- #14,141
LabratSR
- 193
- 20
zapperzero said:
Getting close
http://info.ornl.gov/sites/publications/files/Pub37640.pdf
Last edited by a moderator:
zapperzero said:http://www.epri.com/abstracts/Pages/ProductAbstract.aspx?ProductId=000000000001025750
EDIT: I can't find this:
MELCOR Simulations of the Severe Accident at the Fukushima 1F2 Reactor
http://www.osti.gov/scitech/biblio/1064358
halp?
LabratSR said:Getting close
http://info.ornl.gov/sites/publications/files/Pub37640.pdf
Using the water injection estimate information by TEPCO, simulations [9,10] generally predict limited core degradation that is later quenched in-vessel. However, the amount of water that made its way to the core region remains a key uncertainty. Decreasing the water injection by half resulted in large-scale core relocation before the end of the simulation. If that simulation were extended, failure of the lower head and melt relocation would likely be predicted
zapperzero said:EDIT: I can't find this:
MELCOR Simulations of the Severe Accident at the Fukushima 1F2 Reactor
http://www.osti.gov/scitech/biblio/1064358
halp?
a.ua. said:nikkkom
It seems to me, the alpha decay generates more heat.
zapperzero said:I'm getting really really tired of this attitude of yours. A back-of-napkin calculation would show that the corium still needs cooling, especially if it is (as TEPCO assumes) mostly in one piece.
Think you can do better? Fine. Do the work, show the work and THEN call me and a.ua. and others here "fear-mongering idiots". Not before.
zapperzero said:http://www.epri.com/abstracts/Pages/ProductAbstract.aspx?ProductId=000000000001025750
EDIT: I can't find this:
MELCOR Simulations of the Severe Accident at the Fukushima 1F2 Reactor
http://www.osti.gov/scitech/biblio/1064358
halp?
zapperzero said:So what is your conclusion, nikkkom? Does the corium still need water cooling?
For fuel with intact geometry and well planned flow paths - yes.nikkkom said:Forced air cooling may be enough.
jlduh said:The video of the falling crane is here:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J_SA3G1X7F4&feature=player_embedded (around 1'33).
Everything is under control at Fukushima, it seems...
jlduh said:i have a hard time imagining how the "cooling" works with the injection of the water by Tepco. I mean, nobody knows where the fuel/corium is, but it's very probable that it has relocated outside of the reactor vessel or the containement vessel. It's maybe below the reactor somewhere on or in the basement, and maybe for reactor N°2 somewhere else, in the torus area...
To cool, you need to remove heat, and this is done by a flow of something, in this case of water. But the flow has to be to some degree, to be efficient, in contact with the hot fuel, debris and or corium. Then the question is: how do they manage to create a flow path to reach the hot stuff that is "somewhere" (they don't know where), and probably somewhere down, i mean in a low area which is probably "blind". How then a flow could be created in such an area?
The operator of the crippled Fukushima Daiichi nuclear plant says it has found rising tritium levels at a monitoring well near a wastewater storage tank.
One of the storage tanks leaked more than 300 tons of highly radioactive water in August. The water is likely to have seeped into the soil.
Tokyo Electric Power Company has since increased the number of monitors to check radioactive materials in groundwater near the tank.
The company says the level of radioactive tritium at one of the wells rose to 64,000 becquerels per liter on Tuesday, more than twice the reading the previous day.
The well is located 20 meters north of the leaking tank. Engineers checked soil taken when the well was dug and found beta radiation of 0.1 millisieverts an hour.
Beta rays are kind of radiation emitted from tritium and other substances.
The operator suspects the leak is spreading but says it doesn't know why as the well is not located near to the groundwater flows. It says most of the contaminated soil around the tank has been removed.
The company initially planned to pump up clean groundwater and release it into the ocean before it passes through heavily contaminated reactors buildings. The finding that the groundwater is already tainted before its reaches the buildings may hamper that plan.
if you count in this documentHowever, the 300000 tons of water in that giant tank farm currently contain far, far worse isotopes (say, Sr-90) in high concentrations.
TEPCO official: Leakage 'not under control'
A senior official from the Tokyo Electric Power Company has acknowledged that the radioactive water leakage at the crippled Fukushima Daiichi plant is not under control.
The government's top spokesman later said the assessment does not contradict Prime Minister Shinzo Abe's statement, delivered internationally, that the situation in Fukushima is under control.
TEPCO official Kazuhiko Yamashita was speaking at a hearing on Friday in Koriyama City, Fukushima Prefecture. The session was organized by the opposition Democratic Party, with officials from the government and TEPCO taking part.
Yamashita apologized for the radioactive water leaks, saying that what's happening now goes beyond TEPCO's assumptions.
A lawmaker asked if Yamashita agrees with Abe's statement made last Saturday at a general meeting of the International Olympic Committee in Buenos Aires.
Yamashita replied that he believes the current situation is not under control.
Chief Cabinet Secretary Yoshihide Suga later told a news conference that he heard Yamashita made the comment after being pressed several times for an answer.
Suga said government officials have confirmed with TEPCO that Yamashita was speaking in reference to independent incidents, including a leak of radioactive wastewater from a storage tank at the plant.
Suga said that even if such independent incidents take place, multi-layered steps will be taken to prevent the radioactive water from contaminating the ocean.
Suga said it is true that tainted water has leaked from a tank. But he said workers' patrols of storage tanks have been increased from once to 4 times per day, as part of all-out efforts to urgently deal with the problem.
Rive said:http://www.tepco.co.jp/en/nu/fukushima-np/handouts/2013/images/handouts_130913_01-e.pdf
What's most interesting:
- graph on page 24: the water flow direction might be even now reversed, it's flowing in from the ocean, at least at that point
- first graph on page 17
LabratSR said:Another update from TEPCO and yet again, absolutely nothing covered other than the water issues. Status of the clean-up of the units? Fuel removal from Unit 4 SFP? Removal of the Unit 1 cover? Location of the cores? And on and on.
zapperzero said:I have wasted a few minutes of my life to skim-read mr Barrett's creation. Fluff and handwavium.
Rive said:For first read, yes.
However I will go on for a second read - maybe there will be some hints.
zapperzero said:Ah yes. That's why he's advocating the dumping of contaminated water. Okay.
Rive said:But... ... we know about the Tritium concentration of that water, but what about Deuterium? I wonder, would it worth to process (and sell) it?
LabratSR said:Another update from TEPCO and yet again, absolutely nothing covered other than the water issues. Status of the clean-up of the units? Fuel removal from Unit 4 SFP? Removal of the Unit 1 cover? Location of the cores? And on and on.
Thanks for posting.