Crazy things Creationists have said

[Astronuc]

. . . . they are losing power/control

I think that is the key issue - the use (or misuse) of religion by one or more to exert control over others, as well as the annoyance of having someone trying to impose their belief or otherwise irrational ideas on oneself.

 

[rewebster]

Sorry, but Einstein said it sarcastically. I don't have the exact context, but this Times article should help put it in proper perspective for you.



http://www.time.com/time/magazine/article/0,9171,866292-4,00.html

The correct quote is “I cannot believe that God plays dice with the cosmos.”

Albert Einstein on quantum mechanics, published in the London Observer, April 5, 1964; also quoted as "God does not play dice with the world." in Einstein: The Life and Times, Ronald W. Clark, New York: World Publishing Co., 1971, p. 19.

Another Einstein letter -

I get the sarcasm level of the statement (I really do)--but then using "I" ('I cannot believe...')--it even makes it more 'personal'. I just find it all kind of amusing that he made the statement and denial part of it as being contested. I also get the 'relate it to the general populous' concept. Maybe it was a 'muttered' thought that escaped through his lips----

--------------------------------------------

I have to go again for a little while---but, I really enjoyed this Sunday's morning's gathering and services---

 

[zoobyshoe]

If I hit myself on the thumb with a hammer and exclaim 'my god that hurts', does that mean that I am religious?

A woman I know here told me that one of her ex boyfriends, well known for his strongly held atheistic views, would invariably cry out "Oh God! Oh God!..." upon climaxing.

Hilarious, but it means nothing, of course. It's a phrase people learn to use in extreme moments.

Had Einstein said "Nature does not play dice..." should we conclude he believed in "Mother Nature", in any literal sense? Of course not.

 

[zoobyshoe]

good post, Astronuc--that's a better way than what I said in my Einstein's 'religion' post (I still think Einstein had to have some type 'religion' to use 'God' so relevantly in that dice statement and maybe other statements?--maybe he had 'religion' earlier in his life and was still embedded to some degree)---

It falls into an ideology/spirituality, but not the idea that most think of 'spirituality' (of the spirit world)--more of the 'spirit' to be open minded about almost, if not all, that is presented (including the knowledge of 'religion'). If someone isn't open minded to all knowledge/areas (but still discerning using judgement and reason), the logical deduction is that that person is closed minded.

There are some things studied in the 'sciences' that have always 'crossed over' into the religion area (or vice-versa)---like all the 'psychic' stuff.

I'm not understanding the reason for all the internal quotation marks. Are you trying to indicate italics?

 

[rewebster]

I'm not understanding the reason for all the internal quotation marks. Are you trying to indicate italics?

"Use–mention distinction
Main article: Use–mention distinction
Either quotes or italic type can emphasize that an instance of a word refers to the word itself rather than its associated concept.

Cheese is derived from milk.
“Cheese” is derived from a word in Old English.
Cheese has calcium, protein, and phosphorus.
Cheese has three e’s.
A three-way distinction is occasionally made between normal use of a word (no quotes), referencing the concept behind the word (single quotes), and the word itself (double quotes):

When discussing ‘use’, use “use”."


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quotation_mark

 

[zoobyshoe]

"Use–mention distinction
Main article: Use–mention distinction
Either quotes or italic type can emphasize that an instance of a word refers to the word itself rather than its associated concept.

Cheese is derived from milk.
“Cheese” is derived from a word in Old English.
Cheese has calcium, protein, and phosphorus.
Cheese has three e’s.
A three-way distinction is occasionally made between normal use of a word (no quotes), referencing the concept behind the word (single quotes), and the word itself (double quotes):

When discussing ‘use’, use “use”."


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quotation_mark

Thanks. I had never run into that before. Now I know.

 

[rewebster]

Thanks. I had never run into that before. Now I know.

'know' problem

 

[Kurdt]

Since its come up in this thread I'll ask the question here. Why are so many seemingly obsessed with the notion that the universe has to have meaning? I've honestly never been able to understand why that is so important to people. When they talk about it I just can't get anywhere near the same wavelength they're on and it frustrates me that I can't at least 'empathise' or understand to some extent.

I know that's slightly off topic but if someone will indulge me.

