Relative Velocity and Angles of Movement (Sears & Zemansky's Exercise)

In summary: I'm just a little confused as to why the problem statement would specify "30.0° from the vertical" if they meant horizontal. Seems like a careless mistake.Thanks for...well, the confirmation mostly. I'm just a little confused as to why the problem statement would specify "30.0° from the vertical" if they meant horizontal. Seems like a careless mistake.In summary, the conversation was about a problem where a firework explodes into fragments and the question is about finding the angles at which two fragments move with respect to the horizontal, as measured by a spectator standing on the ground. The official solution gives an answer of ±25.4°, but the person discussing the problem is having trouble
  • #1
Argonaut
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Homework Statement
In a Fourth of July celebration, a firework is launched from ground level with an initial velocity of 25.0 m/s at 30.0° from the vertical. At its maximum height it explodes in a starburst into many fragments, two of which travel forward initially at 20.0 m/s at ±53.0° with respect to the horizontal, both quantities measured relative to the original firework just before it exploded. With what angles with respect to the horizontal do the two fragments initially move right after the explosion, as measured by a spectator standing on the ground?
Relevant Equations
Basic trigonometry
The official solution says ±25.4°, but I'm having trouble reproducing it. Here is my solution:

1) The components of the velocity of firework F with respect to the ground G in the moment of explosion are the following (Notice, I'm using sin, because the statement says 30.0° from vertical.)

$$v_{F/G-x}=\sin{30,0^{\circ}} * 25.0 \textrm{m}/\textrm{s}=12.5\textrm{m}/\textrm{s}$$

$$v_{F/G-y}=0$$

2) The components of the velocity of the piece of shrapnel S are the following (for the sake of simplicity, observing only the one flying above the horizontal):

$$v_{S/G-x}=v_{S/F-x}+v_{F/G-x}=(\cos{53,0^{\circ}} * 20.0 \textrm{m}/\textrm{s}) + 12.5\textrm{m}/\textrm{s} = 24.5 \textrm{m}/\textrm{s}$$

$$v_{S/G-y}=v_{S/F-y}+v_{F/G-y}=(\sin{53,0^{\circ}} * 20.0 \textrm{m}/\textrm{s}) + 0=16.0\textrm{m}/\textrm{s}$$

3) Finding the angle:

$$\alpha = \tan^{-1}{(v_{S/G-y}/v_{S/G-x})} = 33.1^{\circ}$$

Therefore, the two pieces of shrapnel move at ±33.1° with respect to the horizontal and as measured by a spectator standing on the ground.

Except that the official solution says ±25.4°
, which is the value I get if at step 1, I calculate the x component of the velocity of the firework using the cosine and not the sine, so if ##v_{F/G-x}=\cos{30,0^{\circ}} * 25.0 \textrm{m}/\textrm{s}=21.65\textrm{m}/\textrm{s}##. But the statement says 30.0° from vertical.

Am I misunderstanding what 'from vertical' means? Or have I made some other trig error?
 
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  • #2
Well reasoned, well explained, well calculated, well presented. And with good reverse engineering of the book answer.

Nicely done.
 
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  • #3
jbriggs444 said:
Well reasoned, well explained, well calculated, well presented. And with good reverse engineering of the book answer.

Nicely done.
Does this mean the book answer is wrong, you reckon?
 
  • #4
Argonaut said:
Does this mean the book answer is wrong, you reckon?
Yes, the book is wrong. It will not be the first time. Nor the last.
 
  • #5
jbriggs444 said:
Yes, the book is wrong. It will not be the first time. Nor the last.
Thanks! I thought I was going mad, but it was good practice at least.
 
  • #6
Argonaut said:
Thanks! I thought I was going mad, but it was good practice at least.
hei sir.i'm sorry to say maybe the book is right.
maybe firework with an initial velocity of 25.0 m/s at 30.0° with respect to the horizontal.
and it was calculated that the answer is 25.4
 
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  • #7
YanZhen said:
hei sir.i'm sorry to say maybe the book is right.
maybe firework with an initial velocity of 25.0 m/s at 30.0° with respect to the horizontal.
and it was calculated that the answer is 25.4
Hello! I've copied the homework statement word for word, and it explicitly says "30.0° from the vertical".
 
