What percentage of Americans believe in ghosts?

[zoobyshoe]

Gosh, that makes me...ONLY 32! Yaaaaaaaaaay!

Hehehe. My wishful thinking error is even more strongly motivated than yours.

 

[Ivan Seeking]

This would work:

Originally Posted by Wikipedia
A ghost is defined as the apparition of a deceased person, frequently similar in appearance to that person, and usually encountered in places she or he frequented, or in association with the person's former belongings. The word "ghost" may also refer to the spirit or soul of a deceased person, or to any spirit or demon.[1][2]

Okay, so you don't believe in spirits, souls, or demons.

Ghosts are often associated with hauntings, which is, according to the Parapsychological Association, "the more or less regular occurrence of paranormal phenomena associated with a particular locality (especially a building) and usually attributed to the activities of a discarnate entity; the phenomena may include apparitions, poltergeist disturbances, cold drafts, sounds of footsteps and voices, and various odours."

Do you believe in sounds, cold drafts, footsteps, voices, or odors? Do you require that any apparition be a spirit, and if so, how do you justify that? Also, do you often refer to the Parapsychological Association and wiki for your information?

Seriously?
You could ask that question about anything.
How do you know Santa doesn't exist? (There are millions of people claiming so, and the main part of them also claim they have actually seen him.)

Children are taught to believe in Santa and they often do see him as far as they're concerned. However I am not aware of one adult who believes in Santa. Do you understand the difference?

What one should ask is: what are the scientific evidence for the existence of ghosts?
Answer: None.

What sort of evidence do you want? We have audio and video evidence of strange occurrences. We have people running all over the country with scientific equipment and seemingly getting strange results. Granted, I have no idea how trustworthy any particular evidence may be, but it does exist, and there is plenty of it. So your statement is false; that is, unless you demand evidence for spirits, but that is your personal choice. And even then, it does exist.

 

[EL]

Okay, so you don't believe in spirits, souls, or demons.

Of course I do not believe in those things.

Do you believe in sounds, cold drafts, footsteps, voices, or odors?

Yes. These phenomena are not ghosts. They can just be associated with ghosts (by those who believe in them.)

Do you require that any apparition be a spirit, and if so, how do you justify that?

Why would I require any of those things to be a spirit? (Or do I get you wrong?)

Also, do you often refer to the Parapsychological Association and wiki for your information?

I sometimes refer to wiki (or really parts of texts on wiki) when I have read the text I'm citing through and agree with what it is saying. It is often much faster than writing the text myself. You asked me for a definiton, and I think what I cited from wiki fits the general publics defintion of a ghost pretty well. I am simply not very interested who wrote the text I cited, since I agree with it.

Children are taught to believe in Santa and they often do see him as far as they're concerned. However I am not aware of one adult who believes in Santa. Do you understand the difference?

My point is that many people claiming that something is true, doesn't make it true.

What sort of evidence do you want? We have audio and video evidence of strange occurrences. We have people running all over the country with scientific equipment and seemingly getting strange results. Granted, I have no idea how trustworthy any particular evidence may be, but it does exist, and there is plenty of it. So your statement is false; that is, unless you demand evidence for spirits, but that is your personal choice. And even then, it does exist.

Wait a minute. There is claimed "evidence" for all sorts of things: Chi, Homeopathy, Bigfoot, Creationism, Astrologi, Martians, Healing, etc. The "evidence" in all this cases are of the very peculiar kind that they somehow disappear the closer you look at them.
I'm not saying people haven't "heard footsteps", "smelled odors", etc, I'm just saying those phenomena are not due to ghosts.
Are you serioulsy claiming there are scientific evidence for ghosts?
Simply stated: An "observation" is not an "evidence".

 

[zoobyshoe]

Ivan, have you seen this video:

?

 

[Chi Meson]

I want to state for the record that I believe in odors.

 

[rewebster]

I can't remember-----are ghost particles part of MWI?----and I have heard that strings are involved with many illusions

 

[zoobyshoe]

I want to state for the record that I believe in odors.

A lot of people in their thirties believe in the existence of odors.

 

[Huckleberry]

My point is that many people claiming that something is true, doesn't make it true.

That's a reasonable statement. Many people claiming something is true makes it much more likely that others will believe it also, even if they believed it to be false. Consider how people with varying beliefs might interpret that statement and how effectual your point is.

In the experiment, social psychologist Solomon Asch showed groups of college students a line, and then asked each student to identify which of several other lines matched it in length. (The answer was obvious.) Only one student, however, was the "subject." The others were "confederates," in league with Asch. In many of the trials, all these students insisted that a shorter or longer line was the correct match.

http://www.americanexperiment.org/publications/1998/19980408kersten.php

 

[waht]

Just recently in the news, some famous haunted place got debunked in Albuquerque.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20071030/ap_on_fe_st/odd_courthouse_ghost


People resort to common explanation such as "ghosts" and what not to explain a phenomenon that is peculiar with respect to everyday experiences.

