Breaking Down the 2016 POTUS Race Contenders & Issues

[Tobias Funke]

Perhaps you can explain to me how post office sorters foster political correctness.

I'd like to know too, since very rarely do those complaining about PC gone wild have any true, non-exaggerated examples that justify their sweeping statements.

 

[Dotini]

I'd like to know too, since very rarely do those complaining about PC gone wild have any true, non-exaggerated examples that justify their sweeping statements.

Would trigger warnings do it for you?

 

[jim hardy]

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/politically correct
Simple Definition of politically correct

• : agreeing with the idea that people should be careful to not use language or behave in a way that could offend a particular group of people
  

Same government that funded a crucifix in a bottle of pee as art
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Piss_Christ

Piss Christ is a 1987 photograph by the American artist and photographer Andres Serrano. It depicts a small plastic crucifix submerged in a glass of the artist's urine. The piece was a winner of the Southeastern Center for Contemporary Art's "Awards in the Visual Arts" competition,[1] which was sponsored in part by the National Endowment for the Arts, a United States Government agency that offers support and funding for artistic projects, without controlling content.

arrests a guy who wants to deface a koran ?
http://www.nydailynews.com/news/nat...pastor-terry-jones-arrested-article-1.1453195

Koran-burning Florida Pastor Terry Jones arrested in latest attempt at sacrilege
... Cops said they cuffed Jones and his associate pastor, Marvin Sapp, around 5 p.m., as the men were about to start the blaze. Each faces a felony charge of unlawful conveyance of fuel. Jones

You don't have to look very far.

http://thetruthwins.com/archives/20...-political-correctness-is-taking-over-america
The following are 20 outrageous examples that show how political correctness is taking over America…

#1 According to a new Army manual, U.S. soldiers will now be instructed to avoid “any criticism of pedophilia” and to avoid criticizing “anything related to Islam”. The following is from a recent Judicial Watch article…

The draft leaked to the newspaper offers a list of “taboo conversation topics” that soldiers should avoid, including “making derogatory comments about the Taliban,” “advocating women’s rights,” “any criticism of pedophilia,” “directing any criticism towards Afghans,” “mentioning homosexuality and homosexual conduct” or “anything related to Islam.”

#2 The Obama administration has banned all U.S. government agencies from producing any training materials that link Islam with terrorism. In fact, the FBI has gone back and purged references to Islam and terrorism from hundreds of old documents.

#3 Authorities are cracking down on public expressions of the Christian faith all over the nation, and yet atheists in New York City are allowed to put up an extremely offensive billboard in Time Square this holiday season that shows a picture of Jesus on the cross underneath a picture of Santa with the following tagline: “http://www.theblaze.com/stories/atheists-post-anti-christmas-billboard-in-times-square-featuring-jesus-being-crucified-drop-the-myth/ ”

#4 According to the Equal Employment Opportunity Commission, it is illegal for employers to discriminate against criminals because it has a “disproportionate” impact on minorities.

#5 Down in California, Governor Jerry Brown has signed a bill that will allow large numbers of illegal immigrants to legally get California driver’s licenses.

#6 Should an illegal immigrant be able to get a law license and practice law in the United States? That is exactly what the State Bar of California argued earlier this year…

An illegal immigrant applying for a law license in California should be allowed to receive it, the State Bar of California argues in a filing to the state Supreme Court.

Sergio Garcia, 35, of Chico, Calif., has met the rules for admission, including passing the bar exam and the moral character review, and his lack of legal status in the United States should not automatically disqualify him, the Committee of Bar Examiners said Monday.

#7 More than 75 percent of the babies born in Detroit are born to unmarried women, yet it is considered to be “politically correct” to suggest that there is anything wrong with that.

#8 The University of Minnesota – Duluth (UMD) initiated an aggressive advertising campaign earlier this year that included online videos, billboards, and lectures that sought to raise awareness about “white privilege“.

