- #106
marcus
Science Advisor
Gold Member
Dearly Missed
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jonmtkisco said:...
Keep in mind that galaxies which have any given Hubble recession rate from us now, had approximately the same recession relative to us in the very early universe. In early times, the self-gravity of the universe decelerated every galaxy pair's mutual recession rate; in late times, dark energy has reaccelerated them. But absent those two mostly mutually-offsetting accelerations, generally speaking relative to us, every galaxy would retain the same recession velocity now that it had in the very early universe...
What you said seems clearly wrong. It is wrong for z = 7 in as much as 3 is different from 2 (3c is not approximately the same as 2c) and it is wrong for z = 1089 inasmuch as 57 is different from 3.
And it will get more extremely wrong the farther back in time we go. I can see this intuitively without using a calculator. I suggested that you use the calculator as a way of getting some experience---I still think it would do you good.
The reason what you say is wrong and gets more wrong as you go back in time is that your argument has a flaw. When you say "those two mostly mutually-offsetting accelerations" you are talking about gravity versus dark energy and they are NOT mutually offsetting in the early universe. The farther back in the early universe you go, the more dominant is the effect of gravity.
So the influences of dark energy and gravity are not at all mutually offsetting if you go back a ways. If you think going back further will make it better then you must have it backwards. You will just get wrong by more factors of ten---more orders of magnitude.
at z=7 it is 2 versus 3 which is at least the same order of magnitude
at z= 1100 it is off by an order of magnitude as 57 is different from 3
at z = 1000000 it is going to be off by even more orders of magnitude and so on.
Perhaps I'll just stop trying to explain this. You may find someone else to discuss it with.
Maybe you and I can discuss some other of you recent statements.