ATF disrupts skinhead plot to assassinate Obama

[fourier jr]

Well Fidel Castro, for one, is surprised that Obama is still alive:

ATF disrupts skinhead plot to assassinate Obama

By LARA JAKES JORDAN, Associated Press Writer Lara Jakes Jordan, Associated Press Writer – 8 mins ago

WASHINGTON – Federal agents have broken up a plot to assassinate Democratic presidential candidate Barack Obama and shoot or decapitate 102 black people in a Tennessee murder spree, the ATF said Monday.

In court records unsealed Monday, federal agents said they disrupted plans to rob a gun store and target a predominantly African-American high school by two neo-Nazi skinheads. Agents said the skinheads did not identify the school by name.

Jim Cavanaugh, special agent in charge of the Nashville field office for the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives, said the two men planned to shoot 88 black people and decapitate another 14. The numbers 88 and 14 are symbolic in the white supremacist community.

The men also sought to go on a national killing spree, with Obama as its final target, Cavanaugh told The Associated Press.

"They said that would be their last, final act — that they would attempt to kill Sen. Obama," Cavanaugh said. "They didn't believe they would be able to do it, but that they would get killed trying."

An Obama spokeswoman traveling with the senator in Pennsylvania had no immediate comment.

The men, Daniel Cowart, 20, of Bells, Tenn., and Paul Schlesselman 18, of West Helena, Ark., are being held without bond. Agents seized a rifle, a sawed-off shotgun and three pistols from the men when they were arrested. Authorities alleged the two men were preparing to break into a gun shop to steal more.

Attorney Joe Byrd, who has been hired to represent Cowart, did not immediately return a call seeking comment Monday.

Cowart and Schlesselman are charged with possessing an unregistered firearm, conspiring to steal firearms from a federally licensed gun dealer, and threatening a candidate for president.

The investigation is continuing, and more charges are possible, Cavanaugh said.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20081027/ap_on_el_pr/skinhead_plot

 

[GCT]

Neo Nazis are not only a group of commonly depraved morons it is perhaps the only group where their ideology itself is utterly contradictory and ridiculously nonsensical.

Nazism is soley German movement.

Nazis at one time made a ordered list of which nations are more superior to others - for propaganda purposes of course - the Irish were among the list that were ranked unfavorably relative to Africans. Many of the people who join the Neo Nazis would find that they were included in the subsection of nationalities that were actually ranked close to the Africans.

 

[turbo]

The two "conspirators" are likely idiots with no real chance of getting past SS details and killing Obama. That said, such little pods of idiots could provide cover to very serious people who DO want to assassinate Obama, so the ATF and the SS need to be quite vigilant, lest there be a serious attempt on Obama's life with the cover of requisite "loon" patsies to take the heat.

 

[mgb_phys]

neo-Nazi 'skinheads'. Agents said the 'skinheads'

Why the link? Do they describe Afgan insurgents as bearded bombers?
Those of us who are rapidly becoming 'folically challenged' could be offended.

 

[Proton Soup]

this is exactly why it is so heinous that McCain's campaign has been hinting that Obama is an islamic terrorist, it stirs up the crazies.

and McCain's no pure snowflake himself. see, though he'd supposedly complained about the way the war was being run in Vietnam, he didn't have the guts to do anything about it. truth is, we were waging a war of terror on the Vietnamese people. he wasn't up there taking out strategic targets, they were setting villagers on fire with napalm.

after the Forrestal incident, McCain actually had a moment of clarity. he saw what the napalm did to his own men and expressed regret over what he was doing to the Vietnamese people. but he kept on doing it anyway, and not much later was a POW. Maverick, indeed.

 

[LightbulbSun]

Jesus, let's not have another JFK incident. If Obama was assassinated by one of these groups, do you realize what the uproar would be like in this country?

 

[Monique]

Jesus, let's not have another JFK incident. If Obama was assassinated by one of these groups, do you realize what the uproar would be like in this country?

This is what has been in the back of my mind since he was elected candidate. A lot is at stake, let's hope people keep their sanity.