#9 At one high school down in California, five students were sent home from school for wearing shirts that displayed the American flag on the Mexican holiday of Cinco de Mayo.

#10 Chris Matthews of MSNBC http://newsbusters.org/blogs/rusty-weiss/2012/08/30/chris-matthews-and-msnbc-now-claim-word-chicago-racist#ixzz252qumTv7 that it is “racist” for conservatives to use the word “Chicago”.

#11 A judge down in North Carolina has ruled that it is unconstitutional for North Carolina to offer license plates that say “Choose Life” on them.

#12 The number of gay characters on television is at an http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/10/05/entertainment-us-glaad-idUSBRE8940FA20121005. Meanwhile, there are barely any strongly Christian characters to be found anywhere on television or in the movies, and if they do happen to show up they are almost always portrayed in a very negative light.

#13 House Speaker John Boehner recently stripped key committee positions from four “rebellious” conservatives in the U.S. House of Representatives. It is believed that this “purge” happened in order to send a message that members of the party better fall in line and support Boehner in his negotiations with Barack Obama.

#14 There is already a huge push to have a woman elected president in 2016. It doesn’t appear that it even matters which woman is elected. There just seems to be a feeling that “it is time” for a woman to be elected even if she doesn’t happen to be the best candidate.

#15 Volunteer chaplains for the Charlotte-Mecklenburg Police Department http://radio.foxnews.com/toddstarnes/top-stories/police-chaplains-told-to-stop-invoking-jesus.html from using the name of Jesus on government property.

#16 Chaplains in the U.S. military are being forced to perform gay marriages, even if it goes against their personal religious beliefs. The few chaplains that have refused to follow orders know that it means the end of their careers.

#17 All over the country, the term “manhole” is being replaced with the terms “utility hole” or “maintenance hole”.

#18 In San Francisco, authorities have installed small plastic “privacy screens” on library computers so that perverts can continue to exercise their “right” to watch pornography at the library without children being exposed to it.

#19 You will never guess what is going on at one college up http://radio.foxnews.com/toddstarnes/top-stories/college-allows-transgender-man-to-expose-himself-to-young-girls.html…

A Washington college said their non-discrimination policy prevents them from stopping a transgender man from exposing himself to young girls inside a women’s locker room, according to a group of concerned parents.

#20 All over America, liberal commentators are now suggesting that football has become “too violent” and “too dangerous” and that it needs to be substantially toned down. In fact, one liberal columnist for the Boston Globe is even proposing that football should be banned for anyone under the age of 14.

I maintain Johnson's point is PC's loudest adherents really aren't fit even to sort mail or stack library books . Let alone dictate public discourse.

What do you guys think he was saying ?

 

[Hornbein]

What do you guys think he was saying ?

It seems to me like Paul Johnson's crackpot personal theory. I'm used to seeing stuff like this on the Internet, but not published in a formerly reputable magazine.

 

[russ_watters]

I'd like to know too, since very rarely do those complaining about PC gone wild have any true, non-exaggerated examples that justify their sweeping statements.

We may need to split this to a separate thread. There are two incidents active in the news right now that I wanted to point out:
-West Point Cadets making a black power salute.
-White high school girls forming the N-word on t-shirts.

Generally what has been happening lately (see also the half dozen campus incidents this spring) is someone commits a small pc offense and has their life destroyed over it. With one critical caveat: pc enforcement only applies to certain less favored groups/ideologies.

 

[jim hardy]

It seems to me like Paul Johnson's crackpot personal theory.

Argument from incredulity,
fair enough.

We may need to split this to a separate thread.

Not on my account. I've had my say.

 

[Tobias Funke]

Would trigger warnings do it for you?

No. I don't see anything so outrageous about telling others that something might bother them. Everyone is still free to read or watch the material. It's certainly not an example of what Johnson calls "one of the most dangerous intellectual afflictions ever to attack mankind."

You don't have to look very far.

Some (most?) of those are questionable to say the least.

