Free time while pursuing my undergraduate degree

[WWGD]

Bycicling back and forth for 15 minutes is certainly a good idea; fresh air, exercise, and doable year-long in the local climate. Still I worry somewhat about isolation. Give local, university clubs, groups, a chance. Or try local meetups of your liking.

 

[PeterDonis]

I figured I would be able to compare myself to others that went through a similar college degree as I would like to pursue.

One common thread I think you will find is that college will be harder than you think, even after you take into account that college will be harder than you think. Being at the top of your high school class is no guarantee of being able to make it through college easily, or at all while juggling other commitments like a job and a van conversion, particularly if you are shooting for a degree in a field like engineering.

 

[whatamievendoing]

Please consider this story as relevant to your plan:
- working 20 hrs is too much
- no time to study / no time to play
- college gets tougher each year/people hit brick walls in their junior year
- don't skip courses you can do easily they will help your GPA
- don't work if you don't have to / it might give you 10 hours per week free time

I could actually even apply some of the points you made in my high school coursework as well. I know that there are some classes that essentially are free DE 100s for a 6.0 weighted GPA, such as fundamentals of leadership, as well as sociology. Both of these can be taken at home, and would allow me to continue to take AP courses. As for the brick wall thing, I will be taking AP physics, Honors precalculus, as well as doubling up on engineering classes so I will be able to only take one engineering course my senior year. I will probably struggle a little bit to juggle all of the different workloads, however I do feel that this would be beneficial to me to properly put college workloads into perspective.

 

[whatamievendoing]

Bycicling back and forth for 15 minutes is certainly a good idea; fresh air, exercise, and doable year-long in the local climate. Still I worry somewhat about isolation. Give local, university clubs, groups, a chance. Or try local meetups of your liking.

Of course! I am sure some of my other friends will get into Clemson as well, so I won’t be starting completely from scratch. I would definitely do marching band after I finish my van build, strengthening current relationships as well as forming new connections.

 

[WWGD]

Of course! I am sure some of my other friends will get into Clemson as well, so I won’t be starting completely from scratch. I would definitely do marching band after I finish my van build, strengthening current relationships as well as forming new connections.

Good, try to preview, imagine an average week, consider potential issues and address them beforehand. How will you feed yourself, do laundry?
PS: I'm trying to help. Please let me know if I'm getting too much in your business.

 

[whatamievendoing]

Good, try to preview, imagine an average week, consider potential issues and address them beforehand. How will you feed yourself, do laundry?

There are laundromats nearby, but I will also install a 40 gallon freshwater tank that I could use for cleaning if need be. I could probably put myself on the meal plan, but I am also really fond of cooking. Most college food is pretty bad, but I was invited to an engineering camp on campus a while back, and it isn’t the worst. There are a good few mom and pop restaurants around where I will be staying as well, which usually have good food for cheap. I would install 800w solar panels that could allow me to install an induction cooktop, as well as a sizable fridge and freezer. I would most likely get a part time job after my second year to supply myself with a bit of money to sustain myself.

 

[gleem]

While it seems doable I share a concern with WWGD about your self-proclaimed introversion. Your plan just reinforces that behavior. You should be trying to overcome it, especially in this day when networking is so vital for one's professional satisfaction and success. Living with others will greatly help. Also to quote you, " I do not think money would be a huge issue, as I could always take out a loan, so really my only issue would be with time." and if time is the issue then your ADHD is problematic. As with all new experiences, there are unintended consequences that might impact your educational plans. Engineering is a good profession. Go with your strength, your academic prowess, try for scholarships, even a small one since you are niggling about $5K/year. After you graduate and get your dream job I expect you will say "What was I thinking". I know I have said that about a decision I made in grad school even though I thought I had only one choice. I also find it hard to believe your parents think this is a good idea.

 

[whatamievendoing]

PS: I'm trying to help. Please let me know if I'm getting too much in your business.

Not at all! I feel it is appropriate to ask these questions years in advance rather than on a need to know basis.

