Understanding the divide white/black/blue

[gjonesy]

In the past week there has been 2 home invasions, 3 shootings (2 fatal), and a strong arm robbery. In a county of around 50,000 people. That's just what is in the local media. If you ad in the counties surrounding mine the crime rate quadruples this is comparable to any major city per capita in the state.
I can only imagine in larger cities it's got to be worse.

 

[Astronuc]

Sports
Iowa Defensive Lineman says he was searched by police with guns drawn while playing Pokémon
https://www.yahoo.com/sports/news/i...ns-drawn-while-playing-pokemon-200837670.html

Faith Ekakitie thanked the Iowa City Police Department for its professionalism regarding the search. Ekakitie said he had his headphones in and didn’t hear police officers, who then approached him with their guns drawn.

Ekakitie writes "I am thankful to be alive, and I do now realize, that it very well could have been me, a friend of mine, my brother, your cousin, your nephew etc. Misunderstandings happen all the time and just like that things can go south very quickly. It is extremely sad that our society has brainwashed us all to the point where we can’t feel safe being approached by the police officers in our respective communities. Not all police officers are out to get you, but at the same time, not all people who fit a criminal profile are criminals."

 

[gjonesy]

Not all police officers are out to get you, but at the same time, not all people who fit a criminal profile are criminals."

One large slice of the problem right there.

Thank you for posting.

 

[gjonesy]

According to this :
Top 5 facts HERE->http://bit.ly/29xn4Tf

Out of 400 police shootings per year 61% are white males 32% are black males 6% are others.

Black males are contacted on average more then white male suspects yet 244 white males die compared to 128 black males. If this doesn't prove the media is biased I do not know what does.

Do police make mistakes? Absolutely, are some of these shootings racially motivated? It's plausible, but an entire profession is being persecuted over very few isolated incidents.

It's truly mind boggling.

 

[jim hardy]

but an entire profession is being persecuted over very few isolated incidents.

somebody is stirring things up on purpose, and i don't know why.

 

[gjonesy]

somebody is stirring things up on purpose, and i don't know why.

The "why" question is almost as difficult to answer as it is to find a solution to the problem itself.

I think the answer is between misconceptions and perceptions perpetuated by people giving "their version" of how these things play out. And a stereo type placed on police. We have heard comedians make jokes about it, we have seen it portrayed on TV shows and movies, and we have heard rappers rap about it for years. That coupled with a few bad incidents where police were not fair and did act inappropriately you have a long standing false perception of police in general.

 

[Bystander]

somebody is stirring things up on purpose, and i don't know why.

Yes, you do.

 

[Cruz Martinez]

According to this :
Top 5 facts HERE->http://bit.ly/29xn4Tf

Out of 400 police shootings per year 61% are white males 32% are black males 6% are others.

Black males are contacted on average more then white male suspects yet 244 white males die compared to 128 black males. If this doesn't prove the media is biased I do not know what does.

Do police make mistakes? Absolutely, are some of these shootings racially motivated? It's plausible, but an entire profession is being persecuted over very few isolated incidents.

It's truly mind boggling.

Dont you have to factor in the fact that the black population is a minority in the US compared to the white population?

 

[gjonesy]

Dont you have to factor in the fact that the black population is a minority in the US compared to the white population?

Why? When you have police making contact more often with black males then white males? It seems to me that even with less interaction with police white suspects are still twice as likely to be killed as black males. According to wiki the "minority population" as of 2012 50.4% of the children under the age of one were minorities. The FBI statistics are across the board so population wouldn't even be a factor.

So if police are making contact more often with black suspects then white suspects regardless of population size, why do we NOT see more black males being killed then white males?

It should be the other way around, concidering the interaction ratio. . White suspects being killed by police is vastly under reported by the media. And when it is reported I am sure race is never a factor in that coverage.

 

[Cruz Martinez]

Why? When you have police making contact more often with black males then white males? It seems to me that even with less interaction with police white suspects are still twice as likely to be killed as black males. According to wiki the "minority population" as of 2012 50.4% of the children under the age of one were minorities. The FBI statistics are across the board so population wouldn't even be a factor.

Surely you can't group all minorities together and then be like wait, the minorities are half of the population, black people are not a minority!
Also what i meant with factor in the population ratio is precisely what you mention here. It seems strange to me that black males are more often targetted as suspects than white males.

So if police are making contact more often with black suspects then white suspects regardless of population size, why do we NOT see more black males being killed then white males?

Indeed this is a question which needs to be answered. Another thing I would ask regarding this is the following: Are there a lot of reported cases of white males being shot by police under strange circumstances? Are there reported cases of white males being killed by black police officers under strange circumstances?