We may need to split this to a separate thread. There are two incidents active in the news right now that I wanted to point out:
-West Point Cadets making a black power salute.
-White high school girls forming the N-word on t-shirts.

Generally what has been happening lately (see also the half dozen campus incidents this spring) is someone commits a small pc offense and has their life destroyed over it. With one critical caveat: pc enforcement only applies to certain less favored groups/ideologies.

I'm not familiar with those two incidents so I can't really comment on them. I don't immediately see how they're related though. Certainly there are questionable decisions being made in the name of (misunderstood) political correctness, and it is terrible when someone is dogpiled at best and doxxed or even killed at worst for saying something judged to be out of line. I just don't think there's a reason to attribute that behavior to PC. Plenty of people had and still have their lives severely impacted for, say, suggesting that video games may have some misogynistic elements, or reporting corruption and abuse carried out by favored groups. Those people aren't from "less favored groups" as you would define them I'm sure.

I'm not debating the existence of isolated cases, but once again I was referring to sweeping statements like Johnson's "one of the most dangerous intellectual afflictions ever to attack mankind" that has resulted in a loss of Americans' ability to think. That's simply wrong.

 

[Evo]

Let's get back to the topic or this thread will be closed.

 

[Astronuc]

Or split the PC discussion to another thread.Meanwhile - T. Boone Pickens supports Trump and his plan to ban unvetted Muslim immigrants
http://finance.yahoo.com/news/boone-pickens-supporting-donald-trump-183315760.html

 

[Ivan Seeking]

Finally we are getting down to core issues.

Mrs. Clinton has vowed that barring any threats to national security, she would open up government files on the subject [of UFOs], a shift from President Obama, who typically dismisses the topic as a joke. Her position has elated U.F.O. enthusiasts, who have declared Mrs. Clinton the first “E.T. candidate.”

...“I think we may have been” visited already, she said in the interview. “We don’t know for sure.”

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/05/11/us/politics/hillary-clinton-aliens.html?_r=0

It does beg the question, which are we more likely to see; proof of aliens, or Donald Trump's tax returns?

 

[jim hardy]

thread needed a little levity. eh ? good one..

 

[Dotini]

Finally we are getting down to core issues. http://www.nytimes.com/2016/05/11/us/politics/hillary-clinton-aliens.html?_r=0

It does beg the question, which are we more likely to see; proof of aliens, or Donald Trump's tax returns?

From the NYT article cited:
“It shouldn’t be a source of embarrassment to discuss it,” said Christopher Mellon, a former intelligence official at the Defense Department and the Senate Intelligence Committee. “We should be humble in terms of recognizing the extreme limits of our own understanding of physics and the universe.”

 

[WWGD]

And now Trump will be hlding a fundraiser : http://www.nytimes.com/2016/05/10/us/politics/donald-trump-campaign.html?_r=0 . And he still does not show his tax returns. So much for those who claim that he tells it like is; blunt but honest.

 

[jim hardy]

A search of that article returns neither "hiding" nor "hide" nor "fundraiser"

where's the beef ?

 

[Ivan Seeking]

From the NYT article cited:
“It shouldn’t be a source of embarrassment to discuss it,” said Christopher Mellon, a former intelligence official at the Defense Department and the Senate Intelligence Committee. “We should be humble in terms of recognizing the extreme limits of our own understanding of physics and the universe.”

Well, with Trump's attitude about aliens, I'm surprised he hasn't hit her on this yet. Is DT pro ET?

 

[Dotini]

Well, with Trump's attitude about aliens, I'm surprised he hasn't hit her on this yet. Is DT pro ET?

Sadly, Trump is said to be neither a thinker nor a reader. It may be Hillary has left herself open to yet one more mockery from The Donald.

 

[Ivan Seeking]

Sadly, Trump is said to be neither a thinker nor a reader. It may be Hillary has left herself open to yet one more mockery from The Donald.

One would assume that she has made the calculation that she has more to gain than to lose. However...

