Pulley system on rough surface.

In summary: Let total length of string be ##x## and displacement of smaller block be ##u## and bigger block be ##p## in some time ##t##.So,$$u + p = x$$$${(du)^2\over dt^2} + {(dp)^2\over dt^2} = {(dx)^2\over dt^2}$$$$\text{vertical acceleration of m} + \text{horizontal acceleration of M} = 0$$$$\text{vertical acceleration of m} = -a$$if we take magnitude, then ##\text{vertical acceleration of m} = a
  • #1
Buffu
849
146

Homework Statement


[/B]
Question :- Find the acceleration of block of mass ##M##. The coefficient of friction between blocks is ##\mu_1## and between block and ground is ##\mu_2##.

free body diagram at the end.

Variables :-
##f_1## - friction between blocks.
##f_2## - friction between block and ground.
##N_2## - Normal reaction between blocks.
##N_1## - Normal reaction between block and ground.
##T## - Tension in the string.
##a## - acceleration of the blocks since string is in-extendable.
##M < m##

Homework Equations



Since small block will move down, and big one right.
$$ma = mg - (f_1 + T) \qquad (1)$$
$$T - (N_2 + f_2) = Ma \qquad (2)$$
$$N = Mg + f_1 \qquad (3)$$

If big block moves right then, pulleys will move right and small block will move right. Thus big block is non inertial frame. So we add the adequate pseudoforces to balance out unbalanced forces.

##N_2 = ma \qquad (4)##

The Attempt at a Solution



##(1) + (2)##

$$a = mg - f_1 - N_2 - f_2 $$

$$a = mg - N_2 - ( f_2 + f_1 )$$

$$a = mg - N_2 - ( \mu_1 N_2 + N_1 \mu_2 )$$

substituting ##(3)## and ##(4)##

$$a(m + M) = mg - ma-(ma\mu_1 + \mu_2(Mg + f_1))$$
$$a(2m + M + \mu_1) = mg - \mu_2(Mg + ma\mu_1)$$
$$a(m(2 + \mu_1 + \mu_1 \mu_2) + M) = g(m - \mu_2 M)$$
$$a = {g(m - \mu_2 M)\over (m(2 + \mu_1 + \mu_1 \mu_2) + M)}$$

But the given answer is ##a = {[2m - \mu_2(M + m)]g\over M + m[5 + 2(\mu_1 + \mu_2)]}##.
I think the given solution is incorrect, because i can't find any error in my calculations but i am not sure.
Please check my free body diagrams in the picture below and my equations. I think any error in those would be sufficient for me to proceed ahead.

My kindest Thanks for your time and help.

asdaasf.png
 
Last edited:
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  • #2
Is it correct to assume that the vertical acceleration of m equals the horizontal acceleration of M?
 
  • #3
Buffu said:
N2 - Normal reaction between blocks.
N1- Normal reaction between block and ground.
Did you mean those the other way around? It's a bit inconsistent with the other suffixes.
Buffu said:
a - acceleration of the blocks
Their horizontal accelerations are the same, clearly, but what about the vertical acceleration of m?

TSny beat me to it.
 
  • #4
I believe you are missing some of the tension forces T that act on the big block M.
 
  • #5
TSny said:
Is it correct to assume that the vertical acceleration of m equals the horizontal acceleration of M?

I think vertical acceleration will also be ##a##.

Let total length of string be ##x## and displacement of smaller block be ##u## and bigger block be ##p## in some time ##t##.
So,

$$u + p = x$$
$${(du)^2\over dt^2} + {(dp)^2\over dt^2} = {(dx)^2\over dt^2}$$
$$\text{vertical acceleration of m} + \text{horizontal acceleration of M} = 0$$
$$\text{vertical acceleration of m} = -a$$
if we take magnitude, then ##\text{vertical acceleration of m} = a##

May you please point my mistake ?
haruspex said:
Did you mean those the other way around? It's a bit inconsistent with the other suffixes.

Their horizontal accelerations are the same, clearly, but what about the vertical acceleration of m?

TSny beat me to it.

Sorry for inconsistency. I wrote what i mean, did not mean it other way.
 
  • #6
Buffu said:
Let total length of string be xxx and displacement of smaller block be uuu and bigger block be p
There are two horizontal strings that change length, but only one vertical.
 
  • #7
Buffu said:
Let total length of string be ##x## and displacement of smaller block be ##u## and bigger block be ##p## in some time ##t##.
So,

$$u + p = x$$
$${(du)^2\over dt^2} + {(dp)^2\over dt^2} = {(dx)^2\over dt^2}$$
$$\text{vertical acceleration of m} + \text{horizontal acceleration of M} = 0$$
I don't follow this. The string can be broken into four sections as shown
upload_2016-10-21_15-51-45.png
 
  • #8
TSny said:
I don't follow this. The string can be broken into four sections as shown
View attachment 107810

So should it be like this :-

$$L_1 + L_2 + L_3 + L_4 = x$$
$${d(L_1)\over dt^2} + {d(L_2)\over dt^2} + {d(L_3)\over dt^2} + {d(L_4)\over dt^2} = {d(x)\over dt^2} $$
$${d(L_1)\over dt^2} + 0 + 2{d(L_3)\over dt^2} = 0$$
$$\text{vertical acceleration of m} + 2\text{horizontal acceleration of M} = 0$$
$$\text{vertical acceleration of m} = |2\text{horizontal acceleration of M}| $$
$$\text{vertical acceleration of m} = |2a| $$
 
  • #9
Yes, that looks good. (Your notation for second derivatives is a bit off.)
 
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Related to Pulley system on rough surface.

1. How does friction affect a pulley system on a rough surface?

Friction can significantly impact the efficiency and effectiveness of a pulley system on a rough surface. The rougher the surface, the more friction there will be, causing the pulley to require more force to move. This can result in decreased mechanical advantage and increased wear on the pulley system.

2. What type of pulley is best suited for a rough surface?

A fixed pulley or a compound pulley system with multiple fixed and movable pulleys tend to work best on rough surfaces. This is because they are able to distribute the load and minimize the impact of friction on the system. Additionally, using pulleys with ball bearings can also help reduce friction on rough surfaces.

3. How can I reduce friction in a pulley system on a rough surface?

One way to reduce friction is by using lubricants on the contact points of the pulley. This can help to create a smoother surface and reduce the resistance caused by friction. Another option is to use pulleys with ball bearings, which are designed to minimize friction and improve the efficiency of the system.

4. Can a pulley system work on any type of rough surface?

While a pulley system can work on most surfaces, the rougher the surface, the more friction there will be, which can impact the efficiency and effectiveness of the system. It is important to consider the surface and choose the appropriate type of pulley system for optimal performance.

5. What factors should I consider when choosing a pulley system for a rough surface?

When choosing a pulley system for a rough surface, it is important to consider the weight of the load, the amount of friction on the surface, and the type of pulley that will work best. It may also be helpful to test different pulley configurations and lubricants to determine the most efficient and effective option for your specific situation.

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