 

[zoobyshoe]

Just recently in the news, some famous haunted place got debunked in Albuquerque.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20071030/ap_on_fe_st/odd_courthouse_ghost


People resort to common explanation such as "ghosts" and what not to explain a phenomenon that is peculiar with respect to everyday experiences.

It took that guy a bit of time and effort to set up his experiments. Most wouldn't bother.

 

[Chi Meson]

""To my mind, it's a case of where people typically say something is unexplained and all that means is they haven't worked hard enough to look for an explanation. They've given up," he said.
...
This case was solved through logic, scientific analysis and methodology," he said.

Of course.

 

[Jimmy Snyder]

Photographic evidence:

You'll believe in a lot more than that before APOD is done with you.

 

[BobG]

When it comes to finding natural explanations for "supernatural" experiences I like the following story about Richard Feynman from feynman online:

The Supernatural Clock

Once we were talking about the supernatural and the following anecdote involving his first wife Arline came up. Arline had tuberculosis and was confined to a hospital while Feynman was at Los Alamos. Next to her bed was an old clock. Arline told Feynman that the clock was a symbol of the time that they had together and that he should always remember that. Always look at the clock to remember the time we have together, she said. The day that Arline died in the hospital, Feynman was given a note from the nurse that indicated the time of death. Feynman noted that the clock had stopped at exactly that time. It was as the clock, which had been a symbol of their time together, had stopped at the moment of her death. Did you make a connection? I asked NO! NOT FOR A SECOND! I immediately began to think how this could have happened. And I realized that the clock was old and was always breaking. That the clock probably stopped some time before and the nurse coming into the room to record the time of death would have looked at the clock and jotted down the time from that. I never made any supernatural connection, not even for a second. I just wanted to figure out how it happened.

Problem is, I don't believe him. Or, at least he's splitting hairs on the duration of time he made a supernatural connection - maybe it was only for about 1.5015 milliseconds, or one cycle of his thought processes.

I remember a kayak class I took where the instructor was giving me 'roll practice'. He'd stand behind my kayak in a swimming pool, flip me upside down, and start shaking the kayak violently. The idea was to just sit tight and remain calm for a few seconds before trying to roll back right side up.

Next day, the last set of rapids we ran was practically a waterfall followed by a series of standing waves. I flipped in the hole at the bottom of the waterfall and the first few explanations that went through my mind for what my kayak was doing were definitely connected to the supernatural. Snake-like sea monster has grabbed my kayak and is trying to shake it to pieces? No, those don't exist, so it has to be a crocodile? No, not in these waters. It has to be an evil female water spirit that's trying to drown me! There's just absolutely no way I'm going to believe I've been shrunk and teleported into a Maytag washing machine, so it has to be the evil spirit of the river! The whole time I'm reaching 'upward' with my paddle getting set to roll and wondering if I'm even reaching in the right direction (I still don't know - my paddle never reached the surface, so I had to bail).

Afterward, I'm remarking that the 'practice' was nothing like the real thing, then realized, "Wait, yeah it was. It was exactly like a person standing behind my kayak and shaking it violently." It's just that the day before, I knew who was grabbing my kayak. In the river upside down, it just seemed inconceivable that there could be any logical reason for what was happening, even having been specifically prepared for it the day before.

I also remember swimming in the Gulf near Hurlburt Air Force Base and seeing a sea turtle. My first impression definitely wasn't sea turtle. It looked like a sea monster out of a horror movie.

There's a lot of things that happen where your first impression is formed by normal human fear and imagination. I don't think there's very many people whose first reaction is cold logic.

And, most importantly, I can post again (I thought I'd been banned ). I went to renew and realized I also needed to update my e-mail. If you change your e-mail address, evidently you can't do anything but read posts until you follow the link in the confirmation e-mail (which I was very slow to get around to reading).

Edit: Added story I was commenting on. (geez, zooby, how could you forget that story already when I only read it about 45 minutes ago?)

 

[zoobyshoe]

That link to the Feynman site just takes me to the main page. What's the specific story you're commenting on?

 

[Math Is Hard]

Ghost To Ghost is on tonight and I can't wait.
I don't care if people here think I'm silly. I love hearing Art Bell and spooky stories on Halloween night.

 

[EL]

That link to the Feynman site just takes me to the main page.

It's under "Anecdotes" then "Al Seckel" then "The Supernatural clock".

 

[zoobyshoe]

It's under "Anecdotes" then "Al Seckel" then "The Supernatural clock".

