Bush caught staging meeting with troops

[russ_watters]

Allison Barber, deputy assistant defense secretary, mentioning "if he [Bush] gives us a question that we have not scripted . . ." - well all it means is that it is not so spontaneous and people have been presumably been prepared for his questions . . . .
http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=4957379

Ok...it wasn't completely spontaneous. Is that a surprise? Is that wrong? Bush has a speechwriter(probably more than one) . Of course someone else wrote the questions! Why is that a revalation?

Lets stay on point, here: what would be bad about this is if someone told the soldiers what to say. Is there any evidence of that? Or worse, people are using the word "scripted". That's a pretty specific word: it means that the soldiers said word-for-word something someone else wrote down in a script. Is there any evidence of that?

edit: I've finally seen the quote from Barber (faust's post). It says that Bush's questions were scripted. Again, duh...?? Once again, he has a speechwriter. He's a politician. What is unusual about that?

[edited]

 

[russ_watters]

Looking back at page one, though many people use the word "scripted" to describe the event in general, no one discusses whether the answers were scripted except me. The quote from Barber says the questions were scripted. I find it hard to believe, but I must ask: is this entire bruhaha about the fact that someone wrote the questions out for Bush or did people really mean that they thought the answers were scripted? The tone of page one certainly implies to me that people thought the answers were scripted.

Ivan's quote uses the word "coaching" and Ivan repeats it. It is clear from the links that the "coaching" of the answers is limited to sequencing, not the content. Ivan's post implies wrongdoing, which would have to mean the answers were coached. Ivan uses the word "scripted" in his second post. By then, the implication that the answers were scripted is more clear. Indeed, since pretty much every word any President ever says is scripted, the only way for this to be newsworthy is if it were the soldiers who were scripted.

 

[russ_watters]

Moonbear asked, but maybe I'll get a response where she didnt:

Is there a quote that says that the soldiers' answers were scripted?

 

[GENIERE]

...Is there a quote that says that the soldiers' answers were scripted?

No, but that's not relavant to the liberal thought process. You must try to understand the liberal mind. The liberal is controlled..
[edit] I figured I would do little research before I tried to explain but when I Googled for "liberal mind", the first hit revealed that the "Liberal Mind" was under new management"
Hopefully, the new management does a better job.
...

 

[rachmaninoff]

I'm amazed with you all. Here we have happy, smiling soliders on television spreading disinformation about a horrific war, and you narrow in on whether or not the press secretary initially admitted that it was scripted? We're lacking perspective.

 

[Skyhunter]

I'm amazed with you all. Here we have happy, smiling soliders on television spreading disinformation about a horrific war, and you narrow in on whether or not the press secretary initially admitted that it was scripted? We're lacking perspective.

You need to search through Penguino's posts and you will come upon one where he says that liberals and conservatives are both immoral, or something to that effect. He reasons that conservatives are comfortable with it, while liberals are in denial.

That is the only reasoning that makes sense as to why they would accept direct evidence that they are being deceived with the attitude, of... Duh.. like you didn't know?...Isn't our president wonderful.

 

[SOS2008]

I'm amazed with you all. Here we have happy, smiling soliders on television spreading disinformation about a horrific war, and you narrow in on whether or not the press secretary initially admitted that it was scripted? We're lacking perspective.

So true. To your point, a quote from below: “You and I are talking about stage craft instead of about how motivated the troops are.” In addition to this point, the president and his administration lied to start the war, and have kept lying ever since--this is just more of that MO. The seriousness of the chain of lies is tremendous.

Focusing on flip flops by the press secretary is not as disconcerting as those who think it's okay that he flip flops, and worse that Bush lies to the American people. Over and over, a main defense is that this is common in politics so what's the big deal? (I'm certain this would not be argued if it was a president these people didn't support. ) For those who constantly excuse the acts of the current administration, the report below addresses exactly that showing how “this White House has taken staging to a whole new level.”

