Possible to derive geodesics from the wavefunction?

In summary, the conversation discusses the possibility of deriving the geodesic equation from the time dependent Schrödinger equation by incorporating a dilation factor based on the time dilation effect. However, it is noted that PBS Spacetime should not be used as a basis for developing a deeper understanding or new concepts and a textbook on quantum field theory is recommended for those interested in exploring the relationship between relativity and quantum mechanics. Additionally, it is mentioned that personal theories and speculation should not be discussed in the forum.
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Gotbread
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TL;DR Summary
Does time dilation applied to the wave function lead to acceleration?
Background

While watching Does time cause gravity? from PBS Spacetime, i wondered if its possible to "derive" the geodesic equation
not from GR alone, but by assuming each particle is described by an extended wave function and the time evolution
of this wave is not constant but the rate varies depending on position, based on the time dilation.

Mathematical attempt

We start with the time dependent schrödinger equation for a free particle:

$$i\hbar\frac{\partial}{\partial t} \Psi(x, t) = \frac{-\hbar^2}{2m} \frac{\partial^2}{\partial x^2} \Psi(x, t)$$

Now we add a dilation factor in. As a simple approximation we assume a constant acceleration field
which would result in a linear dilation factor:

$$D(x) = \frac{1}{1+kx\epsilon }$$

Where ##k## is a vector pointing along the acceleration field and ##\epsilon ## is the linearized factor
which describes the strength of the field. The result ##D(x)## describes the relative clock rate
of something at the position ##x## as seen from the perspective of someone sitting at ##x=0##.
If you are "higher up" in the field you would have a higher clock rate ##(>1)## as seen by our observer,
if you are "lower" you would have a lower clock rate ##(<1)## as seen by the observer.
For a more accurate model one would have to derive the position dependent clock rate from e.g. the schwarzschild
metric, but as a linear approximation for small scales (size of a particle) it should be good enough. Since on
e.g. Earth the time dilation effect is very small, ##\epsilon## will be very small as well.

Now we modify our original equation to include the dilation rate:

$$i\hbar\frac{\partial}{\partial t} \Psi(x, t) = D(x)\frac{-\hbar^2}{2m} \frac{\partial^2}{\partial x^2} \Psi(x, t)$$

Now we plug in the initial state of a single particle at rest and see what happens. Of course it will initially
spread out, but will it pick up momentum?

And if so, is this acceleration experienced consistent with the same acceleration we would get from "normal"
gravity?
 
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  • #2
Gotbread said:
Summary:: Does time dilation applied to the wave function lead to acceleration?
No. PBS Spacetime is fun, but it’s not a real textbook and it oversimplifies so much that it can’t be used as a basis for developing a deeper understanding or new concepts. If you want to explore the relationship between relativity and quantum mechanics you’ll need a textbook on quantum field theory. Srednicki is one of the few that is available online. Lancaster and Blundell “Quantum field theory for the gifted amateur” isn’t free but is an easier read; anything that simplifies beyond that probably isn’t worth reading,

Please do respect the forum rule about not allowing personal theories and speculation.
 
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FAQ: Possible to derive geodesics from the wavefunction?

Can the wavefunction be used to describe the paths of particles?

Yes, the wavefunction can be used to derive the geodesics or paths of particles in quantum mechanics. This is because the wavefunction contains information about the probability of a particle being in a certain position, and this probability can be used to calculate the trajectory of the particle.

How does the wavefunction relate to the concept of geodesics?

The wavefunction is related to the concept of geodesics through the Schrodinger equation, which describes the evolution of the wavefunction over time. This equation contains terms that correspond to the kinetic and potential energy of a particle, which are essential components in determining the geodesic or path of the particle.

Are there any limitations to deriving geodesics from the wavefunction?

Yes, there are limitations to deriving geodesics from the wavefunction. One limitation is that the wavefunction only provides information about the position of a particle, not its momentum. This means that the wavefunction cannot fully describe the trajectory of a particle, as momentum is also a crucial factor in determining geodesics.

Can the wavefunction be used to derive geodesics in classical mechanics?

No, the wavefunction is a concept in quantum mechanics and cannot be applied to classical mechanics. In classical mechanics, the concept of geodesics is described by the equations of motion, such as Newton's laws of motion, rather than a wavefunction.

How does the concept of geodesics in quantum mechanics differ from that in general relativity?

In quantum mechanics, the concept of geodesics is related to the wavefunction and describes the path of a particle in terms of probabilities. In general relativity, geodesics describe the path of an object in the curved spacetime caused by the presence of massive objects. The two concepts are fundamentally different and cannot be directly compared.

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