Can You Get Botox for Knees? And Other Joys of Growing Old

[FredGarvin]

I got my hair cut the other day. When I sat down and the woman asked me how I like it cut, she paused and said "we are having a special on hair coloring this week."

Damn.

I'm like Berkeman, I can't do my favorite workouts 2 days in a row any longer . The bumps and bruises I get get every workout now take weeks to disappear .

 

[Ivan Seeking]

I got my hair cut the other day. When I sat down and the woman asked me how I like it cut, she paused and said "we are having a special on hair coloring this week."

I'm sure that you would look good in purple.

My theory is that my barber is somehow killing my hair follicles as I'm sure that it's not all falling out by itself for no good reason.

 

[turbo]

I'm sure that you would look good in purple.

My theory is that my barber is somehow killing my hair follicles as I'm sure that it's not all falling out by itself for no good reason.

My barber is a sweetie that I glommed onto about 25 years ago. She rented a space in a beautician's shop owned by a friend's wife, and I stopped in for a walk-in haircut. My friend's wife was busy and so were most of the other ladies, so she asked if I wouldn't mind getting my hair cut in a back room by the new girl. I said that I'd be pleased to try her out. I asked her how long she had been a beautician and she shot back with "I'm a barber, dammit!" (Much higher licensing standards in Maine for barbers.) She's been cutting my hair ever since. Since I have a severe sensitivity to fragrance chemicals, she either comes to my house to cut my hair, or we arrange to meet in an open-air space and I throw a patio chair and a cape (that she gave me) in my truck.

 

[Ivan Seeking]

I received some very sad news last night and I wanted to mention it, so please ignore the rest of this post if you don't want to read something really depressing.

My longest, oldest, and best friend [after Tsu] in life is now about eighty years old with severe Parkinsons disease. The worst of the complications are now setting in, and keeping in mind that he already had a colostomy and several radical surgeries due to cancer and other problems, his doctor is now worried that they may have to amputate both of his legs. This poor guy has been though hell - the story is years long and gut wrenching - but he is absolutely amazing. Like the Energizer Bunny, he just keeps going. But I think we are finally nearing the bitter end. It is just so sad to see him like this, and so unfair. He has devoted his life to not only education [my high school physics teacher], but also to civil service as a politician dedicated to serving his community. He has been a great asset to his community, and he can claim probably hundreds of scientists as friends and former students. As for me, I can easily attribute my physics degree directly to his contributions to my life. He helped to inspire my love of science and played a large role in converting me from a kid who had ditched 40 days the previous semester [no joke], to an honor roll student, by graduation time.

 

[Huckleberry]

Second Hand Lion

I wish I knew how to properly express sympathy for something like this.

I might have some idea of what you are feeling. My uncle will also be likely to lose his legs sometime in the future. He has diabetes and the blood was not circulating to his legs and feet like it should. He was complaining about numbness and discoloration in his feet and has had vasular shunts put into help. He also has 3 surgically fused vertebrae in his back when two discs were ruptured in a trucking accident. Both conditions seem to be worsening. There isn't much that doctors can do for his back pain. He takes morphine in doses that would kill most people. There seems to be some concern about the effectiveness of the shunts. Does anyone know if shunts are a permanent solution, or does it just buy him some time? Either way it is a matter of time before he is in a wheelchair, which is something I don't think he will survive for very long given his physical nature and age.

He was born in Poland after WW2, lived in France and moved to the US as a child. He volunteered for two tours in Vietnam as a recon marine. He came back with a few more holes, malaria and infertility. He was a drill instructor for a while after the war. He drove truck for several years until he was injured. He's crazy and anti-social and blunt and crude, yet kind, compassionate, curious, independent and loves children and animals. He's my favorite uncle and one of the most interesting people I know.

