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force5
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Is the cosmos a perpetual motion machine?
force5 said:Is the cosmos a perpetual motion machine?
force5 said:Hi Chronos,
I think that sometimes appearances can be deceiving. Since I don't think the cosmos is a perpetual motion machine, then logic tells me that the fundamental force must exist somewhere outside of the cosmos. I have a model that demonstrates how this would work, of course following strict guidelines laid down by our present day theories.
Thanks for your thoughts on the matter.
force5 said:Thank you, Olias,
I like your description and clarification of the terms used. And I am in complete agreement with your interpretation. So, does this Perpetual Motion State require anything to prevent it from eventually running down?
ray b said:even little bits of it are in perpetual motion, as in an atom's orbiting electrons
or will a photon travel forever?
from our limited time scale anyway, both look like perpetual motion to me
force5 said:Shrumeo, I would say you need work with no exchange of energy from outside the system.
Your questions about "where is the heat going?" and "into the other cosmos?", does no make much sense to me. I'm work under the assumption that the cosmos is total existence and therefore, heat or energy is confined to this one and only cosmos.
I can try to phrase the question a different way if you are truly interest.
Thanks for your reply.
geometer said:While this may be a nonsense subject as shrumeo says, it points out an interesting dichotomy (?) in the laws of physics. There are laws that apply within the Universe, but don't apply to the Universe as a whole. For example, within the Universe, perpetual motion machines are forbidden, mainly by the First Law of Thermodynamics which says that you can't create energy from nothing. However, Special Relativity requires that the vacuum have a negative pressure equation of state which gives it the characteristic of being a resovoir of unlimited energy (See "Cosmological Physics," by John A Peacock, page 26), kind of an energy out of nothing scenario. So, the Universe itself (the vaccuum) kind of gets around the First Law of Thermodynamics. Also, Special Relativity requires that information cannot travel faster than the speed of light, but, there is nothing that says space-time itself cannot travel at any speed. In fact, the Inflationary Big Bang Theory has space-time expanding at MUCH faster than the speed of light during the inflationary period. Again, the Universe as a whole is exempt from this aspect of Special Relativity.
force5 said:Hi Chronos,
I think that sometimes appearances can be deceiving. Since I don't think the cosmos is a perpetual motion machine, then logic tells me that the fundamental force must exist somewhere outside of the cosmos. I have a model that demonstrates how this would work, of course following strict guidelines laid down by our present day theories.
Thanks for your thoughts on the matter.
Perpetual motion is the hypothetical concept of a machine that can run indefinitely without any external energy source. It would continue to move and perform work without ever stopping or slowing down.
According to the laws of thermodynamics, perpetual motion is not possible. The first law states that energy cannot be created or destroyed, only transferred or converted. The second law states that in any energy transfer, some energy will be lost as heat. Therefore, a machine cannot continuously generate energy without any loss, making perpetual motion impossible.
The cosmos, or the universe, is often used as a metaphor for a perpetual motion machine. This is because the universe is constantly expanding and moving, seemingly without any external energy source. However, this is not truly perpetual motion as the universe is subject to the laws of thermodynamics and is not truly endless.
No, it is not possible to create a perpetual motion machine. Many inventors and scientists have tried to design and build such machines, but they have all failed due to the laws of thermodynamics. While certain systems can appear to run continuously, they are still subject to energy loss and will eventually stop.
The concept of perpetual motion has played a significant role in scientific and technological advancements. While it is not possible to create a true perpetual motion machine, the pursuit of it has led to important discoveries and inventions in areas such as energy conversion and conservation. Additionally, the study of perpetual motion has helped to solidify the laws of thermodynamics, which are fundamental principles in physics.