BROWN: In "Wag the Dog," a Washington insider recruits a Hollywood producer to produce a war. I'm in show business, the producer says. Why come to me? War is show business, the insider replies. And besides, we're not going to have a war. Just the appearance of a war.

Well, in Iraq, we do have a war. Also, at times it turns out, the appearance of show business. We saw a bit of it this week and we also saw the machinery backstage. That's part of a larger story, call it the opening act. Here's CNN's Jeff Greenfield.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JEFF GREENFIELD, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): This is what American viewers were supposed to see, the president talking with American officers serving in Iraq. Getting some spontaneous, upbeat assessments. This is what they weren't supposed to see. Defense Department official Allison Barber running through what sounded like a meticulous rehearsal, previewing who would get which questions and how they would be answered?

ALLISON BARBER, PENTAGON OFFICIAL: And in the last 10 months, what kind of progress have we seen?

GREENFIELD: Including guidance on what to do if a spontaneous moment, in fact, popped up.

BARBER: If there's a question that the president comes up with that we haven't drilled through today, then I am expecting the microphone to go right back to you, Captain Kennedy and you to handle.

MIKE ALLEN, "TIME MAGAZINE": This is embarrassing for the White House. It was unintended. You and I are talking about stage craft instead of about how motivated the troops are.

GREENFIELD: For "Time Magazine's" Mike Allen, the idea the White House stages an event is about as shocking as a revelation that the sun rises in the east.

ALLEN: Any White House, not this one in particular, is about control. These people just seem to be better at it.

GREENFIELD (on camera): Which may be the real story here. That a White House that has managed to launch a thousand stories about its carefully-staged events and its carefully-crafted photo opportunities managed to pull off a carelessly staged event.

One thing for sure, any indignation about a White House that stages the news comes about a century too late.

(voice-over): It was President Roosevelt, Theodore, not Franklin, that brought the press photographers along on hunting and camping trips making his vigor and physicality a key element in his political appeal. Those endearing pictures of John Kennedy's family didn't happen by accident but politicians have gotten a lot more blatant about it.

Back in 1972, Republican officials were embarrassed when the press got hold of a script for one of their convention nights. Spontaneous applause moments and all.

By 1996, Democratic operatives briefing the press every day about their scripted convention moments. The Clinton White House took some heat in 1994 when critics charged they staged an emotional moment at a D-Day commemoration at Normandy with President Clinton forming a cross out of stones.

But this White House has taken staging to a whole new level. From the mission accomplished presidential landing aboard an aircraft carrier in 2003.

BUSH: Thank you very much.

GREENFIELD: To town hall meetings and other events where pay they had to sign pledges that they were in fact backing the president. As a tactical matter, it has worked. Until recently when a series of events seemed to have gone awry. This picture of president bush looking down at Hurricane ravaged New Orleans last month seemed to symbolize not engagement but distance.

Repeated visits to the Gulf and the highly dramatic solo walk to the podium from magically lit Jackson Square in New Orleans did not improve the president's job approval numbers.

BUSH: Good evening.

GREENFIELD: Some have even suggested that the entanglement of Karl Rove and other White House aides with the grand jury investigation may be distracting the political team.

(on camera): Or maybe it's just a case of trouble begetting trouble. The country is in a pessimistic mood. Iraq remains troubled. Gas prices are high. The president's Supreme Court pick has angered the base and now inflation may be rearing its ugly head again. As basketball legend and philosopher Bill Russell once said, when things go bad, they go bad. Even public relations.

Jeff Greenfield, CNN, New York.

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0510/14/asb.01.html

 

[loseyourname]

Actually, never mind. I don't even want to get involved in this discussion.

I watched Wag the Dog last night. A delightful movie.

 

[edward]

scripted by any other name is still......