 

[mgb_phys]

Well Fidel Castro, for one, is surprised that Obama is still alive:

He did have the advantage that it was the CIA trying to assassinate him, not a few drunk, inbred morons.

If Obama was assassinated by one of these groups, do you realize what the uproar would be like in this country?

You mean there might be some sort of anti-Nazi skinhead backlash?

 

[Benzoate]

This is what has been in the back of my mind since he was elected candidate. A lot is at stake, let's hope people keep their sanity.

Don't count on it. Even if he is not assassinated, People will lose there sanity if someone finds out that Barack might not be eligible to be president because he was might have been born in another country.

I don't know how Obama acquired such an enormous fanbase equivalently to the fanbase of a major rock band . Do you see at the obama rallys how people scream and cry at his mere presence? Its as if you are at a Beatles Concert. The reactions of obama supporters really gross me out.

 

[mgb_phys]

I thought it was the other chap that was born in a foreign country?

 

[turbo]

Obama was born in Honolulu, Hawaii. McCain was born in Panama.

The people that keep insisting that Obama was born in a foreign country are either ill-informed, willing to believe anything about Obama (there is surely enough of that!), or deliberately lying to try to try to sway others. The Obama campaign has produced a certified copy of his birth certificate, and surely if there was any doubt about the authenticity of that document, the GOP would be in Honolulu's public records office faster than you can blink. The Republicans have all the bases covered on this issue, but they won't say so publicly, preferring to let the right-wing rumor machine spread their lies.

 

[Benzoate]

Obama was born in Honolulu, Hawaii. McCain was born in Panama.

The people that keep insisting that Obama was born in a foreign country are either ill-informed, willing to believe anything about Obama (there is surely enough of that!), or deliberately lying to try to try to sway others. The Obama campaign has produced a certified copy of his birth certificate, and surely if there was any doubt about the authenticity of that document, the GOP would be in Honolulu's public records office faster than you can blink. The Republicans have all the bases covered on this issue, but they won't say so publicly, preferring to let the right-wing rumor machine spread their lies.

I don't know where Obama was born. I am just saying if it turns out to be true that he was born in Kenya and not Hawaii, People will go mad! It wasn't the republicans who suggested he was born in Kenya, It was a Democrat name Phillip J berg. He filed a lawsuit against him.

http://www.worldnetdaily.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=78931

I really don't know where obama was born nor do I really care. But do you own research first before you jumped to conclusions that right wingers are only suggesting that Obama was born in Kenya. The Judge I think has dimissed his case against obama though

 

[lisab]

The Judge I think has dimissed his case against obama though

...because the judge looked at the evidence and concluded Obama was born in Hawaii. Case closed.

 

[Ivan Seeking]

This is what has been in the back of my mind since he was elected candidate. A lot is at stake, let's hope people keep their sanity.

I have talked with a few people who say they won't vote for Obama because they don't want to get him killed.

Of course, this is really just a nice way to say that "I ain't voting for a black guy".

 

[SticksandStones]

I don't know where Obama was born. I am just saying if it turns out to be true that he was born in Kenya and not Hawaii, People will go mad! It wasn't the republicans who suggested he was born in Kenya, It was a Democrat name Phillip J berg. He filed a lawsuit against him.

http://www.worldnetdaily.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=78931

I really don't know where obama was born nor do I really care. But do you own research first before you jumped to conclusions that right wingers are only suggesting that Obama was born in Kenya. The Judge I think has dimissed his case against obama though

Of course you know where Obama was born: Hawaii - JUST LIKE HIS BIRTH CERTIFICATE SAYS.

I didn't think anybody would actually be gullible enough to believe that Obama wasn't an American citizen.