It should be the other way around, concidering the interaction ratio. . White suspects being killed by police is vastly under reported by the media. And when it is reported I am sure race is never a factor in that coverage.

I don't want to sound cliche, but the fact that race is almost never an issue for white people is a good thing for them, I guess.

 

[gjonesy]

I don't want to sound cliche, but the fact that race is almost never an issue for white people is a good thing for them, I guess.

That's not really a good thing, in fact that is one of the problems. White guy gets shot by police doesn't scream racial inequality. There isn't a movement dedicated to watch dogging caucasians shot by police. With black people you have many. It really doesn't matter weather the person is a genuine threat to the officer or the public usually what is pointed at most often is if he was armed or not.

There was a case I seem to remember about a naked college student, he was white and unarmed when he was shot by a black police officer. The only reason it was even on the news I think is because the parents sued the department involved.

Also what i meant with factor in the population ratio is precisely what you mention here. It seems strange to me that black males are more often targetted as suspects than white males.

And there is that buzz word "targeted" it is no surprise that police interact more with black suspects then white, high crime areas are usually heavily populated by black people. That's not a race thing that is just a fact. Usually police are present and active in these areas because concerned black citizens called them there.

It's really ironic that this happens, police get called to these areas and attempt to help the community then end up the bad guys for "hassling" people. I grew up in a mixed poor neighborhood with high crime and was stopped and hassled by police, simply because I was in the wrong place at the wrong time. People can't expect police to know who is who in these areas. When they come there (usually at the request of a resident) you have to expect them to do their job which is policing.

 

[gjonesy]

Surely you can't group all minorities together and then be like wait, the minorities are half of the population, black people are not a minority!

No what I am suggesting or rather Wikipedia is suggesting is that within our generation racial diversity in the united States is going to reach equilibrium. And the fact that there are more white people to shoot isn't the reason we see more white people shot since black people are more often stopped and confronted by police.

Personally I see these numbers as proof of the opposite. There are just as many white criminals as there are black, and because black people are more often confronted by police they know how NOT to react.

 

[Greg Bernhardt]

I live 1/2 mile from where the Milwaukee riot was a couple days ago and run meals nearby every week. Everyone is focused on the shooting and the riot instead of the underlying issues. I would highly recommend reading "https://www.amazon.com/dp/1595586431/?tag=pfamazon01-20"

 

[mheslep]

Everyone is focused on the shooting and the riot instead of the underlying issues.

Maybe locally. My impression of national media the coverage is generally the other way around.

NY Times Headline next day:
Racial Violence in Milwaukee Was Decades in the Making, Residents Say

Milwaukee is one of the United States’ most segregated cities
...
prosecutors declined last year to charge a former Milwaukee police officer in the fatal shooting of an unarmed black man
...
White officers, he said,
...
While court-ordered and voluntary desegregation programs had helped to usher in school integration ...

and a civil rights picture from the 1960s is included in the article. The man who was shot by police, Smith, while brandishing a hand gun per police is not mentioned.

 

[gjonesy]

I live 1/2 mile from where the Milwaukee riot was a couple days ago and run meals nearby every week. Everyone is focused on the shooting and the riot instead of the underlying issues. I would highly recommend reading "https://www.amazon.com/dp/1595586431/?tag=pfamazon01-20"

I think that is part of the overall plan. The media is highly biased. It seems like the worst of the worst is the only thing that the media wants to focus in on. I actually heard a few "rumors" a few months after Ferguson. It was a nation wide military exercise called Jade helm 2. There was a "simulation" conducted at the largest fuel depot on the east coast located in Greensboro NC. It included national guard ems special forces and civilian counter parts (swat , sort, emco) and the rumor was that these exercises were Incase there were a threat to national security here in the US.

Has anyone stopped to think the riots, insurrections, and civil unrest over these one-sided stories might be what they were training for?

 

[gjonesy]

I wonder when something really big is going to jump off. In my brief time here on Earth the biggest incident I can recall is the LA riot. But it seems like these things are becoming common now. The last 5 years i have heard more about racism in this country then i have heard in the first 40. And it makes absolutely no sense. People growing up in the early 20th century during the height of the civil rights movement put up with "real state sponsored racism" the more I read about what's going on in different states, the more it seems like the whole thing is "manufactured". The DOJ just dropped the largest which hunt trial of this decade against Alamance Co sheriff Terry Johnson. The law suit was initially launched as a probe for racial profiling (after a few bogus complaints) within the sheriff department. Mostly do to a federally funded (ice unit) at that department. And after several years of investigation they found no evidence of any wrong doing.

http://myfox8.com/2016/08/17/u-s-de...gainst-alamance-county-sheriff-terry-johnson/

 

[mheslep]

Milwaukee County Sheriff David Clarke on riots in Milwaukee that took place after a policeman killed an armed black man on August 13.