What ever you want to call it. According to this link, it was scripted. The whole reherseal was mistakenly sent to the news media via satellite feed.

http://www.foxnews.com/video2/player05.html?101305/fr_pentagon_101305&FOX_Report&Meeting%20Rehearsed&acc&U.S.%20%26%20World&-1&col

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/linkset/2005/04/11/LI2005041100879.html

"If he gives us a question that is not something that we have scripted, Captain Kennedy, you are going to have that mike and that's your chance to impress us all. Master Sergeant Lombardo, when you are talking about the president coming to see you in New York, take a little breath before that so you can be talking directly to him. You got a real message there, ok?"

 

[Burnsys]

The other day i saw in tv (I think it was cnn) president bush with a hammer building houses in new orleans! What a patetic piece of propaganda.

 

[edward]

Moonbear asked, but maybe I'll get a response where she didnt:
Is there a quote that says that the soldiers' answers were scripted?

Yes.

http://www.foxnews.com/video2/player05.html?101305/fr_pentagon_101305&FOX_Report&Meeting%20Rehearsed&acc&U.S.%20%26%20World&-1&col

 

[solutions in a box]

Why was this so hard for some to believe? Everthing Bush does in a public format is scripted, rehearsed, and staged. It has to be that way or the guy continually keeps putting his
foot in his mouth.

This is no big secret, or perhaps some people just don't want to believe it, but it started shortly after 9/11. By that time it was obvious to his handlers that, except for one liners, Bush was not capable of handling unrehearsed extemporaneous discussions.

I would be the first to admit that he has improved tremendously over the last few years. Perhaps his PR people should have more confidence in him.

After watching the FOX news clip it appears that there are some people at the Pentagon who are really miffed about soldiers being used as stage props.

 

[russ_watters]

"If he gives us a question that is not something that we have scripted..." [emphasis added]

I can't seem to get the Foxnews video to play, but I'll take your word for it that that is what was said. So how does a quote about the questions being scripted imply that the answers were scripted? Does that link show soldiers holding scripts?

 

[edward]

I can't seem to get the Foxnews video to play, but I'll take your word for it that that is what was said. So how does a quote about the questions were scripted imply that the answers were scripted? Does that link show soldiers holding scripts?

It plays rather sporadically? The soldiers are not holding scripts. I don't think that the soldiers would have gone along with that. The woman in charge of the "rehearsal" even used the term script.

It does say that the FOX News sources at the Pentagn were "livid" about soldiers being scripted and rehearsed.

There are a number of clicklable videos and transcripts in the link below. You have to watch some ads before most of them play. Even the one below may show a "Dell window" which must be closed.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/linkset/2005/04/11/LI2005041100879.html

 

[kat]

"Master Sergeant Lombardo, when you are talking about the president coming to see you in New York, take a little breath before that so you can be talking directly to him. You got a real message there, ok?"


great advice to someone who doesn't normally make their living by being on t.v...sorry..don't see a problem with this one in particular.

 

[faust9]

"Master Sergeant Lombardo, when you are talking about the president coming to see you in New York, take a little breath before that so you can be talking directly to him. You got a real message there, ok?"
great advice to someone who doesn't normally make their living by being on t.v...sorry..don't see a problem with this one in particular.

So, how about this being a "spontaneous back-and forth". How do account for that. It was neither spontaneous (a lie from the WH) nor a back-and-forth. It was the president saying his lines and the soldiers saying theirs (they may have written them but once rehersed they bacome lines in a play). How about that Kat? Why are you tring to move the conversation from the lie? Why? The lie was this was a spontaneous exchange--the true was it was a play using US soldiers to give the president some sort of credibility. He used them like he used Armstrong Williams.

 

[kat]

Faust..please show me a link to a spokesperson from the white house saying this is a "spontaneous back and forth" ...I must have missed this somewhere.
Where does it say that the President had "lines" all I've read is that if he didn't ask the questions they've scripted...that would seem to imply that his weren't scripted..
I'm still looking for the lie..where is the lie? and how is someone "caught" if you've invited the media and they are sitting there watching it all happen?