 

[jedishrfu]

I could actually even apply some of the points you made in my high school coursework as well. I know that there are some classes that essentially are free DE 100s for a 6.0 weighted GPA, such as fundamentals of leadership, as well as sociology. Both of these can be taken at home, and would allow me to continue to take AP courses. As for the brick wall thing, I will be taking AP physics, Honors precalculus, as well as doubling up on engineering classes so I will be able to only take one engineering course my senior year. I will probably struggle a little bit to juggle all of the different workloads, however I do feel that this would be beneficial to me to properly put college workloads into perspective.

You're missing my point. The brick wall is due to the level of difficulty of junior year courses where they expect you to understand these math courses fully:

- Calculus Differential(I), Integral(II) and Multiple Variable(III) courses
- Linear Algebra
- Differential Equations
- Statistics

Remember I said that each year of college is like three years of high school?

When you were a freshman in high school, could you do the work of a freshman in college?

Right now, you can't answer that because you aren't there yet and also by the time you get there it will have been three years or more.

In college, it will be as if you skipped those three years and jumped ahead, hitting a brick wall. Your level of coursework difficulty will triple, or at least the time to do it will triple, unless you prepare yourself after thoroughly learning the courses I mentioned above.

 

[whatamievendoing]

While it seems doable I share a concern with WWGD about your self-proclaimed introversion. Your plan just reinforces that behavior. You should be trying to overcome it, especially in this day when networking is so vital for one's professional satisfaction and success. Living with others will greatly help. Also to quote you, " I do not think money would be a huge issue, as I could always take out a loan, so really my only issue would be with time." and if time is the issue then your ADHD is problematic. As with all new experiences, there are unintended consequences that might impact your educational plans. Engineering is a good profession. Go with your strength, your academic prowess, try for scholarships, even a small one since you are niggling about $5K/year. After you graduate and get your dream job I expect you will say "What was I thinking". I know I have said that about a decision I made in grad school even though I thought I had only one choice. I also find it hard to believe your parents think this is a good idea.

The ADHD will definitely be a huge setback, for sure. I love nature, especially the mountains. This fact is the entire reason I would like to pursue this project. I would be about 30 minutes from my favorite state park, I could go hiking, just live in the moment. I would have a designated work station for my academics and later on, my work area (I plan on getting a remote job). I have always loved the thought of being able to go wherever I want and live my life to the fullest, whether that be in the mountains, or going home and seeing my family for a weekend. I am just imagining myself atop a mountain, me and my wife, crisp, cool air, surrounded by trees, overlooking a great big lake. Or I could even do my work with all of this in the background. I am never happier than when I am in the mountains. My parents have approved of my plan, not with “whatever makes you happy” but by openly embracing the idea. They love the thought of me gaining experience with building things, saving money, helping my grandma, and overall just doing what I love. I wouldn’t exactly call myself a complete moon loving, emo introvert, but if given the option, I usually prefer to work alone rather than in a group.

 

[whatamievendoing]

You're missing my point. The brick wall is due to the level of difficulty of junior year courses where they expect you to understand these math courses fully:

- Calculus Differential(I), Integral(II) and Multiple Variable(III) courses
- Linear Algebra
- Differential Equations
- Statistics

Remember I said that each year of college is like three years of high school?

When you were a freshman in high school, could you do the work of a freshman in college?

Right now, you can't answer that because you aren't there yet and also by the time you get there it will have been three years or more.

In college, it will be as if you skipped those three years and jumped ahead, hitting a brick wall. Your level of coursework difficulty will triple, or at least the time to do it will triple, unless you prepare yourself after thoroughly learning the courses I mentioned above.

Thank you for the clarification. I will keep all of this in mind.

 

[gleem]

I usually prefer to work alone rather than in a group.

I can appreciate that but, make this the last time you say it as it is now considered anathema, especially in industry. They want team players.

