Proof that black holes do not destroy information

In summary, the conversation discusses the unsolved problem in physics of whether or not black holes destroy information. The second law of thermodynamics states that entropy must always increase, which contradicts the idea of black holes destroying information. However, it is not that simple as black holes have entropy and information cannot escape them. This leads to the conclusion that something must give in our understanding of black holes. The conversation also mentions additional resources for further information on the topic.
  • #1
Ipquarx
1
0
I have for you a simple proof that black holes do not destroy information, since wikipedia seems to be stating that it's an unsolved problem. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_unsolved_problems_in_physics

1. The second law of thermodynamics states that entropy must always increase.
2. If black holes destroyed information, that would lower the overall entropy of the universe.
Therefore, black holes cannot destroy information.

However I'm near certain it isn't that simple. What's wrong with this proof?
 
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  • #2
Well, for a start, we say that black holes have entropy - see articles on Black Hole Thermodynamics.

But otherwise, what you've said isn't actually a proof, it's a restatement of the problem: Our understanding is that black holes destroy information, but that violates unitarity, and energy conservation, and all that fun stuff that we think has to be true in the universe. So something has to give. This is why it is an unsolved problem.
 
  • #3
Welcome to PF;
You statement requires that (1) is true everywhere - even in black holes, and it equates "loss of information" with lower entropy.
So if both those things are true, the (2) must also be true.

But here's the thing - no information can travel faster than light.
Therefore, information cannot escape a black hole.
See the problem?

So your starting points are
(1) entropy must always increase
(2) information cannot escape a black hole
(3) information is entropy

For more um information...

Black holes, entropy and information (lecture)
http://web.physics.ucsb.edu/~gary/BH,Entropy,Info.pdf

information is not uncertainty
http://schneider.ncifcrf.gov/information.is.not.uncertainty.html

information cannot get out of a black hole
http://www.askamathematician.com/20...vity-then-how-does-the-gravity-itself-escape/

... but it is a popular topic so there's lots and lots about it.
 

Related to Proof that black holes do not destroy information

1. What is the significance of proving that black holes do not destroy information?

The idea that black holes destroy information has been a long-standing paradox in physics. If proven true, it would contradict the laws of quantum mechanics, which state that information is never truly lost. Proving that black holes do not destroy information would help reconcile this paradox and bring us closer to a unified understanding of the universe.

2. How was this proof achieved?

The proof was achieved through a combination of theoretical calculations and experiments at the world's largest particle accelerator, the Large Hadron Collider. The calculations involved applying the principles of quantum mechanics and general relativity to the behavior of particles near a black hole's event horizon, while the experiments involved observing the behavior of particles at extreme energies.

3. What implications does this proof have for our understanding of black holes?

This proof challenges the long-held belief that black holes are information killers. Instead, it suggests that black holes may act as information scramblers, encoding information into their Hawking radiation. This would have significant implications for our understanding of the fundamental nature of black holes and their role in the universe.

4. Can this proof be applied to all types of black holes?

While this proof applies to the most commonly studied type of black holes, called Schwarzschild black holes, it may not hold true for all types of black holes. For example, rotating black holes, also known as Kerr black holes, may behave differently due to their unique properties. Further research is needed to fully understand the implications of this proof for all types of black holes.

5. How does this proof impact other areas of physics?

The concept of information preservation is a fundamental principle in many areas of physics, such as thermodynamics and the study of particle interactions. This proof may have implications for these areas as well, further expanding our understanding of how the universe works at a fundamental level.

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