Why don't these methods give me the same answer?

In summary, the Large Hadron Collider is 27.00 km long and accelerates protons to 0.999997828 times the speed of light. According to an observer at rest with respect to the building, it would take the proton 9.00 x 10-5 seconds to pass through the tunnel. However, to an observer moving with the proton, the time would be dilated by a factor of 0.00208614, resulting in a time of 1.88 x 10-7 seconds.
  • #1
Fewmet
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Homework Statement


The tunnel of the Large Hadron Collider is 27.00 km long. The LHC accelerates protons to a speed of 0.999997828 times the speed of light. How long would it take the proton to pass through the tunnel according to an observer at rest with respect to the building? To an observer moving with the proton?

∆x=27.00 km = 9.00 x 10-5light seconds
v=0.999997848c

Homework Equations


Δx′=γ(Δx−vΔt)
Δt′=γ(Δt−vΔx/c2)
L=L0
ΔT=γΔT0

The Attempt at a Solution


For an observer at rest with respect to the building
vav=Δx/Δt
∆t=9.00 x 10-5 seconds

I think that part is fine. I tried two different approaches to finding the time in the reference frame of the proton, and got two different answers.

First approach
Treat this as two events:
Event 1) at t=0 and x=0 the proton is at one end of the collider. Then
t' = 0 s and
x' = 0 light seconds
event 2) at t= 9.00 x 10-5 seconds and x= 9.00 x 10-5 light seconds the proton is at the other end of the collider. Using the Lorentz transformations with v= 0.999997824 c, I get
x'= 9.39 x 10-8 light seconds
t'=9.39 x 10-8 seconds

So ∆t = 9.30 x 10-8 seconds - 0 seconds = 9.30 x 10-8 seconds.

Second Approach
From the perspective of the proton, the collider moves towards it at 0.999997824 c. The collider has a rest length of 9.00 x 10-5 light seconds, so an observer moving with the proton sees L, where
L=L0/γ = 9.00 x 10-5 light seconds * 0.00208614
=1.88 x 10-7 light seconds.

A body of that length moves past the observer in time t:
t =L/v= 1.88 x 10-7 light seconds/0.999997824 c =1.88 x 10-7 seconds.

The second approach is getting me twice the time of the first approach. I also see the same discrepancy in the relativistic lengths. I know I am overlooking something fundamental, but cannot see what.
 
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  • #2
Any help would be appreciated. A:The first approach is incorrect. The two events have to be:Event 1: x = 0, t' = 0Event 2: x' = 9.00 x 10-8 light seconds, t = 9.00 x 10-5 secondsThe second approach is correct. The time dilation factor is the same for both events.
 

Related to Why don't these methods give me the same answer?

Why don't these methods give me the same answer?

1. What is the purpose of using multiple methods in scientific research?

Using multiple methods allows for greater reliability and validity in the results obtained. It also helps to cross-validate findings and provides a more comprehensive understanding of the phenomenon being studied.

Why don't these methods give me the same answer?

2. What factors can influence the results obtained from different methods?

Some factors that can influence the results obtained from different methods include differences in measurement techniques, variations in experimental conditions, and individual differences among participants.

Why don't these methods give me the same answer?

3. How can conflicting results from different methods be reconciled?

Conflicting results can be reconciled by carefully examining the methods used, potential sources of error, and considering the strengths and limitations of each method. Further research may also be needed to better understand the phenomenon.

Why don't these methods give me the same answer?

4. Can one method be considered more reliable than another?

There is no one-size-fits-all answer to this question as different methods have their own strengths and limitations. Some methods may be more reliable for certain types of data or in specific contexts. It is important to carefully consider the research question and choose the most appropriate method for obtaining reliable results.

Why don't these methods give me the same answer?

5. How can I ensure the accuracy of my findings when using multiple methods?

To ensure accuracy, it is important to carefully plan and conduct each method, pay attention to detail, and minimize potential sources of error. Additionally, using a combination of quantitative and qualitative methods can provide a more complete and accurate understanding of the phenomenon being studied.

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