 

[kat]

FYI..I really don't watch tv except by accident.. So, I'm probably not in a position to feel outrage or insult about this...as in general I feel that anyone who is gullible enough to get their info from the TV deserves every bit of misinformation they get. *shrug*

 

[Ivan Seeking]

This is so pathetic. Why bother with the news conference at all? The WH should just release the scripts instead of bothering with the interview.

Does anyone remember the fake turkey dinner diddi - the one that showed Bush eating dinner with soldiers when in fact he was never there?

 

[Ivan Seeking]

FYI..I really don't watch tv except by accident.. So, I'm probably not in a position to feel outrage or insult about this...as in general I feel that anyone who is gullible enough to get their info from the TV deserves every bit of misinformation they get. *shrug*

That depends entirely on the source. But then since most people do get their news from the TV, you should still be outraged at how this administration has abused and mislead the US through its use of the media.

 

[kat]

oh yes, of course Ivan..well, thank you very much for letting me know what I "should" feel. *snarf*

 

[russ_watters]

It plays rather sporadically?

It doesn't play at all - must be a plugin problem, and I couldn't fix it. Anyway...

The soldiers are not holding scripts. I don't think that the soldiers would have gone along with that.

I agree. So what's the problem here?

 

[russ_watters]

The WH should just release the scripts instead of bothering with the interview.

It sounds like you are implying that there was a script for the soldiers. Do you have any evidence of that?

 

[russ_watters]

There are a number of clicklable videos and transcripts in the link below. You have to watch some ads before most of them play. Even the one below may show a "Dell window" which must be closed.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/linkset/2005/04/11/LI2005041100879.html

Ok, there is one in that bunch that is worthy of more attention:

Here's Shepard Smith: "At least one senior military official tells Fox News that he is livid over the handling of U.S. troops in Iraq before their talk by satellite live with the president. . . .

"As the White House tries to prop up support for an increasingly unpopular war, today -- to hear it from military brass -- it used soldiers as props on stage.

"One commander tells Fox it was scripted and rehearsed -- the troops were told what to say to the president and how to say it. And that, says another senior officer today, is outrageous.

Ok, I assume "Shepard Smith" is a reporter (again, there's a link to the Fox video, which doesn't work for me)? Do we have the words this unnamed commander actually said and not just a reporter's interpretation of those words? Do any of the soldiers in the panel say the words they spoke were not their own? I've read quotes from soldiers who say explicitly that the words they spoke were their own.

This is the only report I've seen so far that says the words the soldiers spoke were not their own. I'd like to see some confirmation of that.

 

[kat]

This is the only report I've seen so far that says the words the soldiers spoke were not their own. I'd like to see some confirmation of that.

Surely there must be a soldier signaling his disagreement by giving a signal as another soldier did in this situation:
http://www.snopes.com/photos/military/crossed.asp"

 

[edward]

Surely there must be a soldier signaling his disagreement by giving a signal as another soldier did in this situation:
http://www.snopes.com/photos/military/crossed.asp"

In the close ups the hands of the soldiers did not show. In the long shots all of the soldiers hand their right hand covering their left hand.

Brian Williams NBC news

"It was billed as a chance for the president to hear directly from the troops in Iraq. The White House called it a 'back and forth,' a 'give and take,' and so reporters who cover the White House were summoned this morning to witness a live video link between the commander in chief and the U.S. soldiers in the field, as the elections approach in Iraq.

"The problem was, before the event was broadcast live on cable TV, the satellite picture from Iraq was being beamed back to television newsrooms here in the U.S. It showed a full-blown rehearsal of the president's questions, in advance, along with the soldiers' answers and coaching from the administration.

"While we should quickly point out this was hardly the first staged political event we have covered -- and we've seen a lot of them in the past -- today's encounter was billed as spontaneous. Instead, it appeared to follow a script."

 

[solutions in a box]

This thread is a great example of "people seeing what they want to see" and "believing what they want to believe"

Every major news media outlet had articles and video segments on this story. They were all remarkedly smiliar in that they all used the term "scripted", even FOX.

BTW the video clips from news sources are dissapearing or not working because they are not news any more.