 

[jedishrfu]

That was my sentiment while in college, mainly because, being a commuter, I knew no one to talk to. I had one friend I could talk to when I could get ahold of him (pre-cell phone days). However, it was rare since I worked between 20 to 30 hours per week doing extra hours on the weekend when seasonal shopping was high.

There was one instance when the eight students in my EM theory class got together to divide up 50 questions the professor gave. He said he and his secretary would pick five from the list for our test. Yikes!

We all got together and divvied up the list, writing solutions and then making Xerox copies to share with the others. As it happened, I got the ones related to Special Relativity because of my interest in that topic.

On test day, we sat down to answer the questions. They were all pretty straightforward except the last two, which were the Special Relativity questions. I did well that day, perhaps better than I desired, all through working in a group and getting lucky.

But really, the group dynamic made a big job a lot shorter, and I wished I could have done it in other classes instead of going it alone. However, being a commuter with no presence on campus and no time due to work, I struggled beyond what other students did.

The one bright side was that I paid off my loans within six months of graduation, owing about $7.80 in interest charges because I asked a week too late to get a loan payoff number.

 

[berkeman]

Pretty sizable, my grandma has a mobile home, and it is pretty shady.

So if living/sleeping out of a van on your grandmother's property is an option, you might consider just buying a van that is already meant to be used for casual camping. One of my best friends when I started working as an EE in Silicon Valley was an avid rock climber who basically drove to Yosemite from Silicon Valley every weekend to climb. He had one of these Volkswagen Vanagon vans (I think a Westfalia):

Have you looked at purchasing a used camping van like these?

BTW, when I was in undergrad at UC Davis in Norcal I lived on-campus in the dorms the first 2 years, but for the last 2 years, I lived in off-campus apartments with roommates. So for those last 2 years, I commuted via bicycle to campus at similar distances to what you are planning. It was fine in good weather (but be sure to use lights when riding in the dawn/dusk/dark), but required pretty extensive rain gear during the rainy months. I don't know if you have snow at Clemson, but that would add another dimension.

EDIT/ADD -- Even if your grandmother situation is a bit dicey, does she have any utility hookups that you can share? Mostly I'm wondering if she has cable service and a cable modem. If she does, you might be able to connect to her WiFi if your van is not parked too far away.

 

[WWGD]

So if living/sleeping out of a van on your grandmother's property is an option, you might consider just buying a van that is already meant to be used for casual camping. One of my best friends when I started working as an EE in Silicon Valley was an avid rock climber who basically drove to Yosemite from Silicon Valley every weekend to climb. He had one of these Volkswagen Vanagon vans (I think a Westfalia):

View attachment 350517

Have you looked at purchasing a used camping van like these?

BTW, when I was in undergrad at UC Davis in Norcal I lived on-campus in the dorms the first 2 years, but for the last 2 years, I lived in off-campus apartments with roommates. So for those last 2 years, I commuted via bicycle to campus at similar distances to what you are planning. It was fine in good weather (but be sure to use lights when riding in the dawn/dusk/dark), but required pretty extensive rain gear during the rainy months. I don't know if you have snow at Clemson, but that would add another dimension.

EDIT/ADD -- Even if your grandmother situation is a bit dicey, does she have any utility hookups that you can share? Mostly I'm wondering if she has cable service and a cable modem. If she does, you might be able to connect to her WiFi if your van is not parked too far away.

Some today include TV, fridge, etc. Gives new meaning to sleeping in your car/van.

 

[Vanadium 50]

Let's not get caught up in the vanfasty.

Housing is $8200/year. $33K for 4 years.

The cheapest van with a bath sold by Winnebago is $180K, of which $40K is the chassis. The nest one can hope for is $20K for a used chassis, $13K for the hardware (bed, fridge, toilet, sink. etc.) and the rest labor. That would just barely break even.

That leaves, at best, $127K in labor. Assuming the Winnebago workers get $50/hour, that's 2500+ hours. That is over 15 months of full-time work: 8 hours a day, while the OP is taking classes.