Thanks. It's weird: the first time I opened the thread to read BobG's post the internal quote from the story didn't show up on my screen. I've since gone offline and come back on and now it shows up.

 

[zoobyshoe]

Problem is, I don't believe him. Or, at least he's splitting hairs on the duration of time he made a supernatural connection - maybe it was only for about 1.5015 milliseconds, or one cycle of his thought processes.

In Feynman's case the emotional set up was quite different. He had been preparing himself for her death for a long time, and I expect had already talked himself into reacting with an analytical state of mind whenever he thought about it. If you remember from his books he accommodated her passing in stride and didn't grieve about it till several months later, when, passing a dress shop, he thought to himself "Arlene would like that dress." Then he realized she was gone and he broke down crying.

In general he seems to have reacted to all stories of the unusual with an analytical approach.

Edit: I see BobG is messing with my head regarding the quote.

 

[Bombini]

Ghosts

I believe in ghosts. Here in Norway there are so many ghost-stories from family to family. That they are almost hard to not believe in

 

[EL]

I believe in ghosts. Here in Norway there are so many ghost-stories from family to family. That they are almost hard to not believe in

Hey, you are Scandinavian and hence supposed to be rational! But I forgive you since you're only 15 (and Norwegian).

 

[zoobyshoe]

I believe in ghosts. Here in Norway there are so many ghost-stories from family to family. That they are almost hard to not believe in

You'd be shunned if you didn't believe. To stay in social harmony, you believe.

 

[LightbulbSun]

Does anyone think the reason why humans are apt to believe in ghosts is because of our shortcomings in night vision? For example, when all the lights are off in my house late at night and I head to the bathroom I see this red light flashing. At first, I didn't know what the source of it was and I was asking myself if I was having some sort of hallucination. Then when I took the time to focus in on the source I realized it was just the smoke detector light. I'm starting to get the sense that our vulnerability in the dark has a lot to do with our disposition towards believing in ghosts.

 

[Chi Meson]

Problem is, I don't believe him.

Don't you understand that you are REQUIRED to believe everything Feynman says about himself?
:)

 

[out of whack]

To stay in social harmony, you believe.

No, no, you make believe that you believe. That keeps you in social harmony but also within the realm of reason. Plus, you can then fake the occational act of bravery in situations others find spooky. "Of course, I believe in ghosts. But I can take them!"

 

[Bombini]

Hehe

Hey, you are Scandinavian and hence supposed to be rational! But I forgive you since you're only 15 (and Norwegian).

Well, since i don't believe in god. i need something else to believe in. I also believe in destiny.
And just the fact that I'm 15 doesn't mean that I'll believe in anything that doesn't make sense. But it's not actually just the ghosts i believe in, i believe that your body stays behind as some kind of energy

 

[rewebster]

Well, since i don't believe in god. i need something else to believe in. I also believe in destiny.
And just the fact that I'm 15 doesn't mean that I'll believe in anything that doesn't make sense. But it's not actually just the ghosts i believe in, i believe that your body stays behind as some kind of energy

if you believe in Einstein----then this forum is...









HAUNTED

 

[zoobyshoe]

But it's not actually just the ghosts i believe in, i believe that your body stays behind as some kind of energy

Why would your body stay behind as some kind of energy when it clearly already "stays behind" as some kind of matter? A dead body is not a mystery.

 

[Bombini]

Well...

Well, i believe in ghosts and you guys believe in Santa Claus. You don't hear me criticizing you Its just healthy to believe in something. I don't care if people don't believe i the same things i do

 

[Bombini]

And Einstein had theories about flying through wormholes to other dimensions. It's just as possible as ghosts xD

 

[zoobyshoe]

Well, i believe in ghosts and you guys believe in Santa Claus.

No one here believes in Santa Claus.

Its just healthy to believe in something.

Why? Is that a common saying in your country?

 

[EL]

Well, i believe in ghosts and you guys believe in Santa Claus.

What? Is that the misinterpretation of the year or what!

Its just healthy to believe in something.

Trust me, it's not. I don't believe in anything, and I'm perfectly healthy!

 

[Chi Meson]

I believe in being healthy.

That and odors, of course.

 

[Evo]

No one here believes in Santa Claus.

Not now.

What next, no Easter Bunny?

 

[Math Jeans]

Trust me, it's not. I don't believe in anything, and I'm perfectly healthy!

Well...you believe that you are healthy! You also believe in the laws of physics and that you are a member of PF.

For this not to be true, then this world would have to be a dream to you, you are actually lying in a hospital bed asleep and in bad condition, not an owner of a computer, and living in a world where there is a completely new set of physical laws.

Generally, if you don't believe in anything, you are medically brain dead.

 

[turbo]

Not now.

What next, no Easter Bunny?

No, and no Red Rum, either! Get a grip or you'll shoot your eye out!