame, serving the public good, saving the polar bears, solving world hunger, ...) is not for me to pass judgement on.
ETA: My career has spanned the semiconductor meltdown of the early 1990's, the Internet Bubble Burst of the early 2000's, and the worldwide financial crisis of 2008. Many people's lives (including my own) were disrupted by these market conditions. And many people (including myself) had to leave the careers that they had originally chosen because they had an innate passion for them and switch to other fields out of necessity. So, yes, ChemE's became MDs, EE's became high-school teachers, and physicists became patent agents ... not because early in life they had a calling from within or from on high, but because of practical realities. But why or how they ended up changing careers was not dispositive on how competent they became, how effective they became, or how dedicated they became in their new careers.
Let me pose a hypo to you: Your life depends on a tricky surgical operation. You have a choice between Surgeon A, a technically brilliant surgeon with an impressive track record, and Surgeon B, a marginally competent surgeon with a mediocre track record. On the record, Surgeon A has stated that he became an MD because of the stable career trajectory and the opportunity to earn big bucks. On the record, Surgeon B has stated that he became an MD because of an innate desire to help people and serve the public good. Which surgeon would you choose?
StatGuy2000 said:I am not disputing that an MD will give the graduate of such programs a high probability of stable employment, at least in the US (the situation is similar but somewhat more complicated in Canada, which will require a whole separate thread). But what you ignore is that to enter a medical program, at least in the US and Canada, one needs to complete a minimum of 2 or 3 years of a pre-med program where they are required to take a number of STEM courses (and more often than not, most people end up pursuing a 4 year full degree program). Then such a student will need to take the MCAT or some equivalent medical entrance exam, and then apply to numerous medical schools (which tend to be highly competitive to enter, especially the more prestigious the school). Then the student will need to pursue another 4 years of medical school, and then upon graduation will need to complete another 3-7 years of residency before finally earning his/her license. That is a total of approximately 9-15 years from the time a student enters university until he/she earns his/her medical license.
By contrast, to become, say, an electrical engineer, will only require a completion of a 4 year bachelor's degree, plus (in Canada) a completion of 4 years of work experience under a licensed electrical engineer (as an engineer-in-training or engineering graduate) before writing the professional engineering exam and getting licensed. That's only 8 years.
StatGuy2000 said:To start off, your hypothetical doesn't ring true, because for Surgeon A to earn that track record, he would have had to become tremendously dedicated in pursuing the path to an MD degree plus specializing in the surgical field he works in during his residency. To get there would necessarily involve at least some (actually, a considerable) level of interest/dedication/passion to help the patient (see my earlier comment), even if it wasn't the initial motivation to enter the field. Not even the most brilliant individual out there can develop an impressive track record in any field without considerable trial and effort.
The topic of the thread is employability. You compared an MD program with a BSEE program. Just to clarify: Are you claiming that a BSEE has the same near-guarantee of employability that an MD has, at least in Canada? What was the job market in Canada like for freshly minted BSEEs in the aftermath of the Internet Bubble Burst in the early 2000's and in the wake of the demise of Nortel, which dumped an army of EEs onto the job market? In comparison, how did freshly minted MDs fare over the same period?StatGuy2000 said:By contrast, to become, say, an electrical engineer, will only require a completion of a 4 year bachelor's degree, plus (in Canada) a completion of 4 years of work experience under a licensed electrical engineer (as an engineer-in-training or engineering graduate) before writing the professional engineering exam and getting licensed. That's only 8 years.
CrysPhys said:The topic of the thread is employability. You compared an MD program with a BSEE program. Just to clarify: Are you claiming that a BSEE has the same near-guarantee of employability that an MD has, at least in Canada? What was the job market in Canada like for freshly minted BSEEs in the aftermath of the Internet Bubble Burst in the early 2000's and in the wake of the demise of Nortel, which dumped an army of EEs onto the job market? In comparison, how did freshly minted MDs fare over the same period?
The most employable science majors vary depending on the job market and industry demand. However, some of the top science majors that consistently have high employment rates include computer science, engineering, biology, chemistry, and physics.
Some key skills that are important for success in these science majors include critical thinking, problem-solving, analytical skills, attention to detail, and strong communication skills. These skills are highly valued by employers in the science industry.
There are a wide range of job opportunities available for these science majors. Some common career paths include research and development, data analysis, engineering, healthcare, environmental science, and technology. These majors can also lead to jobs in various industries such as pharmaceuticals, biotechnology, government, and education.
The average salary for these science majors can vary greatly depending on the specific job, industry, and location. However, according to the National Association of Colleges and Employers, the average starting salary for computer science majors is $68,668, engineering majors is $67,998, biology majors is $46,056, chemistry majors is $50,671, and physics majors is $63,938.
To make yourself more competitive in the job market with these science majors, it is important to gain practical experience through internships, research projects, or part-time jobs related to your field. Additionally, developing a strong professional network, staying up-to-date on industry trends, and continuously developing your skills and knowledge can also make you stand out to potential employers.