If instead the OP got a job, even ay a McDonalds, and earned $12-13/hour for the same time period, he will have made enough for housing. And these are the most favorable numbers possible for living out of a van - anything more realistic will tilt things even more towards living in the dorms.

 

[berkeman]

Let's not get caught up in the vanfasty.

Housing is $8200/year. $33K for 4 years.

The cheapest van with a bath sold by Winnebago is $180K, of which $40K is the chassis. The nest one can hope for is $20K for a used chassis, $13K for the hardware (bed, fridge, toilet, sink. etc.) and the rest labor. That would just barely break even.

Used Vanagons are about $20k. Shower at the campus gym (or sneak into the coed dorms (that's where I lived my first 2 years)).

Spoiler

I don't know if they have Coed dorms in the midwest. UC Davis is in Cali.

 

[Vanadium 50]

A Vanagon has no bathroom. If you're going to live somewhere where you need to sneak into a bathroom, why not go all the way and pitch a tent?

 

[berkeman]

https://www.smartservice.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/08/porta-potty.png

 

[WWGD]

Used Vanagons are about $20k. Shower at the campus gym (or sneak into the coed dorms (that's where I lived my first 2 years)).

Spoiler

I don't know if they have Coed dorms in the midwest. UC Davis is in Cali.

Clemson is in one of the Carolinas.

 

[berkeman]

Clemson is in one of the Carolinas.

Is that a good thing or a bad thing? I'm kind of geography challenged.

 

[WWGD]

Is that a good thing or a bad thing? I'm kind of geography challenged.

Weather is relatively mild, winters aren't too harsh.

 

[gleem]

@berkeman said "Even if your grandmother situation is a bit dicey, does she have any utility hookups that you can share?" I hope so since you do not want to deal with propane for heating and cooking. I've looked up the livable space for a van that you might convert and it is about 10 ft long, 5.7 ft wide, and maybe 6.5 ft high, 57 sq ft of floor space. of which about 14 sq feet for the toilet (Ok skip the shower and and save 6 sq ft using the Uni's gym),12 sq ft for the bed, 2.5 sq for the fridge 2.5 sq ft for the stove, 7 sq ft for the sink/counter, 15 sq ft for the isle, and 4 sq ft for a work/study area. Guests? good luck. And then there are regs for campers to make them legal. Try living in a space smaller than half as big as a normal bedroom. I see insulation as a problem so just crank up the environment system. This will be a challenge for the most organized OCD person.

 

[WWGD]

Maybe a Tinyhouse would be better? Not sure about the pricing.

 

[Muu9]

AP Physics 1 and 2 are no good for engineering, if you want credit you will need to take physics C which requires calculus as a corequisite.

Look here at the curriculum flow chart and see which classes you can knock out via APs (e.g. AP Chem junior year instead of AP Physics 1/2 in order to get CH 1010 credit, or get a 5 in either AP English to get credit for ENGL 1030)

This would allow you to take some of the later math classes earlier, leaving your upper years less intense than they would be otherwise

 

[gmax137]

Let's not get caught up in the vanfasty.

I agree. The whole van thing is a distraction, who cares about the OP's living arrangement two years from now? The important things are to help the OP get into school and do well once he/she is there.

 

[whatamievendoing]

Let's not get caught up in the vanfasty.

Housing is $8200/year. $33K for 4 years.

The cheapest van with a bath sold by Winnebago is $180K, of which $40K is the chassis. The nest one can hope for is $20K for a used chassis, $13K for the hardware (bed, fridge, toilet, sink. etc.) and the rest labor. That would just barely break even.

That leaves, at best, $127K in labor. Assuming the Winnebago workers get $50/hour, that's 2500+ hours. That is over 15 months of full-time work: 8 hours a day, while the OP is taking classes.

If instead the OP got a job, even ay a McDonalds, and earned $12-13/hour for the same time period, he will have made enough for housing. And these are the most favorable numbers possible for living out of a van - anything more realistic will tilt things even more towards living in the dorms.