Roughly 21% of Americans believe aliens crashed at Roswell. But a “sanity gap” emerges when you take into account party affiliation: 27% of Mitt Romney voters believe in the UFO coverup, versus 16% of voters who backed President Obama in 2012.

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/nat...blicans-conspiracy-theories-article-1.1306229

I thought she may hope to gain some ground with the younger vote by going public with this, but that doesn't seem to be significant either. I don't see a huge age gap in the beliefs here.
http://www.thearda.com/quickstats/qs_61_p.asp

Wouldn't it be funny if Trump agreed with her on this!

 

[Dotini]

One would assume that she has made the calculation that she has more to gain than to lose. However...

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/nat...blicans-conspiracy-theories-article-1.1306229

I thought she may hope to gain some ground with the younger vote by going public with this, but that doesn't seem to be significant either. I don't see a huge age gap in the beliefs here.
http://www.thearda.com/quickstats/qs_61_p.asp

Wouldn't it be funny if Trump agreed with her on this!

According to those stats, young, left-leaning, non-worshipping and highly educated folks might seem inclined to believe in ET. But who knows where they are? Trump knows what Americans are worried about here and now, and is skillfully and opportunistically taking advantage of this. If there is political advantage to be had in taking any position at all on ET, it would indeed be funny - in a weird sort of way. It might serve to loosen up - to make liquid and inchoate - people's hold on reality. In an environment where anything is seen as possible, perhaps people will vote unexpectedly and emotionally for a perceived messiah?

 

[Astronuc]

Trump, Ryan, pledge to work together; endorsement may come
https://www.yahoo.com/news/trump-ryan-prepare-meet-republicans-call-unity-072436796--election.html

Despite differences, apparently they plant to work together to unify the conservative base.

 

[Evo]

Love the Donald's new look, his face is as orange as his hair. It's in the news, it's in Astros' link above!

 

[WWGD]

A search of that article returns neither "hiding" nor "hide" nor "fundraiser"

where's the beef ?

Sorry, that was supposed to be _holding_ a fundraiser. From the link:

"Mr. Trump, who by the end of March had spent around $40 million of his fortune on the primaries, has said that he may need as much as $1.5 billion for the fall campaign, but that he will seek to raise it from donors rather than continue to self-finance"

Trump repeatedly decried the corrupting influence of donor money on politics. And his tax returns, which he promised to show at the ed of January are still nowhere to be found. And please don't tell me Hillary is worse, because I don't support Hillary.

 

[WWGD]

Love the Donald's new look, his face is as orange as his hair. It's in the news, it's in Astros' link above!

And Tropicana is also endorsing him.

 

[mheslep]

...And his tax returns, which he promised to show at the ed of January are still nowhere to be found..

Where does the statement of "january" release appear? I see after the "audit"

 

[Astronuc]

And Tropicana is also endorsing him.

and Orange Julius and the carrot producers of America.

Maybe his official drink with be the original Tang (orange).Bob Gates on how Trump stands out from past presidents
http://www.cbsnews.com/news/bob-gates-donald-trump-national-security-past-presidents/

Trump, though, has a go-it-alone mentality that could be harmful if he's elected president, Gates said.

"I guess one of the things that makes it challenging for me is that he seems to think that he has all the answers and that he doesn't need advice from staff or anybody else," he said.

Gates outlined his concerns with Trump's positions on national security issues, as well as his temperament.

"Well, I have some real issues with things he's said about national security policy and some concerns--I think there are some contradictions," he said.

Meanwhile - Financial analyst, Charles Ortel, alleges major holes in Clinton Foundation records
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/201...ajor-holes-in-clinton-foundation-records.html

Charles Ortel, who gained recognition for correctly identifying problems with General Electric's financial statements in 2008, has prepared 40 reports highlighting discrepancies that he said proves the Clinton Foundation has covered up cash flow since 1997.

 

[bballwaterboy]

If more details come out about the finances of the Clinton Foundation, what do you guys think is the worst that could happen?

