Snog, Marry, Avoid: Male Makeover in UK Reality Show

[DaveC426913]

If you think about it. Those people are constanting being stare at, and made a joke to anyone standing next to them. It does take a lot of inner character to dress the way they do. They are very confident people.

Wellll...

that's what they would have you believe, yes.

A lot of people (dare I say most) who dress flamboyantly do so to hide their inner insecurities. The rationale is: I don't want you to stare at the real me, so I will put on a garish suit of armour. Now you are not staring at me, you're staring at my mask. I can live with that because I am in control of it.

 

[WaveJumper]

Wellll...

that's what they would have you believe, yes.

A lot of people (dare I say most) who dress flamboyantly do so to hide their inner insecurities. The rationale is: I don't want you to stare at the real me, so I will put on a garish suit of armour. Now you are not staring at me, you're staring at my mask. I can live with that because I am in control of it.

Makes a lot of sense.

 

[Tobias Funke]

If he truly likes dressing that way and arrived at that style because it suits him (and not because he saw this ), then I agree with you maverick. But all too often people dress in "shocking" ways to try to make a statement. But making a statement with actions or words takes effort, and doing it with clothes is easy, yet ineffective against all but the old and monocled.

It's like, "Hey, your fascination with what people are wearing is stupid. Clothes don't matter...now look at my wacky clothes! I'm original. Please tell me I'm original".

 

[maverick_starstrider]

If he truly likes dressing that way and arrived at that style because it suits him (and not because he saw this ), then I agree with you maverick. But all too often people dress in "shocking" ways to try to make a statement. But making a statement with actions or words takes effort, and doing it with clothes is easy, yet ineffective against all but the old and monocled.

It's like, "Hey, your fascination with what people are wearing is stupid. Clothes don't matter...now look at my wacky clothes! I'm original. Please tell me I'm original".

And people who dress without any flair aren't trying to make a statement? I've never understood why people value normalcy so much.

 

[George Jones]

people are strange

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=awi14wDTxNw

 

[maverick_starstrider]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=awi14wDTxNw

Ya, I know. that's the first thing I thought when I saw the thread title :). Jim Morrison, dressed pretty funky (for the 60's).

 

[Tobias Funke]

And people who dress without any flair aren't trying to make a statement?

Whether they are or aren't, part of my point is that if you have to rely on clothes to make your statements for you, then that says something about you. I know nothing about the guy in the video so I can't comment on him specifically, but if you think that everyone who dresses differently does so because it's their style then I'd have to disagree.

People, or at least me, aren't making fun of guy's clothes as much as the good possibility that he's only wearing them to be different.

For the record, I don't like "normal" dress either in most situations. My principal told me I need to dress "above the students" because my clothes consist of button down shirts with sleeves rolled up, slacks, and basketball sneakers. Apparently a tie and nice (ie uncomfortable) shoes will allow me to take my place above the lowly student peasants.

 

[maverick_starstrider]

Whether they are or aren't, part of my point is that if you have to rely on clothes to make your statements for you, then that says something about you. I know nothing about the guy in the video so I can't comment on him specifically, but if you think that everyone who dresses differently does so because it's their style then I'd have to disagree.

People, or at least me, aren't making fun of guy's clothes as much as the good possibility that he's only wearing them to be different.

For the record, I don't like "normal" dress either in most situations. My principal told me I need to dress "above the students" because my clothes consist of button down shirts with sleeves rolled up, slacks, and basketball sneakers. Apparently a tie and nice (ie uncomfortable) shoes will allow me to take my place above the lowly student peasants.

Yes but is the desire to be different (even in an, ironically, normal and predictable way) a negative trait worthy of ridicule? It is human nature to try and clamp down on those who seek to deviate and a lot of people think this kind of flippant ostricizing of the abnormal, whether it be wild fashions, unusual habits, "nerdiness", independent thinking, etc. is innocent. However, I tend to see it as anything but innocent. The status quo depends on non-boat rockers but CHANGE depends on deviation. So if, anything, IMHO one could lambast this guy for a LAME attempt at deviation, not the desire to deviate. Failed independent thinking is far more virtuous then no attempt at all. Whether it is motivated by insecurity is entirely irrelevant. The desire to conform is equally driven by insecurity, and any "great" person who has had a profound effect on the world was driven by insecurity of one form of the other; selfish chip on your shoulder, desire to show up others, revenge, etc. That stuffs is the fuel of a different future.

 

[Tobias Funke]

Yes but is the desire to be different (even in an, ironically, normal and predictable way) a negative trait worthy of ridicule?