 

[Ivan Seeking]

Recently FactCheck representatives got a chance to spend some time with the birth certificate, and we can attest to the fact that it is real and three-dimensional and resides at the Obama headquarters in Chicago. We can assure readers that the certificate does bear a raised seal, and that it's stamped on the back by Hawaii state registrar Alvin T. Onaka (who uses a signature stamp rather than signing individual birth certificates). We even brought home a few photographs.

http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/born_in_the_usa.html

 

[Proton Soup]

I don't know where Obama was born. I am just saying if it turns out to be true that he was born in Kenya and not Hawaii, People will go mad! It wasn't the republicans who suggested he was born in Kenya, It was a Democrat name Phillip J berg. He filed a lawsuit against him.

http://www.worldnetdaily.com/index.php?fa=PAGE.view&pageId=78931

I really don't know where obama was born nor do I really care. But do you own research first before you jumped to conclusions that right wingers are only suggesting that Obama was born in Kenya. The Judge I think has dimissed his case against obama though

you realize grandma is really old, right? you know that old people get confused, sometimes, especially when you've got aggressive loons trying to confuse them, right?

 

[Ivan Seeking]

IIt was a Democrat name Phillip J berg.

Perhaps Mr. Berg is one of those racist Pennsylvanians that Murtha mentioned.

 

[Ivan Seeking]

you realize grandma is really old, right? you know that old people get confused, sometimes, especially when you've got aggressive loons trying to confuse them, right?

Note that this loon has presented NO evidence. And even if he did, an audio recording of some woman talking is hardly qualified evidence. It is just more nonsense from idiots.

 

[turbo]

I really don't know where obama was born nor do I really care. But do you own research first before you jumped to conclusions that right wingers are only suggesting that Obama was born in Kenya. The Judge I think has dimissed his case against obama though

I have done the research, and have viewed a certified copy of Obama's Hawaii birth certificate on line. It looks very similar to mine, printed on security paper, and signed and notarized by an official at public records. In Hawaii, they seal and sign the back of the certificate. Public records offices stopped giving out photocopies of birth certificates many years ago, citing the risk of identity theft, which is why they are issued on security paper with many security features to prevent tampering.

The LA times put this issue to bed some time ago.
http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/washington/2008/06/obama-birth.html

Snopes has call the "born in Kenya" claim false.
http://www.snopes.com/politics/obama/birthcertificate.asp

The man who brought the frivolous "born in Kenya" lawsuit was a Clinton supporter who was trying to derail Obama during the primaries. Right-wingers were thrilled and have run with his wild claims ever since.
http://www.nation.co.ke/News/-/1056/484146/-/tlhnhg/-/

 

[Ivan Seeking]

Don't count on it. Even if he is not assassinated, People will lose there sanity if someone finds out that Barack might not be eligible to be president because he was might have been born in another country.

And imagine how surprised they will be when it is revealed that Elvis lives on Mars.

I don't know how Obama acquired such an enormous fanbase equivalently to the fanbase of a major rock band . Do you see at the obama rallys how people scream and cry at his mere presence? Its as if you are at a Beatles Concert. The reactions of obama supporters really gross me out.

I know exactly how this happened. The American people see a great leader. And after eight years of Bush, people are desperate for change.

 

[mgb_phys]

Is there any compelling evidence that McCain isn't one of the lizard people?

Everybody else present at the birth is dead - convenient?
Has anyone seen his birth certificate? Does it list his father's name as zog the merciless?
The hosptial, town and entire country were later disposed of to cover up the landing site.
He claims to be from central america but has a Scottish name!

 

[lisab]

Is there any compelling evidence that McCain isn't one of the lizard people?

Everybody else present at the birth is dead - convenient?
Has anyone seen his birth certificate? Does it list his father's name as zog the merciless?
The hosptial, town and entire country were later disposed of to cover up the landing site.
He claims to be from central america but has a Scottish name!

...but, isn't McCain's mom still alive? Oh wait - I guess she would be in on it, too!

 

[turbo]

Is there any compelling evidence that McCain isn't one of the lizard people?

Everybody else present at the birth is dead - convenient?
Has anyone seen his birth certificate? Does it list his father's name as zog the merciless?
The hosptial, town and entire country were later disposed of to cover up the landing site.
He claims to be from central america but has a Scottish name!

His older half-brother Manuel Noriega was imprisoned as a security measure, too. There is just too much solid evidence to ignore the clues.

 

[Benzoate]

Of course you know where Obama was born: Hawaii - JUST LIKE HIS BIRTH CERTIFICATE SAYS.

