S&P Downgrades US To AA+, Outlook Negative

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In summary, the credit rating agencies downgraded the United States due to concerns over the effectiveness of American policymaking and political institutions. The downgrade is mostly due to a failure to cut spending, and the fear is that we'll inflate our way out of increasing government obligations. Mainstream republicans and democrats didn't want to cut spending enough, and the tea party was the only political faction that had a plan that would have avoided a downgrade. The senate investigation of the credit ratings agencies a few years back showed that they were accused of giving triple A ratings to packaged sub prime loans. It looks like it is pay back time.
  • #71
DevilsAvocado said:
I’m wondering... for how long are the (true) Republicans going to tolerate this destructive behavior from the tea sandpit?

The tea party is a misnomer in the sense that it is a party; instead, its a movement within the GOP base. In other words, the tea party is a part of the base of the republican party.
 
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  • #72
I think asian markets are going to be interesting to watch tonight.
 
  • #73
SixNein said:
The tea party is a misnomer in the sense that it is a party; instead, its a movement within the GOP base. In other words, the tea party is a part of the base of the republican party.

I find the (apparent) need to identify the TEA Party movement as part of the Republican Party to be counter-productive to the Left. I've talked to many independents and moderate Democrats (in OH and PA mostly, but NY, VA and MD as well) that consider themselves part of the TEA Party - ridiculing this group in 2012 will be a BIG mistake.
 
  • #74
WhoWee said:
I find the (apparent) need to identify the TEA Party movement as part of the Republican Party to be counter-productive to the Left. I've talked to many independents and moderate Democrats (in OH and PA mostly, but NY, VA and MD as well) that consider themselves part of the TEA Party - ridiculing this group in 2012 will be a BIG mistake.

The tea party is a part of the republican base.

http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=FreedomWorks
 
  • #75
Anyone else besides me doing substantial* ACH transfers into their investment accounts?

Warren Buffett said:
Occasional outbreaks of those two super-contagious diseases, fear and greed, will forever occur in the investment community. The timing of these epidemics is equally unpredictable, both as to duration and degree. Therefore we never try to anticipate the arrival or departure of either. We simply attempt to be fearful when others are greedy and to be greedy only when others are fearful.

*"substantial" of course being every last penny of cash I have in my bank account. Which amounts to little more than $200. Gads I hate being poor.

But I do love roller coaster rides. Yippie!
 
  • #77
OmCheeto said:
Anyone else besides me doing substantial* ACH transfers into their investment accounts?
I'm not moving my assets around because I don't need access to them right now. Actually, I hope the Fed has to raise the short-term lending rate soon, because I'm earning practically nothing on my liquid assets.
 
  • #78
russ_watters said:
That would only necessarily be true if imports and exports were the only components of the economy.

Its a basic accounting identity. Consider, GDP (Y) is C+I+G+NX. Your total GDP is consumption+investment+Governmentspending+net exports.

Now, also, Y = C+S+T (consumption+savings+taxes). Any dollar not consumed or taxed is saved.

Put them together, and you find

NX = (S-I)+(T-G).

If net exports is negative, then either I is bigger than S, or G is bigger than T. A trade deficit requires negative household balances or deficit government spending. If you have a macroeconomics book, crack it open to the section on twin deficits to read more.
 
  • #79
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mSPYC2NFYyY
Did she really say "He's got to come up with a new deal" at 1:31?
 
  • #80
Jimmy Snyder said:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mSPYC2NFYyY
Did she really say "He's got to come up with a new deal" at 1:31?

Yes. He and she repeated it later.

Thanks a lot for making me watch that.

I almost threw up.

Neil said:
...
You were ahead of the curve.
...
You said something that was very profound...
Michelle said:
...
You can't fool the markets.
...
The markets have said that this deal stinks.
...

I would like to remind people that I've been without cable for the last 18 months now, and this is actually the first time I've listened to [STRIKE]Sarah[/STRIKE] Michele Bachmann speak.

And thank you Jimmy for making me watch that. If she's our new leadership, I think I'll just cash out my whole portfolio and move to Waterworld.

Who the **** elects these kind of ******* morons?

moderator deletion precognitived...
 
  • #81
Jimmy Snyder said:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mSPYC2NFYyY
Did she really say "He's got to come up with a new deal" at 1:31?

At 3:25 she explains the comment.
 
  • #82
SixNein said:
The tea party is a part of the republican base.

http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=FreedomWorks

Here's my point - there are hundreds of "TEA Parties" across the country. They are local groups - many actually formed around kitchen tables.

