Sensing current in a conductor

In summary, a current transformer will not work to produce a voltage in a coil. If you want to produce a voltage, you will need to use a Hall effect pickup or use a wire that has been connected to a metal core, which will produce a magnetic field that will be perpendicular to the coil and will induce a voltage.
  • #1
Moosemunch
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If I have 120 vac power cord and I wrap a coil around one of the conductors, will a current/voltage be produced in the coil? If so what are the equations that could be used to characterize this arrangement? I.e., how many coils, what size wire, etc. To produce a certain voltage in the coil?
 
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  • #2
Moosemunch said:
If I have 120 vac power cord and I wrap a coil around one of the conductors, will a current/voltage be produced in the coil? If so what are the equations that could be used to characterize this arrangement? I.e., how many coils, what size wire, etc. To produce a certain voltage in the coil?
Welcome to the PF. :smile:

Try Googling "current transformer". Let us know if you have questions about that reading. :smile:
 
  • #3
berkeman said:
Welcome to the PF. :smile:

Try Googling "current transformer". Let us know if you have questions about that reading. :smile:
Looked there but didn't find exactly what I was looking for. Want to wrap the coil directly around the conductor without using an iron or steel ring. This config is what I'm interested in. Will it produce a voltage without an iron ring?
 
  • #4
Moosemunch said:
Want to wrap the coil directly around the conductor
In that case, the magnetic field from the current in the conductor will be at a right angle from what you need to induce a voltage in the pickup coil. Not going to work that way, sorry.

I'll try to find some good reading for you to learn about how transformer action works. Basically, the primary current needs to generate a magnetic flux, and that changing magnetic flux needs to be flowing through the area of a pickup coil. The magnetic flux generated by a current in a conductor flows around that conductor, so if you wind the pickup coils around the conductor, they are parallel to the magnetic field instead of orthogonal to it, and will not pick up any induced voltage...

If you cannot use a current transformer, your next choice is to use a Hall effect pickup for measuring the current (and its magnetic field). Have you looked into Hall effect sensors yet? :smile:
 
  • #5
First figure shows the magnetic B-field generated by a current in a wire. Second figure shows how a changing B-field needs to pierce the area of a conducting loop to induce a changing voltage in that conductive loop...

http://hyperphysics.phy-astr.gsu.edu/hbase/magnetic/imgmag/magcur2.gif

magcur2.gif


https://www.ux1.eiu.edu/~cfadd/1360/30MagSrcs/Images/Fig30.06.jpg

Fig30.06.jpg
 

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Ok. First question answered. Thank you.
Next question:
Is a metal core "ring" required to surround the conductor or can the secondary coil be a simple "air" coil positioned circumfrentially (perpendicular) to the conductor?
Side newbie question; How do you include a picture or sketch in a post?
 
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  • #7
Moosemunch said:
Is a metal core "ring" required to surround the conductor or can the secondary coil be a simple "air" coil positioned circumfrentially (perpendicular) to the conductor?
Running the wire through the core of a toroid and wrapping many turns of a sensing coil around the toroid gives you the best coupling and the highest signal-to-noise, which gives you a better and more accurate measurement of the AC current in the wire. You can just put an air-core coil next to the wire, oriented in the same plane as the wire so that the B-field shown in the first figure goes through the plane of the coil. You need the changing B-field piercing the surface of the circle that is inside the coil in order to induce the AC voltage in your pickup coil.

BTW, this technique is used in high frequency EM Interference debugging, where you use a "sniffer probe" which is a 1-turn air-core coil that you connect to a preamp and spectrum analyzer. You "trace" the high frequency currents through wires and metal chassis parts as you try to figure out why your product is radiating certain EM frequencies that can be a problem in passing FCC testing.

https://www.langer-emv.de/fileadmin/near field probes sniffer probes current correction magnetic field correction EMC RF Langer EMV-Technik 02.jpg

es%20current%20correction%20magnetic%20field%20correction%20EMC%20RF%20Langer%20EMV-Technik%2002.jpg

Moosemunch said:
Side newbie question; How do you include a picture or sketch in a post?
To upload a PDF or JPEG image, click the UPLOAD button in the lower right of the Edit window. To link to a picture on the web, click the little picture icon (between the smileys icon and the 35mm film icon on the toolbar), and paste in the URL. :smile:
 

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  • #8
Moosemunch said:
Ok. First question answered. Thank you.
Next question:
Is a metal core "ring" required to surround the conductor or can the secondary coil be a simple "air" coil positioned circumfrentially (perpendicular) to the conductor?
Side newbie question; How do you include a picture or sketch in a post?

Even after all this, I don't believe that you've understood the explanation, or the physics, that has been given to you. I think Faraday's law has hardly been mentioned directly.

Secondly, I am not quite sure what this is leading to. You obviously have something in mind that you wish to do, but you're not telling us.

Finally, you ARE aware that there are commercially-available clip-on probe that attaches to a multimeter, aren't you? This is simply a clip that forms a closed loop that you can clamp onto a wire to mainly check if there is current flow and the magnitude, even in AC mode.

Zz.
 
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FAQ: Sensing current in a conductor

How does current sensing work in a conductor?

Current sensing in a conductor involves measuring the flow of electric current through the conductor. This is typically done by using a device called a current sensor, which detects the magnetic field generated by the current and converts it into an electrical signal that can be measured.

What is the purpose of sensing current in a conductor?

Sensing current in a conductor is important for a variety of reasons, including monitoring and controlling power usage, detecting electrical faults, and ensuring proper functioning of electrical systems. It is also used in various industries such as power generation, automotive, and renewable energy.

What are some common methods for sensing current in a conductor?

Some common methods for sensing current in a conductor include using a shunt resistor, a hall effect sensor, a Rogowski coil, or a current transformer. Each method has its own advantages and is chosen based on the specific application and requirements.

How accurate is current sensing in a conductor?

The accuracy of current sensing in a conductor depends on various factors such as the type of sensor used, the quality of connections, and external factors such as temperature. Generally, current sensing can be accurate within a range of 1-5% of the measured current.

Can current sensing be done in both AC and DC circuits?

Yes, current sensing can be done in both AC and DC circuits. However, different methods may be used for each type of circuit, as the flow of current in AC circuits is constantly changing, while in DC circuits it remains constant. It is important to choose the appropriate method based on the type of current being sensed.

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