Are we talking about anything criminal here or just embarrassing to the Clintons?

I've been hearing about this topic online quite a bit, but wonder just how potentially damaging any leaks could be?

 

[phinds]

If more details come out about the finances of the Clinton Foundation, what do you guys think is the worst that could happen?

Are we talking about anything criminal here or just embarrassing to the Clintons?

I've been hearing about this topic online quite a bit, but wonder just how potentially damaging any leaks could be?

Speculation seems pointless since one can imagine unlikely scenarios ranging from total innocence to clear cut criminal guilt. I mean, make up any desired result and you can construct a possible scenario that would result in that outcome.

 

[WWGD]

Where does the statement of "january" release appear? I see after the "audit"

Sorry, could not find the link from last time. Still, he was asked to release them in February and has refused so far.
http://www.factcheck.org/2016/05/trumps-tax-returns/

And the IRS has said there is no reason to wait for the audit t o be over. And even then, he could release those from any of the 10 previous years.

 

[mheslep]

Sorry, could not find the link from last time. Still, he was asked to release them in February and has refused so far.
http://www.factcheck.org/2016/05/trumps-tax-returns/

And the IRS has said there is no reason to wait for the audit t o be over. And even then, he could release those from any of the 10 previous years.

Yes Trump has been asked by the press to produce his tax returns repeatedly.

 

[Astronuc]

I like the comments by Gov. John Hickenlooper.
https://www.yahoo.com/katiecouric/john-hickenlooper-running-beer-business-202626077.html

 

[jim hardy]

I honestly hope tomorrow stays peaceful.

https://www.facebook.com/events/122901818125485
¡Alerta! There is an enemy at our doorstep. Donald Trump is planning to hold a rally at the San Diego Convention Center on Friday afternoon, May 27, 2016. Unión del Barrio San Diego issues this call to all anti-racists in San Diego and progressives in general, and to the Mexican community in particular, to stand united and oppose this anti-Arab, anti-Black, anti-Mexican, anti-Woman, power-hungry, neo-fascist oligarch who has every intention of taking for himself the highest political office within the current borders of the United States.

Trump and his trumpista followers are anti-Mexican to their core. This man started his presidential campaign attacking our community, and at every one of his rallies he escalates and expands his message of racist and misogynistic aggression. He has created a political climate in this country that threatens the safety of our communities, and we have no other choice other than to push back against trumpismo! We are planning an organized action in defense of our communities beginning at 1:00 pm at Chicano Park! All of us 100% united against Trump! On May 27th we look forward to struggle alongside compas and allies to defend our communities…

http://www.kpbs.org/news/2016/may/25/san-diego-police-prepare-for-fridays-trump-rally/
Police Chief Shelley Zimmerman said on Wednesday that law enforcement will tolerate no violence, disruptive behavior or unlawful acts when presumptive Republican presidential nominee Donald Trump holds a campaign rally at the San Diego Convention Center on Friday.

That FB post omits the fine print disclaimer buried in Union de Barrio's call on their website

http://uniondelbarrio.org/main/?page_id=2018
Compas, Allies, and anti-trumpistas –

Unión del Barrio in San Diego has put out a call for people to assemble at 1:00 PM in Chicano Park on Friday May 27, 2016. We have been organizing to defend barrios across Southern California for 35 years. The event that will take place this Friday is also a call to defend our community from the aggressively racist and violent rhetoric that has been pouring out of Donald Trump for months.

Ours is a defensive position, and as such our activity on Friday, May 27th will not tolerate any form of physical aggression, not from outside nor from within our activity. We expect the participation of families with children, older people, and fearless undocumented raza at our activity, and their safety and well-being is our priority.

This is a warning to aggressive trumpistas – stay away from us. We have nothing to say to you, nor are we interested in what you have to say. You are a supporter of Trump, and that is all we need to know about you.

