Negative energy when a laser goes through lithium niobate crystal?

[gggnano]

TL;DR Summary

Apparently this should/must be a thing, I will try to explain...

A screenshot from a book which describes it:

So I am trying to picture this one:

1. A laser is "pumped" through a cylinder made from lithium niobate which is placed at 90 degrees, perpendicularly...so that the laser passes through the body of the cylinder (and not through the 2 round ends).
2. The ends have 2 metal mirrors on them
3. Then once the laser passes the cylinder it emerges as a stream of negative-normal photon stream...

Since the new wave of light has negative/positive photons can the negative photon be manipulated? It will have a mass and as such how it's going to interact with the rest of the light in the room? Or if you shoot another laser which touches the negative photon? Or what if an electron interacts with it, such as a common magnetic dipole placed crossing the negative photons? It seems too simple and I'm missing something...thank you!

 

[gggnano]

This is what lithium niobate cylinder looks like, so when you simply turn a laser on on this table and you put a silver cap on top of this cylinder a negative energy will come from the other end of the cylinder??

https://sc04.alicdn.com/kf/Hcc1aa0f085d84cf482732b4cc3f24ebaH.jpg

 

[PeterDonis]

a book

What book?

The quote you give looks like nonsense, so I strongly suspect the book is not a valid source for PF discussion. But we need to know what book it is to make that judgment for certain.

 

[gggnano]

^ The original is here, quite the fascinating paper but far from peer-reviewed??

https://www.earthtech.org/publications/davis_STAIF_conference_1.pdf

The author claims that someone called "Davies" in 2001 had written this if you scroll to the section about squeezed light and the picture of a fast-rotating mirror, figure number 3. The book I found from said Davis is from 2003 and it was titled "how to make a time machine" or something like that.

 

[gggnano]

Authors identified, both gentlemen seem to have Phds from American alma maters, so far so good, it surely isn't complete pseudo-science? But even as someone who works with lasers once yearly this setup seemed too simple and explained in a weird way. To elaborate -OK you will generate "virtual photons" but then what? Even electromagnetism can be explained by them yet what they are suggesting that the mirror will filter the negative photons so that now you have negative energy suitable to stabilize a wormhole?

https://earthtech.org/team/

 

[Vanadium 50]

H.E. "Hal" Puthoff is a crackpot..er...parapsychologist. I would not consider this a reliable source.

 

[gggnano]

H.E. "Hal" Puthoff is a crackpot..er...parapsychologist. I would not consider this a reliable source.

Oh so it's the same guy?? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harold_E._Puthoff

Yeah, the parapsychology stuff is beyond bizarre but the wiki claims his Phd is in electrical engineering from Stanford, at least that kind of people should have an idea of how lasers work.

 

[tade]

Oh so it's the same guy?? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harold_E._Puthoff

Yeah, the parapsychology stuff is beyond bizarre but the wiki claims his Phd is in electrical engineering from Stanford, at least that kind of people should have an idea of how lasers work.

yeah he seems to have quite the physics-based background

 

[PeterDonis]

^ The original is here, quite the fascinating paper but far from peer-reviewed??

https://www.earthtech.org/publications/davis_STAIF_conference_1.pdf

The "negative energy" claims by Puthoff and his colleagues have been made for decades, and have been debunked by other physicists for just as long. The concept of "squeezed light" by itself is fine, and there are plenty of papers in the literature dealing with squeezed light; but the idea that "negative energy" can be produced by "squeezing the vacuum" instead of light is nonsense. (So is the related claim implied in the paper that "negative energy" can be produced by means such as the Casimir Effect. We have had other PF threads on this.)

The paper's discussion of "exotic" stress-energy, in itself, is fine; however, "negative energy" is not a good description of what this involves. (Generally speaking, energy condition violations involve positive energy density and negative pressure, where the pressure is negative enough that the effective "source" of gravity, heuristically, causes gravitational "repulsion" instead of "attraction". Dark energy, which is what is causing the expansion of the universe to accelerate, is an example of this.) Technically speaking, it is true that "vacuum fluctuations" of quantum fields can be exotic; but the magnitude of such effects are miniscule on ordinary scales. (Dark energy's effects on accelerated expansion require hundreds of millions or billions of light years of distance to become appreciable in magnitude.)

I have not checked the reasoning behind the claim that a laser going through a lithium niobate crystal can produce exotic stress-energy, but on the face of it I am skeptical.

 

[gggnano]

On another note I'm curious if they're correct, then what? A virtual photon will have a mass so colliding with a real one will release gamma photons and everything nearby gets deadly irradiated? And if the photons are isolated then you can use them to surround a magnetic Morris-Thorne wormhole, "stabilize" it? Googling however gives no other results of their claims, just this very paper no citings, no videos of a test, nothing.

 

[PeterDonis]

if they're correct, then what?

It's not clear to me from the paper what experimental consequences, if any, they claim to follow from their theory.

 

[tade]

On another note I'm curious if they're correct, then what? A virtual photon will have a mass so colliding with a real one will release gamma photons and everything nearby gets deadly irradiated? And if the photons are isolated then you can use them to surround a magnetic Morris-Thorne wormhole, "stabilize" it? Googling however gives no other results of their claims, just this very paper no citings, no videos of a test, nothing.

if they're correct, i wonder how much energy it'll take to drive an Alcubierre drive with its negative energy requirements

i think NASA's Sonny White was exploring the idea

 

[gggnano]

if they're correct, i wonder how much energy it'll take to drive an Alcubierre drive with its negative energy requirements

i think NASA's Sonny White was exploring the idea

There are countless issues with the Alcubierre's drive, it may be possible one day who knows but I'd suspect it's impossible, it needs closed timelike curvatures, violates casuality, requires negative mass which may be impossible in our universe and frankly even if it was possible then you can just create infinite motion since negative mass repulses everything and positive one (our own) attracts everything so you have "runaway", "hook-up" effect. I'm also not sure how are they planning to use energy from the cavity between the Casimir plates since it's on a nanoscale.

If we dig deeper into this it becomes a better fit for the "beyond the standard model" speculative physics domain, surely not quantum mechanics regardless of its interpretation.

 

[tade]

There are countless issues with the Alcubierre's drive, it may be possible one day who knows but I'd suspect it's impossible, it needs closed timelike curvatures, violates casuality, requires negative mass which may be impossible in our universe and frankly even if it was possible then you can just create infinite motion since negative mass repulses everything and positive one (our own) attracts everything so you have "runaway", "hook-up" effect. I'm also not sure how are they planning to use energy from the cavity between the Casimir plates since it's on a nanoscale.

If we dig deeper into this it becomes a better fit for the "beyond the standard model" speculative physics domain, surely not quantum mechanics regardless of its interpretation.

well I guess that's what Fig. 3 is for, the "concentrated negative energy"