 

[turbo]

Oooh, boy! My father-in-law was in India, Burma, and SE Asia during WWII helping the indigenous forces build air fields to support the Chinese, acting as a liaison, training, and accompanying them on forays into Japanese-held territory. He suffered the effects of malaria the rest of his life, and when his diabetes kicked in really bad in his 50's he ended up with both legs amputated. He loved to garden, and loved fresh vegetables, so he supplied the soil, the manure, and the seeds, and I supplied the labor. He also raised REALLY hot peppers in a wash-tub in a sunny place in the house, so he could tend to some plants, at least, and he had a nice assortment of cacti and succulents growing on window-sills everywhere. For someone who gave so much for his country, he got so little back from the VA, and it was painful for me to watch him deteriorate. At the time that his health took a nosedive (mid-70s), the VA was overwhelmed with Vietnam vets. If we're going to ask young men to put their lives on the line, we should take care of them in the aftermath.

 

[Astronuc]

I wish I knew how to properly express sympathy for something like this.

You did.

 

[Ivan Seeking]

I wish I knew how to properly express sympathy for something like this.

Thanks. Maybe you or Turbo or Astronuc can answer this: What in the hell do you say to someone who is in this condition? I don't even know how to be a friend other than to commiserate with him. It used to be that I could get his mind off of things, but anymore and understandably, he is completely consumed by his difficulties.

 

[Astronuc]

Thanks. Maybe you or Turbo or Astronuc can answer this: What in the hell do you say to someone who is in this condition? I don't even know how to be a friend other than to commiserate with him. It used to be that I could get his mind off of things, but anymore and understandably, he is completely consumed by his difficulties.

Not knowing your friend it's hard to say what to do. One could try humor - but if one is suffering significant pain or discomfort, humor may not work. I wias thinking that you could tell him that when you grow up, you want to be just like him.

One could convey the appreciation for one's friend, and that he will not be forgotten.

Perhaps one could contact a local hospice or caregivers program. I don't the details out there in Portland - one could check local religious institutions, or try http://www.caregiverconnectionpdx.com/hospice.htm (based on Portland).

 

[turbo]

Thanks. Maybe you or Turbo or Astronuc can answer this: What in the hell do you say to someone who is in this condition? I don't even know how to be a friend other than to commiserate with him. It used to be that I could get his mind off of things, but anymore and understandably, he is completely consumed by his difficulties.

I never knew what to say to my father-in-law, and I could not possibly have said anything pertinent about something as serious as the loss of his legs. Instead, when I stopped in, I talked to him about what we wanted to plant in the garden, about local and state politics, just about anything. We both took our turns steering the conversations and he enjoyed the visits. His wife and his grown children spent a lot of their time with him commiserating over his poor health, asking him if he needed anything, etc, which was appropriate for them to do, but I think that he enjoyed having one-on-one conversations into which his illnesses and dependency did not figure. I never made an effort to ignore "the elephant in the room" and always asked how he was feeling, but after his perfunctory answer to that question, I treated him like any other guy.

I'm sorry, Ivan, but that's all I've got - I hope it helps.

 

[Astronuc]

. . . , but I think that he enjoyed having one-on-one conversations into which his illnesses and dependency did not figure. I never made an effort to ignore "the elephant in the room" and always asked how he was feeling, but after his perfunctory answer to that question, I treated him like any other guy.

And that is the way to go about it. Don't try to ignore the obvious - just treat the person as a person.

 

[Huckleberry]

Thanks. Maybe you or Turbo or Astronuc can answer this: What in the hell do you say to someone who is in this condition? I don't even know how to be a friend other than to commiserate with him. It used to be that I could get his mind off of things, but anymore and understandably, he is completely consumed by his difficulties.

I don't talk to my uncle much. When I do I ask how he is feeling, but never ask details about his health. I visited him before I moved to Portland and was there for a week or so. All that time I only remember him bringing up the subject of his feet once, and that was just to describe the sensation he was feeling on that day. I really had no idea what to say, so I just listened to whatever he wanted to tell me.

I don't know how your friend would react, but I think if I had a problem like this I wouldn't want to spend the rest of my life focusing on it. I wouldn't want it to dominate every relationship. It's hard to talk to someone when you can see in their eyes that they are focused on something else. I would probably want to suffer in silence and keep my relationships the way they were before the illness. If someone did bring it up I would want them to be very direct about it, no messing around trying to spare my feelings. Ask like a child would ask, with the same amount of curiosity and innocence. They have an amazing ability to ask a serious question one minute and the next they are out in the sandbox playing with their matchbox cars. Living life in the moment is probably very important to your friend right now. I imagine he is concerned more with how he will be remembered than what he has done at this point. If you have to pull off the band-aid, do it all at once.