This is also a warning to individuals that seek to physically disrupt or are looking to get into an altercation of some sort in order to express your anger about Trump. We understand your frustration, but you will need to express your anger elsewhere, outside of our planned activity. Any person seeking to provoke a physical altercation will be identified as a provocateur and will be asked to leave this organized event.

That being said, we welcome all anti-racists in San Diego, progressives in general, and the Mexican community in particular, to stand united and oppose this anti-Arab, anti-Black, anti-Mexican, anti-Woman, power-hungry, neo-fascist oligarch who has every intention of taking for himself the highest political office within the current borders of the United States.

¡Nos Vemos Pronto! – Friday, May 27th, 1:00 PM, Chicano Park

 

[Astronuc]

‘There is no drought,’ Trump declares in California

FRESNO, Calif. (AP) — Presumptive Republican presidential nominee Donald Trump told California voters Friday that he can solve their water crisis, declaring, ‘‘There is no drought.’’

California is, in fact, in midst of a drought. Last year capped the state’s driest four-year period in its history, with record low rainfall and snow.

http://www.bostonglobe.com/news/nat...-california/NFdjQgFwOs0FFeogiZq7mM/story.html



Starbuck's CEO on the 2016 presidential campaign
http://finance.yahoo.com/video/starbucks-ceo-weighs-2016-race-200031082.html

 

[Derek Francis]

Some predictions.

• No one from either party will make an independent run.
  
• Bernie won't win and if he can't do a landslide victory in California, he should quit.
• Since the convention is 3 weeks after California, Bernie has ample time to concede and compromise.
• I do think Bernie would give Hillary a strong endorsement, provided that the DNC treats him respectfully.
  
• Trump will unify the Republican Party for the most part.
• Exception to some of the older retired establishment (Romney, Bush), and people who want to run in 2020 (Ryan, Rubio) if Trump loses.

Here is my prediction map

Hillary just has to defend most of her light-blue states to win, whereas Trump needs to win most of the battleground states. It favors Hillary, but a Trump victory is possible. Her advantage with women, blacks and hispanics is key. The white male voter isn't as large of a base as it used to be. Romney in 2012 carried 62% of white voters yet still lost. Hillary should win the election unless Trump miraculously improves his favorability among minorities or if Hillary suffers a huge gaffe or scandal.

 

[Hornbein]

Some predictions.

• Bernie won't win and if he can't do a landslide victory in California, he should quit.

He will stay in the race. Then speeches about his view of the issues will be broadcast nationally from the convention. He can have a favored candidate make the speech and get millions of dollars worth of national exposure.

 

[mheslep]

Some predictions...

Total voter turnout in Michigan primaries:
Republican: 1.25 million
Democratic: 1.27 million

Clinton lost hers, Trump won.
If Michigan goes Trump, with the rest unchanged, it's over.

 

[StatGuy2000]

Some predictions.

• No one from either party will make an independent run.
  
• Bernie won't win and if he can't do a landslide victory in California, he should quit.
• Since the convention is 3 weeks after California, Bernie has ample time to concede and compromise.
• I do think Bernie would give Hillary a strong endorsement, provided that the DNC treats him respectfully.
  
• Trump will unify the Republican Party for the most part.
• Exception to some of the older retired establishment (Romney, Bush), and people who want to run in 2020 (Ryan, Rubio) if Trump loses.

Here is my prediction map

Hillary just has to defend most of her light-blue states to win, whereas Trump needs to win most of the battleground states. It favors Hillary, but a Trump victory is possible. Her advantage with women, blacks and hispanics is key. The white male voter isn't as large of a base as it used to be. Romney in 2012 carried 62% of white voters yet still lost. Hillary should win the election unless Trump miraculously improves his favorability among minorities or if Hillary suffers a huge gaffe or scandal.

From what I've gathered thus far, Trump has polarized opinion within the Republican party, so I'm curious to see on what basis you feel that he will unify the Republican party. Are you making your assumption on who he chooses as his running mate (so far still unannounced)?