Yes, I agree they came together at a few large events including the tax day rallies and the DC events. Also, I agree that Glen Beck motivated a great many people to form groups with his 9/12 Project.

However, I challenge you to name the leader.

Last, the new House Republicans along with Michelle Bachman have formed a group and taken the name TEA Party Caucus - and this causes some confusion. The members of the TEA Party Caucus happen to be Republicans but answer to their respective local groups (voters of both Parties and Independents in some cases) - not a national organization.
 
  • #83
OmCheeto said:
I almost threw up.

I would like to remind people that I've been without cable for the last 18 months now, and this is actually the first time I've listened to [STRIKE]Sarah[/STRIKE] Michele Bachmann speak.

And thank you Jimmy for making me watch that. If she's our new leadership, I think I'll just cash out my whole portfolio and move to Waterworld.

Who the **** elects these kind of ******* morons?

OmCheeto, you’re the last person I want to make any sicker, but at the same time I think it is good if as many people as possible understands what we’re dealing with here:

Michele Bachmann Says The Darndest Things

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e9bvreW08X0
MicheleBachmann2012.PNG



Did I hear someone (who seems to have lost it completely) mention "Breivik-inspired rhetoric"?? :bugeye:
 
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  • #84
DevilsAvocado said:
Did I hear someone (who seems to have lost it completely) mention "Breivik-inspired rhetoric"?? :bugeye:

It's nonsense like this comment that the Left has trouble competing on talk radio - IMO.
(I mean without a Government subsidy of course)
 
  • #85
WhoWee said:
It's nonsense like this comment that the Left has trouble competing on talk radio - IMO.

Agree, Michele Bachmann is pure nonsense, but IMHO the problem is she’s Running for President, and before even starting the campaign – she’s involved in a possible threat to the global economy.

Asia is opening in 1½ hr, let’s cross our fingers...

Anyhow, thanks a lot WhoWee for bringing up talk radio! Here comes the truth (@0:59) about "Breivik-inspired rhetoric" and extreme rightwing fanatics:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bscp0ou3o40
 
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  • #86
DevilsAvocado said:
Agree, Michele Bachmann is pure nonsense, but IMHO the problem is she’s Running for President, and before even starting the campaign – she’s involved in a possible threat to the global economy.

Asia is opening in 1½ hr, let’s cross our fingers...

Anyhow, thanks a lot WhoWee for bringing up talk radio! Here comes the truth (@0:59) about "Breivik-inspired rhetoric" and extreme rightwing fanatics:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bscp0ou3o40


I already offered to defend the TEA Party against Van Jones in the other thread maybe you should post this over there or in the Breivik thread and move on?

Btw - that was a REALLY lame attack on Beck - and a mis-characterization of the content (by YOU).
 
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  • #87
WhoWee said:
I already offered to defend the TEA Party against Van Jones in the other thread maybe you should post this over there or in the Breivik thread and move on?

I understand this is embarrassing for you and maybe for someone else in this thread (unless completely lost), however I did not bring this "topic" up, nevertheless it’s always nice to stick to the facts – don’t you think?

WhoWee said:
Btw - that was a REALLY lame attack on Beck - and a mis-characterization of the content (by YOU).

WhoWee, I do feel sorry for you, honestly. You probably only have good and sincere intentions in actually "saving the economy", but the people you protect (ad absurdum)... on the road to this goal, turns the whole thing into a 'joke'... I’m afraid...

I didn’t attack Glen Beck. I just provided the sound of the man accusing the poor teenage victims on the Utoya Island for being "Hitler Youths".

There’s no point in attacking a person who does "the job" himself, right?
 
  • #88
1 min left too market openings in Asia... will this just be a "silly whisper" or a "Great Depression Thunderstorm"...?
 
  • #89
DevilsAvocado said:
I understand this is embarrassing for you and maybe for someone else in this thread (unless completely lost), however I did not bring this "topic" up, nevertheless it’s always nice to stick to the facts – don’t you think?



WhoWee, I do feel sorry for you, honestly. You probably only have good and sincere intentions in actually "saving the economy", but the people you protect (ad absurdum)... on the road to this goal, turns the whole thing into a 'joke'... I’m afraid...

I didn’t attack Glen Beck. I just provided the sound of the man accusing the poor teenage victims on the Utoya Island for being "Hitler Youths".

There’s no point in attacking a person who does "the job" himself, right?