 

[Huckleberry]

Oooh, boy! My father-in-law was in India, Burma, and SE Asia during WWII helping the indigenous forces build air fields to support the Chinese, acting as a liaison, training, and accompanying them on forays into Japanese-held territory. He suffered the effects of malaria the rest of his life, and when his diabetes kicked in really bad in his 50's he ended up with both legs amputated. He loved to garden, and loved fresh vegetables, so he supplied the soil, the manure, and the seeds, and I supplied the labor. He also raised REALLY hot peppers in a wash-tub in a sunny place in the house, so he could tend to some plants, at least, and he had a nice assortment of cacti and succulents growing on window-sills everywhere. For someone who gave so much for his country, he got so little back from the VA, and it was painful for me to watch him deteriorate. At the time that his health took a nosedive (mid-70s), the VA was overwhelmed with Vietnam vets. If we're going to ask young men to put their lives on the line, we should take care of them in the aftermath.

My uncle is also relying on the VA for his care. He takes his drill instructor personality with him to the hospital. If he feels the doctor is giving him the runaround or is incompetent he dogs them until they either give him what he wants or they make it someone elses problem. This has worked well for him and he now receives the care that he is satisfied with.

He is in his mid 60's right now. He also has a garden, 3 donkeys, 3 dogs, 6 or 7 cats and a wife that he cares for. Well, she cares for him too, but they both have medical difficulties and rely on each other to get through the day. In his garden he grows tomatoes, aloe, and a few other things that the wild rabbits mostly eat despite his best efforts to keep them out. He also has some sort of a spicy, brown, dry, pea-looking thing which I can't remember the name of right now.

 

[Danger]

Not meaning to alter the tone of this thread (respects to you, Huck), but it's been dormant for a while.
I just now realized that I'm actually pretty damned old. The tip-off was when I noticed that I have to shave my nostrils more often than my face.

 

[Evo]

Not meaning to alter the tone of this thread (respects to you, Huck), but it's been dormant for a while.
I just now realized that I'm actually pretty damned old. The tip-off was when I noticed that I have to shave my nostrils more often than my face.

We're on the downside of the hill Danger. I look around at work and everyone my age is waddling around due to knee, hip or back problems. I am just happy that I don't waddle - yet.

 

[Lisa!]

We're on the downside of the hill Danger.

My mom is as old as you are! It really upsets me whenever she says such a things!
Growing old is cute, IMO!

I look around at work and everyone my age is waddling around due to knee, hip or back problems. I am just happy that I don't waddle - yet.

Waddle? That reminds me of pengwuino!

 

[Evo]

My mom is as old as you are!

 

[Danger]

My mom is as old as you are!

W has five years on me, and you're crying?

 

[turbo]

My wife and I just planted our entire 1500 ft² vegetable garden this morning. We plant everything in a dozen wide 30'+ raised beds (that saved our garden last summer during the monsoon season!), so there is a LOT of hoeing involved. I spent most of 2 days last week spreading and tilling in a truckload of peat moss and hundreds of pounds of composted cow manure and after this morning's efforts, my arthritic knees are howling! We should have some bumper stickers made up: "Getting Old. It beats the alternative." Well, I'm 55 and after having worked on concrete floors in industrial environments for over 20 years, I'm probably lucky to be in the shape I'm in. The arthritis seems to have been caused by the lack of cartilage in my knees (arthroscopic surgeries on both to remove loose/shredded cartilage).

 

[Lisa!]

why?

 

[Evo]

why?

I'm growing old and I'm all alone. My girls are in college and I'm living alone in this huge PIT OF DOOM. And NO ONE LOVES ME.

I don't even know what to make for dinner, I'm running out of edible shrubbery.

 

[Danger]

I thought that you and the Twister would be cohabitating my now.

 

[Evo]

I thought that you and the Twister would be cohabitating my now.