 

[zoobyshoe]

Since its come up in this thread I'll ask the question here. Why are so many seemingly obsessed with the notion that the universe has to have meaning? I've honestly never been able to understand why that is so important to people. When they talk about it I just can't get anywhere near the same wavelength they're on and it frustrates me that I can't at least 'empathise' or understand to some extent.

I know that's slightly off topic but if someone will indulge me.

I think it's pretty simple: if the universe has meaning then each of our lives has meaning. The thought your life might be meaningless is, quite obviously, depressing. It's a basic psychological issue.

 

[Kurdt]

I suppose I can't understand why anybody would think their life was meaningless in that case. Its up to them to give it meaning and that is within everyones power.

Thanks zooby.

 

[Cyrus]

I think it's pretty simple: if the universe has meaning then each of our lives has meaning. The thought your life might be meaningless is, quite obviously, depressing. It's a basic psychological issue.

I don't see why its depressing. More or less, everyones life is meaningless. In the end were all going to die anyways. Its a fact of life, people need to learn to get over this.

 

[Evo]

I think it's pretty simple: if the universe has meaning then each of our lives has meaning. The thought your life might be meaningless is, quite obviously, depressing. It's a basic psychological issue.

I'm with Kurdt, I cannot understand why the universe has to have meaning. It just is. It has nothing to do with me. If the universe has to have meaning in order for their lives to have meaning, then I have a news bulletin for them, their lives have no meaning. Meaning comes from within.

 

[zoobyshoe]

I suppose I can't understand why anybody would think their life was meaningless in that case. Its up to them to give it meaning and that is within everyones power.

People's identities, their self image, is often pretty fragile, especially in adolesence. People form and join cliques mostly to define themselves. To the extent meaning might be already built into existence it would cut way down on that kind of stress and angst.

 

[zoobyshoe]

I don't see why its depressing. More or less, everyones life is meaningless. In the end were all going to die anyways. Its a fact of life, people need to learn to get over this.

Well, in your case it's true: your life is completely meaningless.

(See what I mean?)

 

[Kurdt]

Would be a lot less fun though. May as well be born a worker bee or ant.

 

[Cyrus]

Well, in your case it's true: your life is completely meaningless.

(See what I mean?)

I already know my life is meaningless. Even if I were Albert Einstein, my life would be meaningless. At the end of the day, we are going to all die in our planet and what your name is or what you did won't mean squat.

 

[zoobyshoe]

Would be a lot less fun though. May as well be born a worker bee or ant.

Most people don't want to be ants, but they do want a certain degree of structure overseen by authority, in part to protect them from others and in part to dole out approbation. This arises naturally from peoples relationships with their parents and siblings, I think, and is extended to schoolmates and teachers, then to employers and co-workers. Blanketing all of this, but usually much in the background, is their relationship to fellow citizens and government.

I think that when there's some kind of deep rooted problem in someone's life with any of these small scale structures it's common to wish for a universal meaning to solve it all.

 

[Evo]

If you have to be handed all the explanations, told that you're here as the result of some divine plan, then life really has no meaning, you're just a pawn.

I prefer to think each life starts as a blank slate and you make your own meaning. And maybe your life will never have any meaning, maybe you are that fly speck in the scheme of things, it's completely up to you. If people find that scary, that's really sad.

 

[Astronuc]

Meaning comes from within.

That's the key! Some people can't deal with this concept, hence the anxiety.

Or one can adopt Cyrus's view.

I already know my life is meaningless. . . . . At the end of the day, we are going to all die in our planet and what your name is or what you did won't mean squat.

Don't worry. Be Happy.

On the other hand, for those who fret about such things - the answer is
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Answer_to_Life,_the_Universe,_and_Everything

 

[Cyrus]

Eventually our sun will explode. There won't even be a planet left for aliens to come and see that we were even here. We will be blown up into stardust.

 

[Astronuc]

Eventually our sun will explode. There won't even be a planet left for aliens to come and see that we were even here. We will be blown up into stardust.

I try not to let that spoil my weekend.


Or the Vogons will obliterate the Earth to make way for a hyperspatial by-pass. It says so in the HitchHiker's Guide to the Galaxy, so it must be true.

Just in case, I have a reservation at Milliways.

 

[Pythagorean]

If you have to be handed all the explanations, told that you're here as the result of some divine plan, then life really has no meaning, you're just a pawn.