...
That [police shootings] is not what causes riots anyway. What causes riots are failed liberal urban policies in these ghettos like Milwaukee. Milwaukee has inescapable poverty. We are like the sixth poorest city in America. They have failing public schools. The K-12 public school system here – there is only two school systems that are worse, Cleveland and Detroit. You have massive black unemployment, I think the black unemployment rate in Milwaukee is 32 percent. You have dysfunctional families. You have father absent homes. You have questionable lifestyle choices. Those are the ingredients for a riot. Then a police shooting comes along and just acts as an igniter to an already volatile situation. Now look, between Friday night and Saturday, four people were murdered in nine separate shootings and these same creeps—you didn’t hear a peep from them, but all of a sudden a law enforcement officer fearing for his life reasonably is confronted by an armed individual and these people exploit these things. These cop haters want to come out and riot. This is just a situation, an opportunity for people to steal to loot and to rabblerouse...
”

Sheriff Clarke has a solidly different explanation for the underlying reasons for the riot than the tired, its-all-about-race, specious narrative given in Michelle Alexander's "The New Jim Crow", if the reviews of Alexander's book are at all accurate.

 

[OmCheeto]

...
Sheriff Clarke has a solidly different explanation for the underlying reasons for the riot than the tired, its-all-about-race, specious narrative given in Michelle Alexander's "The New Jim Crow", if the reviews of Alexander's book are at all accurate.

Interesting interview.
Though, I wouldn't throw out Alexander's point.
This is a VERY complicated situation.

Some numbers I researched on August 8th, wondering about gjonesy's post:

Out of 400 police shootings per year 61% are white males 32% are black males 6% are others.

[ref: unemployment rates]
[ref: household incomes]It's been my experience, that young men, get into trouble, when they don't have a job.
It's also been my experience, that poor people commit more crimes.

ps. Being white, and having lived in a nearly all white city my whole life, I've always been curious about this black vs white thing.
From 3rd through 12th grade, I had a total of 2 black students in my classes.

I'm sure I've mentioned before, that when I joined the navy, the black people struck me as way less dangerous/crazy than the white folk.
It somewhat corked my cookie, as being somewhat older the Jonesy, and a 10 year old racist, because of watching 60's era TV: "Why are black people burning and fighting? Why are black people so mean and stupid, mommy?"

 

[mheslep]

Though, I wouldn't throw out Alexander's point.

Then expect more cities that fail minorities like Milwaukee, run continuously by Democrats and even the occasional self-identified socialist. for the last hundred years.

 

[OmCheeto]

Then expect more cities that fail minorities like Milwaukee, run continuously by Democrats and even the occasional self-identified socialist. for the last hundred years.

Non sequitur, from my point of view.

 

[mheslep]

Non sequitur, from my point of view.

Only if cause and effect of current policies are a non-sequitur. Alexander supplies one particular cause and effect analysis, a rehash of the-man-is-keeping-us-down.

 

[gjonesy]

I'm sure I've mentioned before, that when I joined the navy, the black people struck me as way less dangerous/crazy than the white folk.
It somewhat corked my cookie, as being somewhat older the Jonesy, and a 10 year old racist, because of watching 60's era TV: "Why are black people burning and fighting? Why are black people so mean and stupid, mommy?"

Not sure I quite understand this statement. But just to clarify the riot I was speaking of was the 92 Rodney king riot. There were actually attacks in my home town of Burlington NC sparked by the Rodney King incident. And although there have been other riots in my lifetime small ones in my state, few in Greensboro NC out of the few I can recall only one I can remember was racially motivated, it was a (Klan shooting) in Greensboro back in 75 I believe.

As far as poverty being a motive for crime or white people being more volitile. That in and of itself speaks to the character of an individual not a trait or skin color. I grew up poor, and I stole a piece of 5 cent bubble gum from the neighborhood convenience store. My dad found out and gave me a well deserved whooping. Then made me work, actually mow the yard, clean the house and wash his car, gave me 5 cent and drove me to the store made me pay the owner and apologize. The owner was so impressed he tried to give me a bag of candy for my honesty. My father wouldn't allow me to accept it. I learn really quickly that stealing was not for me.

I personally think it's parenting or more to the point lack of parenting that allows these characteristics to form and become a way of life for some people.