I was hoping to save up around 40 grand, do the conversion myself, and I would have solar and an induction cooktop. I do see how it could be detrimental to convert the van, and if you take out all of the expenses of room and board, I would barely break even. I still think that this project would allow me to gain plenty of experience, travel whilst still being able to get my degree, and overall I feel it would be good for my mental health. Another option I was considering would be to buy a smaller car and a teardrop trailer, that way I could still provide myself with the getaway to nature which i so desire.

 

[Vanadium 50]

If you think you will barely break even, you won't. Everything costs more than planned. Don't take my word for it - ask anyone who has remodeled their kitchen. And remember, your plan is to do this for 20% of what it would cost you to buy this outright.

You want to travel the country in a van? Fine. You want to get an engineering degree? Fine. You want to do them both at the same time? Not going to happen.

You want to take on a full-time project at the same time as a full-time engineering degree? Not going to happen either. (And the person who says you can is not an engineer)

 

[phinds]

I still think that this project would allow me to gain plenty of experience,

Experience doing WHAT? Anything relevant to your degree pursuit?

 

[whatamievendoing]

Experience doing WHAT? Anything relevant to your degree pursuit?

I would learn how to wire my own electricity, I would learn how to route plumbing lines, I would learn to woodwork, weld, insulate, and control climate. All of these things would be applicable to my mechanical engineering/aerospace major.

 

[whatamievendoing]

If you think you will barely break even, you won't. Everything costs more than planned. Don't take my word for it - ask anyone who has remodeled their kitchen. And remember, your plan is to do this for 20% of what it would cost you to buy this outright.

You want to travel the country in a van? Fine. You want to get an engineering degree? Fine. You want to do them both at the same time? Not going to happen.

You want to take on a full-time project at the same time as a full-time engineering degree? Not going to happen either. (And the person who says you can is not an engineer)

What about the 12 week college summers? Do you think I could possibly get it done if I were to set aside 14 hours a week during school and around 35 hours a week during the summer? Most vans require around 600-630 inexperienced hours and, after doing the math, i would have around 616 hours throughout the summer and school year. I do have a decent bit of experience in construction and woodworking, but none in electrics or plumbing, which could be setbacks.

My whole thing is that if I could set aside 2 hours a day (even on weekends) to work on the van during school, and 5-6 during the summer, I should have the van done in around the ballpark of 600 hours. During the school year, after doing the math to get 9 hours of sleep per day, 2 hours a day working on the van, and 10 hours a day studying (168-63-14-70) I am left with 21 hours to cook, eat, socialize, and do whatever I would like. This does seem relatively loose, all things considered. if I would like to go on hikes or go out with friends, all of this would fit into my relative timetable. If I’d like to take a day trip to explore the state parks, I would at least have roughly ten hours to do so. keeping in mind that this would include me doing the same thing every day, but after consulting others that graduated with my degree from the same university, they advised it would be closer to 12 hours of study per weekday, for 58 hours a week.

Edit: changed words around to make the math “add up” lol

 

[gmax137]

Maybe between now, and when you enter college, you can get a summer job working for someone who does van conversions. That would scratch your itch without interfering with your formal education. Once you start college, I recommend you focus on your classes. If you find you actually have extra time, then you can get a van or whatever strikes your fancy.

 

[CrysPhys]

The OP is obviously dead set on doing what they want to do. It appears to me that they posted here just to get validation of their plans. There's no point in all these posts trying to persuade them to do otherwise.

 

[gmax137]

The OP is obviously dead set on doing what they want to do.

Yes. But I wanted to do a lot of things when I was 15 that I had forgotten about by the time I was 17 or 18. Make of that what you will.

 

[CrysPhys]

Yes. But I wanted to do a lot of things when I was 15 that I had forgotten about by the time I was 17 or 18. Make of that what you will.

<<Emphasis added>> Simply "forgotten", correct? Not "logically persuaded by others to drop them when I asked whether they were good ideas or not". There's a significant difference.