I think more realistically, you're a pawn if you're a tradesman. You're bidding is to the state and you hold no real power (compared to the politicians). It's about money. "Feed the plebs, win their hearts!"

I prefer to think each life starts as a blank slate and you make your own meaning. And maybe your life will never have any meaning, maybe you are that fly speck in the scheme of things, it's completely up to you. If people find that scary, that's really sad.

I agree with you that meaning comes from within, though. But I don't think it remains within. Ideas traverse space through light and sound. Other people adapt them, the become shared and glorified.

The Christian God is a very prominent idea (false as it may be) that has a lot of power and makes a lot of things happen still today.

When I get together with a group of friends and work on a project (that has been done before) we're deriving meaning from work and thoughts done long ago.

But yes, meaning is a human construct. This does not immediately make it false or worthless, though.

 

[BobG]

I think it's pretty simple: if the universe has meaning then each of our lives has meaning. The thought your life might be meaningless is, quite obviously, depressing. It's a basic psychological issue.

That was the key to those great Monster.com commercials.

When I grow up...

Personally, I want to grow up to have a brown nose. Growing up to be underappreciated would be nearly as good, though.

Or, as in the unreleased version of this commercial:
When I grow up ... I think I'll just buy a gun.

I have to admit, using terms nobody understands is pretty tempting, but convincing myself I'm not the same geek I was in high school is probably beyond my capabilities, even in my wildest dreams.

 

[zoobyshoe]

I already know my life is meaningless. Even if I were Albert Einstein, my life would be meaningless. At the end of the day, we are going to all die in our planet and what your name is or what you did won't mean squat.

"Meaning" is most often about people's present relationship with peers and authorities. Aparently insolvable problems in this arena are more likely to cause someone to feel their life is meaningless than anything else. Like I said before, that concern gets displaced onto finding some over-riding meaning in the universe to cancel out the importance of their real world problems and keep them going.

 

[zoobyshoe]

That was the key to those great Monster.com commercials.

When I grow up...

Personally, I want to grow up to have a brown nose. Growing up to be underappreciated would be nearly as good, though.

I have dial up so your link has no meaning.

 

[BobG]

I have dial up so your link has no meaning.

I have to admit, I find that kind of depressing.

 

[zoobyshoe]

I have to admit, I find that kind of depressing.

Cheer up. It could be part of a cosmic plan whose details will be revealed later.

 

[BobG]

I have dial up so your link has no meaning.

I have to admit, I find that kind of depressing.

I found the one thing that will cheer me up.

http://www.itc.virginia.edu/pubs/docs/RespComp/videos/when-I-go-to-UVA-sm.wmv

Better yet, you need wideband to view this.

As they say, those who laugh at the misfortune of others understand the meaning of life.

 

[zoobyshoe]

I found the one thing that will cheer me up.

http://www.itc.virginia.edu/pubs/docs/RespComp/videos/when-I-go-to-UVA-sm.wmv

Better yet, you need wideband to view this.

As they say, those who laugh at the misfortune of others understand the meaning of life.

Again: Dialup - no meaning.

 

[rewebster]

As they say, those who laugh at the misfortune of others understand the meaning of life.

Hmmm--I wonder if that's why I get a smile when I think of the last twenty years or so of Einstein's life.---hmmmm




---------------------------------------------------

I should explain that a little:


I just wondered how many times he came down from his office area with a bruised forehead from beating his head against the wall trying to get gravity into that equation so that it would all 'work'.

 

[Aether]

Eventually our sun will explode. There won't even be a planet left for aliens to come and see that we were even here. We will be blown up into stardust.

Our present sun is not going to explode and blow us all up into stardust...although our previous sun did do that already. What our present sun is going to do is to greatly expand until the Earth's orbit is enclosed within it. But then, the Andromeda galaxy is going to collide with the Milky Way galaxy...which is going to be cool.

 

[rewebster]

Our present sun is not going to explode and blow us all up into stardust...although our previous sun did do that already. What our present sun is going to do is to greatly expand until the Earth's orbit is enclosed within it.

can you guarantee me that 100%?

 

[Aether]

can you guarantee me that 100%?

100% money back guarantee for rewebster, you've got it.

 

[rewebster]

OK--GREAT!


I'll put a firecracker in a time capsule----won't THEY be surprised when it goes off!

 

[Evo]

Don't trust him rewebster, he has absolutely no intention of making good on that guarantee.