Actually, what you did was present a clip from an (apparently) low budget (perhaps) college radio show that played a very select and chopped Glen Beck clip. Worse yet, you did it in a thread regarding the "S&P Downgrades US To AA+, Outlook Negative" - is it because your primary intent is to be a troll?
 
  • #90
russ_watters said:
... The irony of Bush's bailout (TARP) is it shows up as spending on his balance sheet and income on Obama's. It's a trillion dollar misleading swing in their balance sheets!

I didn't like it, but it was ultimately completely painless...
Well yes TARP was ~painless to the government's balance sheet, but it remains to be seen if the bailouts contributed to even worse behaviour in the future via http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moral_hazard" (and perhaps that is what you meant).
 
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  • #91
WhoWee said:
Actually, what you did was present a clip from an (apparently) low budget (perhaps) college radio show that played a very select and chopped Glen Beck clip. Worse yet, you did it in a thread regarding the "S&P Downgrades US To AA+, Outlook Negative" - is it because your primary intent is to be a troll?

Don’t make it worse than it already is. Do you want me to post the CNN video on the same topic? And give you a chance accuse them for "select and chop" as well??

Please WhoWee, drop it. You’re making a fool of yourself (completely unnecessary IMHO).

Didn’t you tell me to move on??
 
  • #93
DevilsAvocado said:
Don’t make it worse than it already is. Do you want me to post the CNN video on the same topic? And give you a chance accuse them for "select and chop" as well??

Please WhoWee, drop it. You’re making a fool of yourself (completely unnecessary IMHO).

Didn’t you tell me to move on??

I requested you move it to an appropriate thread.
 
  • #94
  • #95
DevilsAvocado said:
Did I hear someone (who seems to have lost it completely) mention "Breivik-inspired rhetoric"?? :bugeye:

congrats, you've found your intellectual equal in Michele Bachmann.

also, you think this is what she thinks the markets are responding to?
uYzUL.jpg
 
  • #96
:zzz:
 
  • #97
It looks like this is going to be a 'battle' of trustworthiness between S&P and the U.S. government. Timothy Geithner has already started:

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Geithner-SampP-showed-apf-713857951.html?x=0&sec=topStories&pos=main&asset=&ccode="

What happens if the market, Moody's and Fitch completely ignores S&P, and not much happens?

John Chambers looking for a new employer...?
 
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  • #98
DevilsAvocado said:
It looks like this is going to be a 'battle' of trustworthiness between S&P and the U.S. government. Timothy Geithner has already started:

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Geithner-SampP-showed-apf-713857951.html?x=0&sec=topStories&pos=main&asset=&ccode="

What happens if the market, Moody's and Fitch completely ignores S&P, and not much happens?

John Chambers looking for a new employer...?

Chris Wallace asked David Beers directly about the $2Trillion difference in calculations.
http://foxnewsinsider.com/2011/08/07/highlights-fox-news-sunday-interviews-with-sps-david-beers-rep-paul-ryan-and-legg-masons-bill-miller/#more-73463

"Q: The White House isn’t happy – they say you made a $2 trillion overstatement and then changed your justification for the decision…

Beers: “[That's a] complete misrepresentation of what happened. When we made the modification, we did so after talking to the Treasury; it doesn’t change the fact that even with an agreement, that the underlining debt is building and is rising and will continue to rise.”"

Is it wise for the Administration to engage S&P in this manner?
 
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  • #99
WhoWee said:
Is it wise for the Administration to engage S&P in this manner?

I have no idea WhoWee, sorry.
 
  • #100
9:27pm edt

N225 -1.30%
NZ50 -2.24%
STI -2.42%
KS11 -1.46%
TWII -1.54%
 
  • #101
DevilsAvocado said:
It looks like this is going to be a 'battle' of trustworthiness between S&P and the U.S. government. Timothy Geithner has already started:

http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Geithner-SampP-showed-apf-713857951.html?x=0&sec=topStories&pos=main&asset=&ccode="

What happens if the market, Moody's and Fitch completely ignores S&P, and not much happens?

John Chambers looking for a new employer...?

The downgrade could backfire on S&P because it is political in nature. So they may run into a situation where they are not seen as relevant.
 
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  • #103
My teeth hurt as I watch the Left Wing and media attacks on the credibility of S&P - wasn't dumping the blame on the TEA Party a big enough solution for them?

The Left Wing and the media have moved past playing political games - now they are playing chicken with the credit rating agency - IMO.
 
  • #104
  • #105
WhoWee said:
The DJI is off about 3% - 350 points at 10:35 AM Easterm 8/8/11.

and the VIX touched 40!
 

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