When my neice returned from Iraq minus the lower half of her left arm, she was, dspite her injury, given an extensive debriefing as to what to say and what not to say when she got home. If they would do that to a young mother, they would definitely tell soldiers in Iraq, what to say and what not to say to the freaking president.
Are you geniuses really that out of touch with the real world? Do you really expect to be presented with emperical evidence about happenings in politics and world affairs? That will never happen and you know it. This is not a lab experiment and you know that. But you continuously use it as an excuse for not seeing what is quite evident to others.

 

[SOS2008]

This thread is a great example of "people seeing what they want to see" and "believing what they want to believe"
Every major news media outlet had articles and video segments on this story. They were all remarkedly smiliar in that they all used the term "scripted", even FOX.

BTW the video clips from news sources are dissapearing or not working because they are not news any more.

When my neice returned from Iraq minus the lower half of her left arm, she was, dspite her injury, given an extensive debriefing as to what to say and what not to say when she got home. If they would do that to a young mother, they would definitely tell soldiers in Iraq, what to say and what not to say to the freaking president.

Are you geniuses really that out of touch with the real world? Do you really expect to be presented with emperical evidence about happenings in politics and world affairs? That will never happen and you know it. This is not a lab experiment and you know that. But you continuously use it as an excuse for not seeing what is quite evident to others.

When these people are presented with empirical evidence they still don't accept it. These people believe there were WMD and Saddam was linked to terrorists. I started an entire thread about Dubious Dubya, and still these people won't admit the man is a liar. The man lies--staging is small time to a big time liar.

 

[russ_watters]

I agree with both of you. There are a lot of people in this thread that are just plain seeing things that aren't there. For example:

Every major news media outlet had articles and video segments on this story. They were all remarkedly smiliar in that they all used the term "scripted", even FOX.

The word "scripted" appears twice in the link in the OP. Here are the quotes:

"The truth is that everything that was said was meant to be said, though it may have sounded scripted in some places," Sergeant David Barry-Smith told Logan.

Paul Rieckhoff, director of the New York-based Operation Truth, an advocacy group for U.S. veterans of Iraq and Afghanistan, denounced the event as a "carefully scripted publicity stunt."

So you have one of the soldiers who participated saying it was not scripted and you have a left-wing political activist who wasn't there saying it was. For a liberal ideologue, the choice of who to believe is, of course, obvious.

 

[edward]

So you have one of the soldiers who participated saying it was not scripted and you have a left-wing political activist who wasn't there saying it was. For a liberal ideologue, the choice of who to believe is, of course, obvious.

It is very convient how you pick the sources you want to use out of the many available. You are forgetting or didn't bother to read that Allison Barber also used the term "what we have scripted" as she was rehearsing with the soldiers.

The Fox news link works OK for me. It was getting bombarded with hits over the week end.

http://www.foxnews.com/video2/player05.html?101305/fr_pentagon_101305&FOX_Report&Meeting%20Rehearsed&acc&U.S.%20%26%20World&-1&col

 

[edward]

This thread is a great example of "people seeing what they want to see" and "believing what they want to believe"
Every major news media outlet had articles and video segments on this story. They were all remarkedly smiliar in that they all used the term "scripted", evven FOX.

How true:


American Chronicle Doh! Sure, I'll Believe That! -- Bush's Scripted Conference with ...
American Chronicle, CA - Oct 16, 2005
... The other day President George W. Bush got to thinking how ... thousand that he’s placed in harms way in Iraq. ... he set up a teleconference with the troops to ask ...
Bush Has A Rehearsed Tele-conference With US Troops In Iraq World Forum
First the rehearsal, then the president Barre Montpelier Times Argus
Iraqis ready to vote, US troops tell Bush Leading The Charge
all 10 related »

Administration Coached Troops On What To Say To Bush, Then Lied ...
Blogcritics.org, OH - 11 hours ago
... here in the US, it's clear the Bush Administration only ... about the questions in the highly-scripted event. ... that the President talked to this morning in Iraq? ...