When I was 12 or 13, I watched a skate video and a skater was talking about all their different styles. One was the hippie, one was the grunge skater, one was the guy with his hair styled like horns, etc. So I decided that my style would be to wear mismatched socks when skating. I quickly realized that this was silly not because it was different, but because it was a conscious attempt to be different in a meaningless way.

But anyway, I don't want to make a whole big thing out of this because I mostly agree with you. I do think it's stupid to ridicule people for dressing differently, but I also think that most people who dress that way never got past their superficial mismatched sock phase. I mean, there's independent thinking, and then there's bathing in fake tan spray. Neither deserves ridicule, but I think there's a difference.

 

[maverick_starstrider]

When I was 12 or 13, I watched a skate video and a skater was talking about all their different styles. One was the hippie, one was the grunge skater, one was the guy with his hair styled like horns, etc. So I decided that my style would be to wear mismatched socks when skating. I quickly realized that this was silly not because it was different, but because it was a conscious attempt to be different in a meaningless way.

But anyway, I don't want to make a whole big thing out of this because I mostly agree with you. I do think it's stupid to ridicule people for dressing differently, but I also think that most people who dress that way never got past their superficial mismatched sock phase. I mean, there's independent thinking, and then there's bathing in fake tan spray. Neither deserves ridicule, but I think there's a difference.

I'll agree to agree to that.

 

[Proton Soup]

Ultimately, to me, this smells of just another attempt of the old to trivialize the young. A useless endeavour at best. (a disasterous one at the worst)

eh? that guy loved being the center of attention. in fact, it's not the first time I've seen him.

 

[Cyrus]

There are noteworthy people who set the fashion of the time, those who oppose it, those who don't give a damn and those who just fall in line. Which one are you?

What a cliche rant against "the establishment". It sounds like a really bad advertisement.It's like people who buy apple computers to be "different" and not follow the crowd, when in reality they are all the same and follow each other "not following main stream".

 

[maverick_starstrider]

See the derision of Proton Soup and Cyrus is exactly my point. It is clearly originating from the thought that you think they think they're better than you. So you clamp down on it and ridicule it (How dare they with there stupid clothes, freaks!). To me this attitude is justs loosely veiled philistinism and only a hop skip and a jump away from the sort of "get the queer" mob mentality you still see kicking around. Or the idiotic notion that someone has a "problem" with their gender identity (it's you who has the problem, not them).

 

[Cyrus]

Hey, it's a free society: you can dress however you like. But I can also label him as looking like a damn fool (which he does look like).

There is a time and a place to dress like that. Every day in public is not one.

 

[maverick_starstrider]

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*waves lighter in the air*. Rock on little orange, pink hot pants dude.

Hey, it's a free society: you can dress however you like. But I can also label him as looking like a damn fool (which he does look like).

There is a time and a place to dress like that. Every day in public is not one.

What would be your prescribed dress code for daily wear herr fuhrer?

 

[Proton Soup]

See the derision of Proton Soup and Cyrus is exactly my point. It is clearly originating from the thought that you think they think they're better than you. So you clamp down on it and ridicule it (How dare they with there stupid clothes, freaks!). To me this attitude is justs loosely veiled philistinism and only a hop skip and a jump away from the sort of "get the queer" mob mentality you still see kicking around. Or the idiotic notion that someone has a "problem" with their gender identity (it's you who has the problem, not them).

lol, it is true that i do find some amusement here. so what? it seems to make him happy and it's no skin off my nose. maybe he can even make a career out of it. good for him.

however, i do not think they think they're better than me. nor do i understand what makes you think that. I've never been one to "get the queer", either. if anything, i was more on the other side growing up as an underweight "band fag" who didn't get into team sports and studied way too much.

i think you're just humourless. the guy's fashion sense is gawdy, even for a gay man, but that is part of his schtick, i think.

 

[Cyrus]

What would be your prescribed dress code for daily wear herr fuhrer?

http://germanmilitariacollectibles.com/blog/uploaded_images/img128-735172.jpg

 

[DaveC426913]

There is a time and a place to dress like that. Every day in public is not one.

Why?

 

[Cyrus]

Why?

You want to play again Dave?

There is something called social norms. But, he does look like a fool in his white booty shorts and pink shoes with bright makeup. You can snog him if you like though. I won't tell.

 

[Evo]

Why?

Because someone might choke to death laughing while trying to swallow their food? I can imagine him walking into a restaurant...

 

[Ivan Seeking]

Why?

Because he looks like a freak?

[didn't my dad say that about long hair?]

 

[maverick_starstrider]

I can't imagine how an intelligent person could use a term like freak with any seriousness. This is a physics board for christ's-sake. I don't know if you were informed but the general public has some pretty negative stereotypes about you. Awfully nice of you to play along though.