I drove him insane. Hey, I've been going through a rough time and having to make some serious life affecting decisions lately and my constant whining drove him away.

Tell him to come back, I've still got a good amount of whining left to do.

 

[Lisa!]

I'm growing old and I'm all alone. My girls are in college and I'm living alone in this huge PIT OF DOOM. And NO ONE LOVES ME.

No one? You want to say all PFers are just no one?

Anyway don't forget that if you'd want to go hiking with mountain lions, I'M COMING WITH YOU!

 

[Danger]

I drove him insane.

I'm sure that was a long trip...

Tell him to come back, I've still got a good amount of whining left to do.

How about you do your whining to us and save the good times for him?

Anyway don't forget that if you'd want to go hiking with mountain lions, I'M COMING WITH YOU!

Have you ever actually seen a mountain lion, Lisa? Its head is about the size of your body, and most of that head is teeth. They've been known, in our area, to take down a full-grown buffalo.

 

[Evo]

How about you do your whining to us and save the good times for him?

I would if he would talk to me.

Have you ever actually seen a mountain lion, Lisa? Its head is about the size of your body, and most of that head is teeth. They've been known, in our area, to take down a full-grown buffalo.

Lisa, you have too much going for you right now to go hiking with the mountain lions. If it ever dries up, I can't wait to go hiking again.

 

[Lisa!]

I would if he would talk to me.

Lisa, you have too much going for you right now to go hiking with the mountain lions. If it ever dries up, I can't wait to go hiking again.

You too! It's the time that your daughters(and garndchildren in future)really needs you!

How about you do your whining to us and save the good times for him?

Good idea! Although I'm sure that wouldn't be as good as whining to him!
You know I think 1 of the reasons that women want to have a bf/husband is to nag at them whenever they want to!

Have you ever actually seen a mountain lion, Lisa? Its head is about the size of your body, and most of that head is teeth. They've been known, in our area, to take down a full-grown buffalo.

Nope, I've not! For no better reason that I'm still alive. Anyway 1 of the reasons that I wanted to go hiking with them was to meet() them for the 1st and last time in my life!

 

[Danger]

You know I think 1 of the reasons that women want to have a bf/husband is to nag at them whenever they want to!

Luckily, that isn't true of W. Otherwise, she'd be down the road.

Anyway 1 of the reasons that I wanted to go hiking with them was to meet() them for the 1st and last time in my life!

There's a very good chance that it would be the last time. I remember from back in the early 70's when a kid about 12 years old ran across a cougar on the foot of a mountain in BC. It chased him and he split post-haste. In the running, he lost one of his rubber boots, but he managed to make it home. His family immediately set out to dispatch the cougar. One of them shot it and they dragged it home. Upon disassembly, they discovered that the only thing in that cat's stomach was the rubber boot. Kitty had been so hungry that she swallowed it whole. Had it turned out differently, she would have eaten the boot anyhow, but with the kid still in it.

 

[Ivan Seeking]

My old friend died last night. He was my best buddy for thirty years.

His name was Jim Rossas and he was gift to all who had the pleasure of knowing him. He enhanced the lives of more people than I can even imagine, and he remained active up to the very end. After two full careers - first as a teacher, and then as a politician - he was still a chairman for the California Retired Teachers association.

This is so strange, on one hand I have lost my longest friend in life, and at the same time it's a relief that he passed before his chronic condition got any worse. It was heart breaking to hear what he endured on a daily basis.

Most of us can only hope to contribute as much in life as Jim did.

 

[berkeman]

Sorry to hear of your best friend's passing away. It sounds like he had a long and full life. Best wishes to you and to his family.

 

[Evo]

I'm really sorry to hear that Ivan, it sounded like you cared very much for him. My condolences.

 

[radou]

Sorry to hear that, Ivan.

 

[turbo]

Friends are precious. Sorry to hear about your loss, Ivan.

 

[Ivan Seeking]

Thanks all. This is a tough one. It is slowly sinking in but still seems surreal.

 

[Astronuc]

My condolensces Ivan. It's hard losing a family member and close friend. Even with the fond memories, their absence comes with a certain emptiness in the heart.