Bush's teleconference with troops in Iraq a bad publicity stunt
Kennebec Journal, ME - 17 hours ago
President Bush's "spontaneous" and "impromptu" teleconference with US ... was propaganda in its most scripted, choreographed and ... positive spin on the war in Iraq. ...

Iraq war: Responses to "Bush chats with troops in well-scripted ...
Atlanta Journal Constitution (subscription), GA - 17 hours ago
... mistake in his videoconference with 10 soldiers in Iraq. ... it is --- the untainted truth, not the scripted version. ... a big PR ploy to make President Bush look good ...

OUR SOLDIERS JUST PROPS FOR BUSH
Niagarafallsreporter.com, NY - 6 hours ago
... Bush's thoroughly rehearsed teleconferenced "conversation" with troops in ... we get a completely scripted and transparently ... the futile war and occupation of Iraq. ...

Wash. Times editorial not convinced that soldiers appearing in ...
Media Matters for America, DC - 5 hours ago
... the October 13 teleconference in which President Bush spoke with soldiers stationed in Iraq. ... that the president's questions had been "scripted" in advance ...

Progressive Broadcaster Squelched
People For the American Way, DC - 6 hours ago
... Assistant Secretary of Defense Allison Barber, the “coach” of the now-infamous staged, scripted satellite feed featuring President Bush and troops in Iraq. ...

Sham puts President on display
Albany Times Union, NY - 11 minutes ago
... fixed smiles on their faces and scripted responses on ... revealed last week said that the Bush administration before ... agency that a post-invasion Iraq would lead ...

Person to Person' comes up short
NorthJersey.com, NJ - 13 hours ago
... Thursday's event - " a conversation with US troops" - was anything but a ... It was a scripted event - a poorly scripted event at that. ... Bush worked from a script. ...

Monday's Our View Watching inflation
Council Bluffs Daily Nonpareil, IA - 3 hours ago
... before a grand jury, further hurricane-relief scandals and his video op with troops in Iraq dismissed as scripted and artificial, President Bush really didn't ...

 

[TRCSF]

So you have one of the soldiers who participated saying it was not scripted and you have a left-wing political activist who wasn't there saying it was. For a liberal ideologue, the choice of who to believe is, of course, obvious.

Well, there is the actual live video feed of white house staff going over the script, telling what the troops exactly what to say and when, down to the chat and small talk. And how if the president goes off the script they should defer to their C.O.

But hey, maybe it's a left-wing media conspiracy from Hollywood liberals who use their special effects technology to just make it look like there's actual video of the troops going over the script.

Of course for a conservative ideologue, the choice is between their own eyes and ears, or the WH spin machine. Got to choose the WH spin machine.

Are you familiar with the fairy tale about the Emperor and his new suit? Did you go over the moral of that story in Kindergarten?

 

[Manchot]

So you have one of the soldiers who participated saying it was not scripted and you have a left-wing political activist who wasn't there saying it was. For a liberal ideologue, the choice of who to believe is, of course, obvious.

Do you really believe that the soldiers were picked at random? The people who were picked would willingly say exactly what the president wanted to hear. I guarantee you they would never allow somebody who had any qualms against the war to participate. Just because the soldiers themselves believe it doesn't make it any more real.

 

[SOS2008]

Maybe we should stop trying to convince Bush supporters that everything he has done has been a scam and to the determent of our country. I think we should let these people continue on with their denial. One day they will wake up and cry "OMG what happened?"

Oh dang, that won’t work because we have to suffer the consequences along with them. Okay, we’ll just provide punch at the next Republican convention.

 

[kat]

Maybe we should stop trying to convince Bush supporters that everything he has done has been a scam and to the determent of our country. I think we should let these people continue on with their denial. One day they will wake up and cry "OMG what happened?"
Oh dang, that won’t work because we have to suffer the consequences along with them. Okay, we’ll just provide punch at the next Republican convention.

Or maybe you should try supporting your case without the propoganda, hyperbole, rhetoric and deceit.