  • #8
I located the exercise on the web and can confirm:
https://physica.cloud/ajab/uploads/2018/10/Hugh-D.-Young-Roger-A.-Freedman-A.-Lewis-Ford-University-Physics-with-Modern-Physics-with-MasteringPhysics%C2%AE-13th-Edition-Addison-Wesley-2011.pdf said:
3.75 .. In a Fourth of July celebration, a firework is launched from ground level with an initial velocity of at 30.0° from the vertical. At its maximum height it explodes in a starburst into many fragments, two of which travel forward initially at at with respect to the horizontal, both quantities measured relative to the original firework just before it exploded. With what angles with respect to the horizontal do the two fragments initially move right after the explosion, as measured by a spectator standing on the ground?

[There are quite a few hits. None of the ones I looked at are Sears and Zemansky, but none say 30 degrees from the horizontal]
 
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  • #9
It's the 13th edition of Sears and Zemansky's University Physics:
unnamed.jpg
 
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  • #10
Argonaut said:
It's the 13th edition of Sears and Zemansky's University Physics:
View attachment 315962
then,either the question or the answer is wrong.
 
  • #11
@Argonaut I did the problem myself and got the same answer as you. As you mentioned in the OP you get the book answer if you choose ##30 ^{\circ}## to be from the horizontal (instead of the vertical as stated in the problem)

Looking at the instructor's solution manual (which I will not distribute) they also chose ##30 ^{\circ}## to be from the horizontal (instead of the vertical as stated in the problem) and that is how they got to an answer of ##\theta = 25.4 ^{\circ}##.

So your answer is right based on the question given. Theirs (the solution manual's) is not. When a person is tasked with solving hundreds to thousands of problems they are bound to make mistakes.

You are right, and good on you for checking the alternate scenario when you felt something was off.
5C0EB2E9-03E8-4456-8A49-2DF6C69CFFC3.jpeg
 
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  • #12
PhDeezNutz said:
@Argonaut I did the problem myself and got the same answer as you. As you mentioned in the OP you get the book answer if you choose ##30 ^{\circ}## to be from the horizontal (instead of the vertical as stated in the problem)

Looking at the instructor's solution manual (which I will not distribute) they also chose ##30 ^{\circ}## to be from the horizontal (instead of the vertical as stated in the problem) and that is how they got to an answer of ##\theta = 25.4 ^{\circ}##.

So your answer is right based on the question given. Theirs (the solution manual's) is not. When a person is tasked with solving hundreds to thousands of problems they are bound to make mistakes.

You are right, and good on you for checking the alternate scenario when you felt something was off.
Thanks for confirming.
 
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FAQ: Relative Velocity and Angles of Movement (Sears & Zemansky's Exercise)

What is relative velocity?

Relative velocity is the velocity of an object in relation to another object. It takes into account both the speed and direction of the objects, and is typically measured in meters per second (m/s).

How is relative velocity calculated?

Relative velocity can be calculated by subtracting the velocity of one object from the velocity of the other object. The resulting value is the relative velocity between the two objects.

What is the difference between relative velocity and absolute velocity?

Relative velocity takes into account the motion of one object in relation to another, while absolute velocity is the velocity of an object with respect to a fixed point in space. Relative velocity is dependent on the observer's frame of reference, while absolute velocity is constant regardless of the observer's frame of reference.

How does angle of movement affect relative velocity?

The angle of movement between two objects affects their relative velocity because it determines the direction in which the objects are moving in relation to each other. If the angle of movement is parallel, the relative velocity will be equal to the difference in the objects' speeds. If the angle of movement is perpendicular, the relative velocity will be equal to the sum of the objects' speeds.

What is the significance of relative velocity in everyday life?

Relative velocity plays a significant role in everyday life, especially in transportation. For example, when driving a car, the relative velocity between your car and other cars on the road determines the safety distance needed to avoid collisions. In sports, relative velocity is important in calculating the trajectory of a thrown or kicked object, such as a baseball or soccer ball. It also plays a crucial role in the navigation of aircraft and spacecraft.

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