I didn't think anybody would actually be gullible enough to believe that Obama wasn't an American citizen.

Are you that gullible to believe everything someone tells you without looking at existing evidence. I don't believe something someone has told me, especially coming from a politician's mouth; We know what boy scouts politicians are. *sarcasm*.I never said Obama was not born in Hawaii. But I am not going to automatically debunk claims that say Obama was not born in Hawaii just because there have been exaggerated claims made about obama by right wing talk show hosts. If they evidence is convincing enough, I will be skeptical and open. None of us were there when Obama was born, so we cannot be absolutely sure he is telling the truth. How can Obama have been born in Hawaii if his paternal grandmother says she witness his birth taking place in the delivery room in Kenya?

 

[Benzoate]

Perhaps Mr. Berg is one of those racist Pennsylvanians that Murtha mentioned.

I don think Mr. Berg is racist. Otherwise , he would not have been a member of the NAACP. I don't want to continue this topic. I was only picturing a scenario of how people would act if it was true that Obama turned out not to be a citizen of this country. Don't jumped down my throat.

 

[Benzoate]

And imagine how surprised they will be when it is revealed that Elvis lives on Mars.



I know exactly how this happened. The American people see a great leader. And after eight years of Bush, people are desperate for change.

What makes him such a great leader? What kind of leadership has he exhibited , other than being a community organizer and being able to moved crowds with his speeches. He is just another politician looking for power. He and Mccain both want the bailouts , even though an overwhelming percent of the American public don't want the bailouts. And its not just Bush's fault that this country is in the shape that it is. I blame are overall government . Congress has a much lower approval rating than , Bush below 9 percent. But I bet these same congressmen will get reelected. Remember , Congress didn't officially declared war on Iraq, but most of congress approved Bush's decision to go to Iraq.

 

[turbo]

I don think Mr. Berg is racist. Otherwise , he would not have been a member of the NAACP. I don't want to continue this topic. I was only picturing a scenario of how people would act if it was true that Obama turned out not to be a citizen of this country. Don't jumped down my throat.

You accuse people of "jumping down your throat" when they question your judgment in promoting lies that have been thoroughly debunked. Let's put the shoe on the other foot. YOU come up with evidence (not hearsay, not emails, not right-wing blogs or rabid Hillary supporters) that is convincing and we will all listen. You can't. There is no such evidence. Kenya was a British protectorate when Obama was born, and the Brits keep pretty detailed records. Come up with a birth certificate from Kenya, and I will apologize profusely for any affront (real or imagined) that you have felt in this thread.

Demonizing Obama and trying to de-legitimize his candidacy is a cottage industry. All you need is a gullible nature and an email account so the scammers can spam you. If you want to promote slurs that have been thoroughly discredited, expect to be disregarded, or prepare to offer persuasive proof. You have not offered any evidence. None.

 

[Evo]

Of course you know where Obama was born: Hawaii - JUST LIKE HIS BIRTH CERTIFICATE SAYS.

I didn't think anybody would actually be gullible enough to believe that Obama wasn't an American citizen.

Actually, under US citizenship law, it doesn't matter where he was born because his mother was a US Citizen at the time of his birth. So even if it was proven that he was born outside the US, he's still considered a natural born us citizen. I looked it up, it's in another thread. Kenya was a British Commonwealth country when he was born anyway. Any dual citizenship would have made him a British Commonwealth citizen, but the way the law reads, he would have lost that due to not living there and would have become a sole US national.

Any further off topic posts will be deleted. There is a thread where every angle of this was already discussed.

 

[turbo]

Actually, under US citizenship law, it doesn't matter where he was born because his mother was a US Citizen at the time of his birth. So even if it was proven that he was born outside the US, he's still considered a natural born us citizen. I looked it up, it's in another thread. Kenya was a British Commonwealth country when he was born anyway. Any dual citizenship would have made him a British Commonwealth citizen, but the way the law reads, he would have lost that due to not living there and would have become a sole US national.

Such arguments (correct though they may be) are lost on the people who insist on parroting lies that have been thoroughly discredited. These "talking points" convince only the gullible and/or uneducated, but they can have an effect on an election.