 

[Cyrus]

I can't imagine how an intelligent person could use a term like freak with any seriousness. This is a physics board for christ's-sake. I don't know if you were informed but the general public has some pretty negative stereotypes about you. Awfully nice of you to play along though.

Life is full of surprises. Welcome to the real world. You're so open minded your let your brain fall out in the process.

In the meanwhile, I'll say what I think: he looks like a fool. He might be a nice kid, but he looks like an idiot.

 

[maverick_starstrider]

Life is full of surprises. Welcome to the real world. You're so open minded your let your brain fall out in the process.

In the meanwhile, I'll say what I think: he looks like a fool. He might be a nice kid, but he looks like an idiot.

Yes but I'd like to hear your justification of this as anything other then asinine prejudice.

 

[Evo]

I can't imagine how an intelligent person could use a term like freak with any seriousness. This is a physics board for christ's-sake. I don't know if you were informed but the general public has some pretty negative stereotypes about you. Awfully nice of you to play along though.

It depends on your use of the word freak. Ivan and I are roughly the same age. When I was in my teens, we called ourselves freaks. It meant we were non-conformists. It meant we didn't fit into normal society, "outside of socially acceptable norms' would be a good definition. We did not expect to be accepted. As I am sure that this kid does not expect to be accepted as normal. Some people want to shock people. They want to be considered "freaks".

 

[Cyrus]

Hey, why'd you delete my comment? It was going somewhere and I was going to make a point with it

 

[maverick_starstrider]

It depends on your use of the word freak. Ivan and I are roughly the same age. When I was in my teens, we called ourselves freaks. It meant we were non-conformists. It meant we didn't fit into normal society, "outside of socially acceptable norms' would be a good definition. We did not expect to be accepted. As I am sure that this kid does not expect to be accepted as normal. Some people want to shock people. They want to be considered "freaks".

And now you're old and insipid? Is that your point?

 

[Cyrus]

Yes but I'd like to hear your justification of this as anything other then asinine prejudice.

When you go around town wearing what he wears, I'll give your argument the time of day. Otherwise, you're nothing more than a hypocrite pandering to peoples feelings.

 

[DaveC426913]

In the meanwhile, I'll say what I think: he looks like a fool. He might be a nice kid, but he looks like an idiot.

To one person (and counting). What is wrong with him looking like a freak to one person (and counting)?

Clearly, the impression he is sending does not escape him, so what exactly is the problem with him doing it every day in public? Who makes this call?

 

[Cyrus]

To one person (and counting). What is wrong with him looking like a freak to one person (and counting)?

Clearly, the impression he is sending does not escape him, so what exactly is the problem with him doing it every day in public? Who makes this call?

I said he looks stupid. I base this on my stylistic taste. Again, he's free to look stupid in public every day if he wants to. That's his choice. That doesn't mean I won't think he looks stupid though.

BTW: I think you'd look great in white booty shorts and eye makeup Dave. Post pictures. Don't be shy, you're ok with it so you should have no problems doing this.

 

[TheStatutoryApe]

See the derision of Proton Soup and Cyrus is exactly my point. It is clearly originating from the thought that you think they think they're better than you. So you clamp down on it and ridicule it (How dare they with there stupid clothes, freaks!). To me this attitude is justs loosely veiled philistinism and only a hop skip and a jump away from the sort of "get the queer" mob mentality you still see kicking around. Or the idiotic notion that someone has a "problem" with their gender identity (it's you who has the problem, not them).

Aside from here I also am a member of two alternative subculture sites. I used to dress like a weirdo and have hung out with people who still do. Most of us that have gotten older have started dressing 'normally' or in a toned down fashion. The owner of one of the sites I mentioned you can still see out at industrial clubs, usually dressed in plain military surplus gear, but you may also possibly see her on CSPAN on occasion in a dress suit addressing congressional committees. When we see people like that guy and his counterparts in other subcultural styles we smirk and shake our heads at how silly we used to be.

 

[Evo]

And now you're old and insipid? Is that your point?

Explain how you come to that conclusion from what I said. I'm serious, POST your explanation before you post again. My point is that the term was quite common in the late 60's and early seventies and I'm sure you have no idea that the term has a different meaning to someone that lived through that era.

 

[Evo]

To one person (and counting). What is wrong with him looking like a freak to one person (and counting)?

Clearly, the impression he is sending does not escape him, so what exactly is the problem with him doing it every day in public? Who makes this call?

A lot of restaurants and nightculbs would not let him in because he violates their dress code, that would be people that can make that call.

 

[Cyrus]

Dave should take me to an $800 restaurant dressed like the kid in the video and pay for the meal. Then I'll agree with him.

 

[Pythagorean]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=awi14wDTxNw

sorry, couldn't resist...