Put this one up there with:
Obama is a Muslim
Obama is an Arab
Obama is a friend of terrorists
Obama is a crooked Chicago politician
etc, etc.

Republicans never mention that Obama was the first black President of the Harvard Law Review, nor that he was a professor of Constitutional Law, nor that he gave up almost certain lucrative positions at high-paying law firms to return to Chicago and help organize communities in South Chicago.

 

[Proton Soup]

Actually, under US citizenship law, it doesn't matter where he was born because his mother was a US Citizen at the time of his birth. So even if it was proven that he was born outside the US, he's still considered a natural born us citizen. I looked it up, it's in another thread. Kenya was a British Commonwealth country when he was born anyway. Any dual citizenship would have made him a British Commonwealth citizen, but the way the law reads, he would have lost that due to not living there and would have become a sole US national.

Any further off topic posts will be deleted. There is a thread where every angle of this was already discussed.

they're both citizens, of course. but i would disagree that McCain fulfills the Constitutional obligation for president. his being born in Panama is a disqualification, IMO.

 

[Benzoate]

You accuse people of "jumping down your throat" when they question your judgment in promoting lies that have been thoroughly debunked. Let's put the shoe on the other foot. YOU come up with evidence (not hearsay, not emails, not right-wing blogs or rabid Hillary supporters) that is convincing and we will all listen. You can't. There is no such evidence. Kenya was a British protectorate when Obama was born, and the Brits keep pretty detailed records. Come up with a birth certificate from Kenya, and I will apologize profusely for any affront (real or imagined) that you have felt in this thread.

Demonizing Obama and trying to de-legitimize his candidacy is a cottage industry. All you need is a gullible nature and an email account so the scammers can spam you. If you want to promote slurs that have been thoroughly discredited, expect to be disregarded, or prepare to offer persuasive proof. You have not offered any evidence. None.

I am not demonizing Obama. Nor do I glorify him like some of his supporters do. He is politician, which means he will inevitably lie to the American public just like any other politician to suit there conveniences. I never claimed that he was NOT born in Hawaii. And I did not here this claim that Obama was born in another country from some chain letter. A Deputy Attorney General filed a lawsuit against Obama about his citizenship. He claims that he had a chance to talk to obama's paternal grandmother and she says she remember Obama's mother delivering obama in the delivery room in Kenya. Not everyone wants to tear obama down because of some right wing agenda.

 

[Evo]

they're both citizens, of course. but i would disagree that McCain fulfills the Constitutional obligation for president. his being born in Panama is a disqualification, IMO.

No, McCain was born on a US Naval Base which is considerd US territory. Plus there is a provision under US law for US citizens born in Panama at that time. McCain wouldn't have even qualified for Panamanian dual citizenship.

 

[Benzoate]

Actually, under US citizenship law, it doesn't matter where he was born because his mother was a US Citizen at the time of his birth. So even if it was proven that he was born outside the US, he's still considered a natural born us citizen. I looked it up, it's in another thread. Kenya was a British Commonwealth country when he was born anyway. Any dual citizenship would have made him a British Commonwealth citizen, but the way the law reads, he would have lost that due to not living there and would have become a sole US national.

Any further off topic posts will be deleted. There is a thread where every angle of this was already discussed.

Yes, I thought a US citizen given birth to a person in another country would automatically make that person a US citizen. But some interpreters of the US constitution claim that you have to be born to two parents who are US citizens in order to be consider a US citizen.

 

[turbo]

OK, one more time, Benzoate. You are floating claims that have been thoroughly debunked by the press and have been abandoned by the GOP because they are untrue. Next, as Evo pointed out, it doesn't matter where Obama was born as long as his mother was a US citizen. He still has US citizenship. Thirdly, you are suggesting that somehow Obama's mother (in some prescient action - "my half-black son could run for president") gave birth to him in Kenya, and raced back home to Hawaii to defraud the Hawaiian authorities into believing that he was born in Honolulu. This is a conspiracy theory that is so outlandish that I can't believe that you might believe it. Some right-wing loon who hates black people? Maybe. A college student who hangs out on PF? Color me puzzled.